Strategy on Animated Staff

[Neosutra]

Seems to me from those SSs, WSs and damage interupted its casting, not silly Mijins.

But keep sending nins to their death, at least its funny to watch. Just dont replace a solid zerg DD with a nin (had a group replacing a kraken drk for a nin....).

And ya, those SSs say nothing about Mijin, except your LS is silly enough to blow itself up over superstition.

Mijin worked each and every time for us too, but hey keep telling insulting people for using a tactic that has worked for many people over and over. 5 stars.

Keep defending a strat that is unproven and has no basis besides some "loose" evidence on some arguable cases, and I will keep calling it for the bullshit it is. I have been to several weapon fights where it was interupted via damage/weapon/SC etc etc, and there is no way to tell just what interupted it. Was it players just hitting it? Was is SC? Was is WS? Was it someone dying? Just because you happen to throw a dozen people at it Mijin and there is a coincedence of an interupt, doesnt mean the interupt came from something else. Besides, I already said they can do what they like, but dont replace a solid melee DD with a nin on a fight like that, on the basis of such a loose premis.

What keeps an animated weapon's interest is massive amounts of damage. What interupts it is the same shit that interupts everything else in the game, just at a lower rate due to being higher lvl.

[Spekkio]

well, let me posit a test. the two possible theories here are that a.) it's being interrupted by melee damage and b.) that it's being interrupted due to the mijins. let's isolate the variable we want to test, the mijins. surely you don't intend to kill every relic on every run and several are easily accessible that are unlikely to be needed that regularly, such as the gun (i think it's the gun that's by DL.) which if it warped, meh, nobody would care. have 2 players, a ninja and a decoy who are willing to test this after a DL is over. have the decoy kite away the satelite weapons past the eye wall while the nin kites the gun. when the gun finally gets completely bored (find the text in the dat files for his "i'm done with you" quip.) double back on the gun and essplodey. if the warp fails, we have isolated and affirmed that the mijin has a distinct effect on the animated weapon's interest in warping. if the warp succeeds, the mijin is not the only mitigating factor in preventing a weapon from warping. just as an aside, do head butt, frypan, temporal shift, and any other blue magic stuns i can't think of have any tests done on them to verify if they can bar the weapon from warping?

also as a "i doubt this is possible, but what the hell, i'm bored at work thought." would it be possible through the use of magic hammer, aspir, or any other MP eroding technique to sap the MP completely out of a weapon in the very brief window before they warp/die? if this is possible, would a complete lack of MP prevent them from warping? it's clearly a spell that the mob casts, but since they're the only mob to cast the warp spell, it may be something totally unique, possibly set at 0 mp for them. in addition, i have no bloody clue how one would strip literally thousands and thousands of MP from the mob in that paltry time available, so i doubt it's an option, but i'm just trying to think outside the box. even if it is stupid and impractical.

[Teorem]

The idea of Mijin Gakure interrupting an animated weapon's Warp doesn't seem implausible at all. There is already an example of a NM in the game whose spellcasting can be interrupted without a melee hit, stunning weaponskill, or Stun (Golden-Tongued Culberry's Death).

Since we typically have at least one NIN during our Xarcabard runs, with Mijin Gakure being a portion of their damage when we clear animated weapons, I don't really see any reason for us not to give this at least a try for the sake of experimentation, if nothing else. The animated weapon will try to Warp away regardless of the numbers and damage we bring, so we don't need to compromise on that at all to observe whether it has an effect.

Though, it will be a while since we just got Izzy's fragment recently and no one else is really close yet in their upgrade to need another fragment.

[Neosutra]

Meh, if your bored we can do my sword

[Lordwafik]

Seems to me from those SSs, WSs and damage interupted its casting, not silly Mijins.

But keep sending nins to their death, at least its funny to watch. Just dont replace a solid zerg DD with a nin (had a group replacing a kraken drk for a nin....).

And ya, those SSs say nothing about Mijin, except your LS is silly enough to blow itself up over superstition.

Mijin worked each and every time for us too, but hey keep telling insulting people for using a tactic that has worked for many people over and over. 5 stars.

