The AV Videos: READ THE -OP- AND THREAD BEFORE POSTING!

[fantasticdan]

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/7...jinspamgx1.jpg

AV readies lateral slash? Weird dat mod or weird glitch?

[Raistlinmajere]

The only other thing i have to add is a small possible alteration in theory. Perhaps, instead of it being JA's and WS's and such that cause AV to react, maybe it is simple having enmity above a certain number. Essentially, you provoke him enough (not the JA), and he'll get pissed and meteor your ass.

Nuking with lower tier nukes would enable BLMs to do a decent amount of damage without reaching large amounts of enmity. Just a random idea i thought of.

He could be just like Big Bomb where if you do over X damage, he grows bigger (or in this case, he 2 hour rapes your ally )

The only thing with this is that it wouldn't explain the said retaliation to things such as shield bash which don't do as much damage.

Because Shield Bash is still a Job Ability and people think they might trigger 2hour usage as well.

I was just saying if JA's and WS's weren't the case and instead it was *only* enmity or damage as wafik said

[idunno]

my current belief is that countering it's 2hrs with your own does not eliminate them just makes stuff weaker, the video of them surviving aeroaga 4 is probably b/c they weakened it enough for them to survive. same probably goes for meteor

[fat_kat]

yeah seemed to use lateral slash whenever he mijinned

also heres one more i forgot

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/3258/mshful4.jpg

[Kaylia]

Keep in mind they changed mobs behavior in sea ~129 times in the last 2 years. Maybe that could explain the move, unless he still have it

2 instances of Invincible > Benediction > Lateral Slash > Mijin Gakure

Arent both move almost instant? Doubt you would have much time to cancel bene once invincible is launched.

[Guitarman]

2 instances of Invincible > Benediction > Lateral Slash > Mijin Gakure

Does he always do this in this exact sequence? Because if you look in the se video, the very first 2hr that goes off by a player is invincible. Maybe you interrupt his chain of 2 hours by using the next one in his list?

[Lordwafik]

Notice in those screenshots, AV is "Ready"-ing every Two Hour.

Which makes them in fact, TP moves, and not 2 hours like we thoughts.


To AV. Not to us, to AV.

[fat_kat]

2 instances of Invincible > Benediction > Lateral Slash > Mijin Gakure

Does he always do this in this exact sequence? Because if you look in the se video, the very first 2hr that goes off by a player is invincible. Maybe you interrupt his chain of 2 hours by using the next one in his list?

yeah he always used the same combos, I can't remember what they all were but these were some

invinc > bene > mijin
mighty strikes > hundred fists
meikyo shisui > eagle eye shot * 3
chainspell > soul voice
chainspell > manafront ( and would do comet > comet > meteor most of the time as long as there were targets in range)
ummm also i think call wyvern( 6 of them) > familiar > astral flow(did nothing)

[Suiram]

2 instances of Invincible > Benediction > Lateral Slash > Mijin Gakure

Does he always do this in this exact sequence? Because if you look in the se video, the very first 2hr that goes off by a player is invincible. Maybe you interrupt his chain of 2 hours by using the next one in his list?

If by "always" you mean "always in bracelets form" then yes, it would seem so, although there's only I think 4(?) AV attempts ever that got bracelets mode. If by always you mean literally always, then no, AV doesn't even use 2Hs in conjunction like that until that form. I'm pretty sure our bracelets AV didn't have a lateral slash in the middle of his Inv > Bene > Mijin combo, but I'd have to find people who still have screenshots from the event to check.

Edit: Found SSs, and yeah didn't use lateral slash and didn't even ready the 2Hs like they did in the above LS's pic. They wouldn't have been filtered since you can see the wynavs readying their Mijins:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...y/img_0035.png

[Psion]

Hmm... so along the lines i was thinking of earlier, perhaps if he uses the two hour, it actually IS a 2 hour, and he cannot use it again. On the other hand, if you fook him up with a JA/WS/etc on him, he retaliates by readying a "2 hour". So if you see the 2 hour message without the Av readys the attack, then that means you wont see that 2 hour again unless you mess up, whereas if you DO see the readying part, it means something you did caused him to retaliate? (or visa versa) :elmer:

I dunno, it just seems odd that sometimes he readys the 2 hour and other times he doesnt. You see it a lot in those screenies above me, perhaps because they were using weaponskills? I dunno, just seems puzzling that theres no seeming consistancy to the readying message unless i'm blind.

[Guitarman]

If by "always" you mean "always in bracelets form" then yes, it would seem so, although there's only I think 4(?) AV attempts ever that got bracelets mode. If by always you mean literally always, then no, AV doesn't even use 2Hs in conjunction like that until that form. I'm pretty sure our bracelets AV didn't have a lateral slash in the middle of his Inv > Bene > Mijin combo, but I'd have to find people who still have screenshots from the event to check.

Hmm. Maybe interrupt his chain of 2hr with one from your ally depending on the mode hes in? Seems kind of overly complex though.

