US Senate votes to give Telecom Companies Immunity

[Olo401]

Let me address this reply point for point..

Not at all. For someone to suggest that the phone company is going to steal your identity is absurd.

It doesn't necessarily have to be the phone company; it could be an employee with malicious intent. And even if such a person existed, did something, and was caught, have you ever experienced or heard about the absolute nightmare that is trying to repair damage to your credit caused by identity theft (again, thank financial corporations for really giving a shit about normal people).

They're also assuming that these telecom companies have information on everyone. If that's the case, it would take ages for them to filter through all of this supposed information they have.

Cmon now.. we're a part of the Internet generation here. We watch search engines like Google and Yahoo filter through millions of webpages on a daily basis looking for specific information, and then they rank it. The kind of programs the government would use to filter through all the information they get would take a few minutes at most.

The government is obviously looking for specific leads. Your identity and your business ideas are safe.

Again that's not the point. They shouldn't be looking at my private emails, listening to my phone calls, or intercepting my text messages without a warrant. Especially when it doesn't leave the country. PERIOD.

[Koyangi]

It's the complacent and apathetic attitudes just like this, that's going to allow this 'slowly chipping away of our rights' to continue to happen, until we have none left. We are very slowly getting towards a totalitarian state with all of this shit, you're blind if you can't see it happening already.

Okay. Tell me what you've done lately to put an end to this "slowly chipping away of our rights'?

Don't change the subject to what me, 1 single person can do about this, it's pretty obvious I'd have negligible impact on this issue. Apathy in great numbers is what's allowing this to happen, I'm not among them.

[Norelco]

Its already obvious there are two sides to this debate: the people who have fallen for the fear based propaganda of terrorism and the people who think the government is out to get them at every turn based off of internet information posted on politically paranoid websites.

Fixed.

[Olo401]

I'm not presuming to know because I'm well aware the government doesn't tell us everything, and it's probably better off that way.

Did you just say 'I don't understand the subject matter.' in so many words, yet demand that the thread be locked because the you feel said subject matter is overposted?

Not at all. For someone to suggest that the phone company is going to steal your identity is absurd. They're also assuming that these telecom companies have information on everyone. If that's the case, it would take ages for them to filter through all of this supposed information they have. The government is obviously looking for specific leads. Your identity and your business ideas are safe.

And it's absurd to think that any waiters/waitresses would steal your credit card numbers when you hand them that little black folder to pay for your meal.

This is simple credit card fraud. There's thousands of cases like this daily.

Its already obvious there are two sides to this debate: the people who have fallen for the fear based propaganda of terrorism and the people who think the government is out to get them at every turn based off of internet information posted on politically paranoid websites.

Fixed.

Twisting others words doesn't score you any points. In any case, the third side you left out are people who actually give a damn about their privacy and don't want the fucking government or anyone else sticking their nose into it unless they have good reason or permission.

[Norelco]

It's the complacent and apathetic attitudes just like this, that's going to allow this 'slowly chipping away of our rights' to continue to happen, until we have none left. We are very slowly getting towards a totalitarian state with all of this shit, you're blind if you can't see it happening already.

Okay. Tell me what you've done lately to put an end to this "slowly chipping away of our rights'?

Don't change the subject to what me, 1 single person can do about this, it's pretty obvious I'd have neglible impact on this issue. Apathy in great numbers is what's allowing this to happen, I'm not among them.

Your bitching about your "privacy" and your "rights" on an internet forum is equally ineffective against this perceived threat as is complacency and apathy. Stop kidding yourself.

[aurik]

Approval of the amendment would have exposed the companies to privacy lawsuits for helping the administration monitor the calls of suspected terrorists without warrants from a special court following the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.


The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.


The lads in congress need to learn that you can't legislate away constitutional amendments.

[sunb1ind]

Its already obvious there are two sides to this debate: the people who have fallen for the fear based propaganda of terrorism and the people who think the government is out to get them at every turn based off of internet information posted on politically paranoid websites.

Fixed.

Paranoia, Paranoia! Warning, Warning!