Keep defending a strat that is unproven and has no basis besides some "loose" evidence on some arguable cases, and I will keep calling it for the bullshit it is. I have been to several weapon fights where it was interupted via damage/weapon/SC etc etc, and there is no way to tell just what interupted it. Was it players just hitting it? Was is SC? Was is WS? Was it someone dying? Just because you happen to throw a dozen people at it Mijin and there is a coincedence of an interupt, doesnt mean the interupt came from something else. Besides, I already said they can do what they like, but dont replace a solid melee DD with a nin on a fight like that, on the basis of such a loose premis.

Yes, and I have also been to many relic weapon fights too, I don't think it's just a coincedence that the weapons rarely got interrupted when casting normal spells such as silencega breakga curaga etc, except when casting warp, and only when a ninja mijinned (since we don't have anyone WS'ing during it). So despite all this, it's just coincedence? Every single time a ninja mijinned, it's just a coincedence that it's warp is interrupted?

What keeps an animated weapon's interest is massive amounts of damage. What interupts it is the same shit that interupts everything else in the game, just at a lower rate due to being higher lvl.

Who on earth is talking about keeping the weapon's interest? We're talking about interrupting warp. After a mijin, it'll try to warp again, after that mijin, it will try to warp again. We did this when fighting relic shield, and relic katana (we only lost to relic katana on the same run as shield because we ran out of mijins).

Hope you're not confusing spell interrupt argument with weapon keeping interest argument. All the way through the mijins, the weapon is telling you how it's sick and tired of you.

[Neosutra]

"You" dont think there is a coincedence. Thats fine, keep it up. But I stick with the premis that trading a serious melee DoT for a nin Mijin is fucking retarded.

And perhaps they get interupted in warping more because they have lower enhancing mages (lol that was a joke, but who knows).

[Seditedi]

Depends on what jobs the NIN has imo.
If you are trading a DRK for a NIN then thats utterly retarded.

[tymora]

and you say you're done with BLM

Never said that.

I'll give Mijin a shot next attempt and post how it goes. Hopefully the ninjas can get the timing right.

[Lordwafik]

"You" dont think there is a coincedence. Thats fine, keep it up. But I stick with the premis that trading a serious melee DoT for a nin Mijin is fucking retarded.

Trading who with what again? Where'd I say anything about that? We don't have a zerg shell or even many drks, the nins come on nin to be nins for the whole run from start to finish, they're not swapping out from coming as a DD for coming as a NIN, we don't strategically plan bringing NIN to Xarc for weapons over a DRK, we bring them for farming - and we'll have 2-3 who'll show up, and we'll tell them to not mijin /if/ we're fighting a weapon. (Because it works!)

We kill our weapons using mijins to interrupt warps and prolong the fight. If it's not mijin itself that's interrupting, and in fact a by-product of mijin causing us to exploit it, so be it, I don't care, because It hasn't failed us to date.



Anyway, argument leading nowhere.

We believe it works, we gave screens to argue our points as well as provide multiple testimonials in claims of it working. You provided nothing but "I don't believe you" or "This is stupid" etc.

I argued my points, you argued yours, and my conclusion is :

I don't care. Enjoy. Me and my multiple fragments we've gotten over the years tell me I'm right

[Seditedi]

and you say you're done with BLM

Never said that.

I'll give Mijin a shot next attempt and post how it goes. Hopefully the ninjas can get the timing right.

lol?

You definitely said:

As for why, let's just say I am a career BLM and there is nothing much left for me as a BLM to upgrade.

Sounds like "I'm done with BLM" to me.

[tymora]

There is no "done" in there. Don't put words in my mouth or happily extrapolate other people's meaning. If you interpret it that way, so be it.

[Wizerd]

I've never actually seen the interrupt message when we Mijin'd our way through Animated Weapons. I could swear up and down that it simply stops casting it (like when someone runs out of range). Filters don't take out the interrupt message do they?

Anyway, it doesn't matter what you believe Neosutra; Mijin works for NAs, it works for JPs, and it creates relics, so we'll continue using it. When we do Xarcabard, we always have at least 2 NINs main calling/tanking, because PLDs are meh, so we'll always have Mijins ready.