[Tempestwolf]

2 instances of Invincible > Benediction > Lateral Slash > Mijin Gakure

Does he always do this in this exact sequence? Because if you look in the se video, the very first 2hr that goes off by a player is invincible. Maybe you interrupt his chain of 2 hours by using the next one in his list?

yeah he always used the same combos, I can't remember what they all were but these were some

invinc > bene > mijin
mighty strikes > hundred fists
meikyo shisui > eagle eye shot * 3
chainspell > soul voice
chainspell > manafront ( and would do comet > comet > meteor most of the time as long as there were targets in range)
ummm also i think call wyvern( 6 of them) > familiar > astral flow(did nothing)

This must be it then, when they see the Two hour animation everyone pops their two hour, this seems to stop him from doing the next two hour in said sequence. I think there is also something to do with continualy nuking with the spells of the day (More then just his Regen) because in their video the explicitly show Thunder IV > Thunder I > Thunder I > Thunder IV and the second a bliz went off it did a TP move. Having watching watched the video many times now every WS creates the automatic retaliation of a two hour also. ( I know this has been stated so has the nuking but I want to put it together in ONE post for people to try out / debunk)

So, from what we have seen at this time I would submit that the best course of action is to stay low on WS's, stay heavy on nuking of the same day, even if little and constantly rotate in people with the correct two hours to prevent the two hour sequence, I.E lot's of WHM's for after invincible, SMN's for when he has Wynav's out for Astral Flow, BRD's for Soul Voice (If you really care) and BLM's for Manafont. Also upon analyzing their gear choices in the video I have an explanation for the E staff / Koenig on PLD's, not so much the hp but w/ Koenig and E staff on PLD's are not much thread while charmed, if any. And if you watch the video after AV uses Soul Voice they have their melee's move in and start hitting as one PLD begins to wiff against a DRK.

Those are just a couple humble thoughts, take them as you will and let me know what you think :D
Thanks for taking the time to read / go over / review / debunk / give a damn in advance. (If in fact anyone does lolmypostcount ;

[Lasareth]

Hmm... so along the lines i was thinking of earlier, perhaps if he uses the two hour, it actually IS a 2 hour, and he cannot use it again.

If that's the case, then that means he could have access to 2 sets of 2hours, one which he can only exhaust once and one which he can use when he has TP for it along with other possible factors. Which means that most of the testing here wouldn't have indicated whether or not those TP-based 2hrs were actually stopped or not.

I don't remember seeing any sequences of events where he'd spam a 2hr twice without readying the second one, but my memory is crap and I can't find the screenshots. If this was the case you'd still have to go through all the 2hrs, but only once, if you could prevent him from using the TP-based 2hrs somehow.

[Suiram]

This must be it then, when they see the Two hour animation everyone pops their two hour, this seems to stop him from doing the next two hour in said sequence.

Not sure where you're getting that when they only time they show people popping their 2Hs are circumstances where he wouldn't be using them in sequence to begin with.

[Tempestwolf]

This must be it then, when they see the Two hour animation everyone pops their two hour, this seems to stop him from doing the next two hour in said sequence.

Not sure where you're getting that when they only time they show people popping their 2Hs are circumstances where he wouldn't be using them in sequence to begin with.

Perhaps doing it then will prevent it from later and is why they never bothered to show the log @ the end?

[Lordender]

Indeed very odd that AV will alternate between "Readies a 2hr" and "Uses a 2hr" I noticed in the SE video like many other people did when AV "readies Chainspell" but whats more odd is the fact that it also "uses chainspell" before the first aero V went off after.

Now if we can figure out what exactly causes it to use a 2hr normally or use it like a tp move.

[Suiram]

Indeed very odd that AV will alternate between "Readies a 2hr" and "Uses a 2hr" I noticed in the SE video like many other people did when AV "readies Chainspell" but whats more odd is the fact that it also "uses chainspell" before the first aero V went off after.

Now if we can figure out what exactly causes it to use a 2hr normally or use it like a tp move.

Looking at the screenshots from this page, it actually could be the "cast with the day of the week" that causes him to ready them.

[Tempestwolf]

Indeed very odd that AV will alternate between "Readies a 2hr" and "Uses a 2hr" I noticed in the SE video like many other people did when AV "readies Chainspell" but whats more odd is the fact that it also "uses chainspell" before the first aero V went off after.

Now if we can figure out what exactly causes it to use a 2hr normally or use it like a tp move.

That could be an effect from using nukes in accordance to the day?
Edit
^ Damn you!!! lol

[Suiram]

Well I say that because, LimitBreak's screenshots were taken on Lightningsday, and although only one cast is depicted and it's blizzaga, knowing BLMs 9 times out of 10 they cast thunder spells, particularly on lightningsday. Compare to the screenshot I found from our attempt, based on the -ga damage to the wyverns it appears to be earthday, and I don't think anyone was casting earth spells.

[Lasareth]

Indeed very odd that AV will alternate between "Readies a 2hr" and "Uses a 2hr" I noticed in the SE video like many other people did when AV "readies Chainspell" but whats more odd is the fact that it also "uses chainspell" before the first aero V went off after.

Now if we can figure out what exactly causes it to use a 2hr normally or use it like a tp move.

Looking at the screenshots from this page, it actually could be the "cast with the day of the week" that causes him to ready them.

Or it could just be that they TPed it with spells.

What's the point of causing it to "ready" moves instead of insta-using them? It can't be stunned so what you'd be saying is that SE did something that caused a 2hr to go into TP based form, which is silly since you end up with the same result.

If you wanted to figure out what was causing the tp based 2hrs, if that's what they are, you'd have to go through everything that's already been tried out in the thread because from what it looks like, people saw the normal 2hrs and assumed that was the end of the test. There's tons of reasons why it "could be" caused by something and they'll probably all need to be tried out again if it's really the TP moves we're trying to stop.