[Koyangi]

It's the complacent and apathetic attitudes just like this, that's going to allow this 'slowly chipping away of our rights' to continue to happen, until we have none left. We are very slowly getting towards a totalitarian state with all of this shit, you're blind if you can't see it happening already.

Okay. Tell me what you've done lately to put an end to this "slowly chipping away of our rights'?

Don't change the subject to what me, 1 single person can do about this, it's pretty obvious I'd have neglible impact on this issue. Apathy in great numbers is what's allowing this to happen, I'm not among them.

Your bitching about your "privacy" and your "rights" on an internet forum is equally ineffective against this perceived threat as is complacency and apathy. Stop kidding yourself.

I'm talking about blatant apathy of many people, outside of this forum, which is relevant. But I can get the idea from you, that you don't give a rats ass about the constitution and what this country was founded on if you're in supposed support of this shit.

[Norelco]

Again that's not the point. They shouldn't be looking at my private emails, listening to my phone calls, or intercepting my text messages without a warrant. Especially when it doesn't leave the country. PERIOD.

How do you know they are specifically looking at your emails? And why are you assuming that anything electronically sent is private? I don't recall the EULA for the Internet stating that my emails or anything else I did was considered to be as such.

And lol @ people like you for putting a "PERIOD" on an opnion.

[Gwynplaine]

make a subforum or a sticky where all the political bitching can go, so that these threads stop getting made daily. it's worse than all the anti-ps3 threads before the console wars sticky was made.

Maybe if the current government stopped creating obscene infringements upon our rights there wouldn't be more of these threads.

[Tricen]

Its already obvious there are two sides to this debate: the people who have fallen for the fear based propaganda of terrorism and the people who think the government is out to get them at every turn based off of internet information posted on politically paranoid websites.

Fixed.

Paranoia, paranoia
Everybody's comin' to get me
Just say you never met me
I'm runnin' underground with the moles
Diggin' big holes
Hear the voices in my head
I swear to God it sounds like they're snoring
But if you're bored then you're boring
The agony and the irony, they're killing me, whoa!

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And I'm so hot cause I'm in hell
I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And it's a sin to live this well

Fix'd for 90's.

[Demosthenes11]

quit saying the gov't is using fear to control us when a lot of you people are doing the exact same thing on the other side of the spectrum. It's tired already.

What Bush did is illegal. ok great, what do you people want a cookie? Nothing will happen out of it because congress really doesn't care. All this outrage you all have is 95% due to it just being bush. Clinton did this sort of thing and yet nobody cares/remembers/givesafuck. This arguement has been had so many times it's just pointless anymore.

And again, read the article. This isn't even about wiretapping -.-

[Olo401]

Again that's not the point. They shouldn't be looking at my private emails, listening to my phone calls, or intercepting my text messages without a warrant. Especially when it doesn't leave the country. PERIOD.

How do you know they are specifically looking at your emails? And why are you assuming that anything electronically sent is private? I don't recall the EULA for the Internet stating that my emails or anything else I did was considered to be as such.

And lol @ people like you for putting a "PERIOD" on an opnion.

The Fifth Amendment is not an opinion. Please, take a civics class and educate yourself on the Constitution.

[Ushallbeasgods]

Its already obvious there are two sides to this debate: the people who have fallen for the fear based propaganda of terrorism and the people who think the government is out to get them at every turn based off of internet information posted on politically paranoid websites.

Fixed.

Worse fix ever. You might be ok with your information being freely collected by companies and the government, I am not. While I understand the need for information when it comes to certain areas such as driver's license or tax collection I do not think they have any right to intercept my personal conversations, e-mail messages etc etc without a warrant. And a warrant would imply they have reasonable evidence to suspect I am doing something wrong.

I also notice the paranoia card is pulled out as a way to discredit the argument. Its really apples and oranges here. I see one thing, you see another. If your ok with this go sit in your corner and worry about if Britney Spears is getting rehab. Meanwhile I'll worry about the real issues.