Sometimes we go kill Animated weapons after DL because we have our fighting force changed jobs group there, and in those cases we kill so fast we don't need Mijin or 2Hs, lol.

[Neosutra]

I've never actually seen the interrupt message when we Mijin'd our way through Animated Weapons. I could swear up and down that it simply stops casting it (like when someone runs out of range). Filters don't take out the interrupt message do they?

Anyway, it doesn't matter what you believe Neosutra; Mijin works for NAs, it works for JPs, and it creates relics, so we'll continue using it. When we do Xarcabard, we always have at least 2 NINs main calling/tanking, because PLDs are meh, so we'll always have Mijins ready.

Sometimes we go kill Animated weapons after DL because we have our fighting force changed jobs group there, and in those cases we kill so fast we don't need Mijin or 2Hs, lol.

And as I said, go for it if it floats your boat, but that doesnt change the fact that the evidence is annidotal at best. I even said, if you have nins laying around, fuck it, blow them up lol. Its not like they are going to do alot of damage in any other way in a zerg fight. My premis was that if you have the choice to bring them -any- other good DD job, do that. Because the Mijin theory is still VERY loose, and only based on the evidence that the weapons sometimes happen to get interupted occasionally when you Mijin, when 100 other things are going on in every one of those SSs, and when a hundred other LSs kill them just fine w/o Mijin.

[Seditedi]

There is no "done" in there. Don't put words in my mouth or happily extrapolate other people's meaning. If you interpret it that way, so be it.

So I guess what you're saying is that your Diamond Ring/Cunning Earring/Rainbow Cape wearing BLM is getting a relic.

edit: There is nothing left for me to upgrade on BLM means just that. It means you are done with gear for BLM lol It's not extrapolating any hidden meaning from it or putting words in your mouth, you said it.

[layoneil]

edit: There is nothing left for me to upgrade on BLM means just that. It means you are done with gear for BLM lol It's not extrapolating any hidden meaning from it or putting words in your mouth, you said it.

As for why, let's just say I am a career BLM and there is nothing much left for me as a BLM to upgrade.

you're awesome if not for the part of being a dimwitted dumbass that can't read (and i'm in no way supporting the upgrade of a Claustrum).

paraphrasing people to make them say something they didn't piss me the hell off.

[Kainstryder]

You're never done upgrading a job until you have HQ everything, every piece possible that'll enhance a spell, whatever. Upgrading a relic, let alone a Claustrum, while ignoring your other gear first is not only ridiculously stupid, but a massive waste of time that could've been spent better equipping yourself and benefiting your LS. Claustrum will do NOTHING for your BLM that morrigan, genie weskit, etc will do. Don't be stupid. By all means, if your BLM is actually finished, why not just level another job and get a relic? Why Claustrum? Why? Seriously, why?

The Mijin thing works, keep debunking it, cause it's like the WS can be Paralyzed thing, right? When my shell was doing Amanomurakumo, we went 1/3, due to the tachi warping. It was Alleya from BG that told me "Try using NINs for Mijin, it'll interrupt the warp" and it worked. Just because a tested method proves true doesn't mean you have to cry on everyone else's parade. Oh, right, there's no proven way this holds true. I guess myself, Wafik and others just got super lucky and interrupted the weapons with normal melee hits EVERY TIME. Winnar.

[Rocl]

so Sendoh, would you kill Animated Staff for me?

[layoneil]

so Sendoh, would you kill Animated Staff for me?

if you pay for that Xarc.

[Day]

Even if he said he was done upgrading, doesn't mean he's done playing his BLM.

Or am I missing something?

[Shadowrunner]

Shouldn't the whole Mijin thing be really easy to test? Just have a party of like.. 6 pop a weapon, have a NIN and a WHM (or two just in case of a death) start fighting it, and the moment you see it cast warp you blow up. If it interrupts, great... mystery debunked. If it doesn't, great.. mystery debunked.

Wonder if my LS would be up for it. Not like it's hard to get to some of them.

EDIT: Thinking back on it, you don't even need to engage it, it eventually warps if you're just standing there, and since JA's can be used outside of combat, it should be easy po peasy.