I'm sorry if you can't understand that simple concept. Its not some grand government is out to get us theory. Simply put the US was built on individual rights and in the name of "security" your individual rights are one by one being taken away. I feel even more sorry for you if you sincerely believe that terrorism is a serious risk. If you actually believe that the US needs to be in "yellow" on that terrorism risk colour coded piece of shit all the time you get my sympathy.

And this isn't because of Bush. For me this is because I see my freedoms and privacy being taken away in small baby steps and I don't like it. God forbid I have an opinion though because it seems like people on the other side don't like that. I'm willing to accept that some people don't feel it is a threat.

[sunb1ind]

Again that's not the point. They shouldn't be looking at my private emails, listening to my phone calls, or intercepting my text messages without a warrant. Especially when it doesn't leave the country. PERIOD.

How do you know they are specifically looking at your emails? And why are you assuming that anything electronically sent is private? I don't recall the EULA for the Internet stating that my emails or anything else I did was considered to be as such.

And lol @ people like you for putting a "PERIOD" on an opnion.

The Fifth Amendment is not an opinion. Please, take a civics class and educate yourself on the Constitution.

Lol comedy gold in here.

[Demosthenes11]

Its already obvious there are two sides to this debate: the people who have fallen for the fear based propaganda of terrorism and the people who think the government is out to get them at every turn based off of internet information posted on politically paranoid websites.

Fixed.

Worse fix ever. You might be ok with your information being freely collected by companies and the government, I am not. While I understand the need for information when it comes to certain areas such as driver's license or tax collection I do not think they have any right to intercept my personal conversations, e-mail messages etc etc without a warrant. And a warrant would imply they have reasonable evidence to suspect I am doing something wrong.

I also notice the paranoia card is pulled out as a way to discredit the argument. Its really apples and oranges here. I see one thing, you see another. If your ok with this go sit in your corner and worry about if Britney Spears is getting rehab. Meanwhile I'll worry about the real issues.

I'm sorry if you can't understand that simple concept. Its not some grand government is out to get us theory. Simply put the US was built on individual rights and in the name of "security" your individual rights are one by one being taken away. I feel even more sorry for you if you sincerely believe that terrorism is a serious risk. If you actually believe that the US needs to be in "yellow" on that terrorism risk colour coded piece of shit all the time you get my sympathy.

And this isn't because of Bush. For me this is because I see my freedoms and privacy being taken away in small baby steps and I don't like it. God forbid I have an opinion though because it seems like people on the other side don't like that. I'm willing to accept that some people don't feel it is a threat.

Then I'm sure Clinton's trampling on rights and foreign policy equally pissed you off right?

[Charla]

What makes it even worse is that a third party - namely the telecom company - also has access to this information.

Actually a phone service provider doesn't record any of the content of a call unless specifically asked for a wiretap on a specific number or whatever. An ISP is a bit different, but my understanding of it is that only the IP addresses are recorded normally, mostly because the actual content of a packet-switched exchange is prohibitively difficult to piece back together on a large scale, and even harder if any form of encryption is involved.

Yeah, I'm about 20 posts late, whatever.

[Olo401]

Paranoia, paranoia
Everybody's comin' to get me
Just say you never met me
I'm runnin' underground with the moles
Diggin' big holes
Hear the voices in my head
I swear to God it sounds like they're snoring
But if you're bored then you're boring
The agony and the irony, they're killing me, whoa!

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And I'm so hot cause I'm in hell
I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And it's a sin to live this well

Fix'd for 90's.

Harvey Danger ftw.

Then I'm sure Clinton's trampling on rights and foreign policy equally pissed you off right?

Yes. There's a lotta shit Clinton did that's fucked up, not including getting hummers from fat chicks.

[Norelco]

I also notice the paranoia card is pulled out as a way to discredit the argument. Its really apples and oranges here. I see one thing, you see another. If your ok with this go sit in your corner and worry about if Britney Spears is getting rehab. Meanwhile I'll worry about the real issues.

LOL, you really can't be this dumb. You're doing the EXACT same thing by pulling out the "fear based propaganda" card. Are you for real?

[sunb1ind]

Clinton's a piece of shit too, but he didn't rewrite our 4th and 5th amendments. Sometimes you just gotta draw the line between a evildoer and the next Hitler