Absolute Virtue & You: A Learning Experience

[AsuraSoup]

Just to make sure I get this right.

You're saying you don't stop or block AV's 2h's using your 2h's. You reset the time to his next 2h from the time at wich your 2h is used.

If that's correct, an easy way to test this would be to setup a 2h order, and every min once the fight starts, have 1 person with hate pop their 2h. If AV doesn't 2h in the next 50-60sec, have someone else pop their 2h, repeat.

Great info.

[Maytag]

So Breathing, basically what you are suggesting is that when any player uses a 2-hour, it resets AV's 2-hour timer?

This is an interesting theory, and I think it's really worth testing. Even though it doesn't seem to totally jive with what the devs are doing in the video, I thought about it from the perspective of the devs and tried to think how they would show us this method, if it were true. It would be impossible for them to show it within a couple of short clips... so they very well might just spam 2-hours, simply in order to stress that 2-hours have an important effect on him, and then leave the rest up to us. That certainly fits with thier style of doing things, and the video overall.

It's also very easy to test, and can easily be debunked right away. It would only take a three or four 2-hours to fully debunk this theory, saving the rest of the alliances' 2-hours for testing other theories. But who knows... maybe "debunking" won't be the result. It could actually turn out to be correct. (I wouldn't get your hopes up too much, though.)

[Breathing]

Wasn't the PLD frapsing this Video use Invicible exactly here? Or was it the 2nd Invincible?

It seems so, yes.

[20:27:43]Reposado uses Invincible.
Followed by
[20:28:58]Absolute Virtue uses Chainspell.

Making a time difference of 1:15.

Fairly close to the 1:20 mark.

You're saying you don't stop or block AV's 2h's using your 2h's. You reset the time to his next 2h from the time at wich your 2h is used.

Yes, thats what I'm proposing, and so far it *seems* to be the case.

If it is true and you can use call wyvern as a 2hr you could have a dragoon sitting there calling his wyvern and dismissing it to keep 2 hours locked indefinetely. ^^

edit:

14:42 - 16:15 = 3,68 earth minutes

Quote:
3. Iceday 16:14, 100 Fists (from French Video, part 2)
player 2hrs used: blm, brd, blm, brd, smn, rdm


This is where theory fails first time...

I'm sorry, it seems you might be misunderstanding what I'm saying, I'm not saying each two hour used will add 1:20 it's that each time a two hour is used the timer is reset. So using multiple two hours all at the same time will have no real effect other than to reset AV's next two-hour timer to the current time + 1:20

[AsuraSoup]

If this is correct, you'll have roughly 18min to kill AV.

How much HP does AV have?

If it is true and you can use call wyvern as a 2hr you could have a dragoon sitting there calling his wyvern and dismissing it to keep 2 hours locked indefinetely. ^^

DRG's everywhere are on the edge of their seats...

[Kuuhalee]

You're saying you don't stop or block AV's 2h's using your 2h's. You reset the time to his next 2h from the time at wich your 2h is used.

Yes, thats what I'm proposing, and so far it *seems* to be the case.

If it is true and you can use call wyvern as a 2hr you could have a dragoon sitting there calling his wyvern and dismissing it to keep 2 hours locked indefinetely. ^^

You can check LB/BBQ attempt number eight. We used teams of three people each to 'counter' any of Absolute Virtue's two-hours. We were able to make it to team number four before completely wiping, I believe.

[Seditedi]

It took the Dev team alot longer than 18 minutes.
Rumored to be around 100k HP.
You could swap in new players to increase the duration if this is in fact true, but still on average most LSes would have about 25 people or so.

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Now playing: Opeth - The Drapery Falls

[Velocy]

Hmm... I ninja edited my last post... doesn't fit to the SE Videos...

So, but what I definitly see out of your investigation.
All instant 2HRs are less then one minute until next 2 HR (except once). All 2HRs that can wear off are 1:15 or higher.

I consider Astral Flow as Instant 2HR as it's completly different then a SMNs 2HR.

[Elipse]

I was talking about magic damage down sets with someone from here in PM's. If you want to best and most easily survive chainspell you'll want something like this:

6 tanks. In other words make 2 tank parties and have all of them in range.
Since there are more tanks, hate can be shared around between them. Whoevers getting hit will be cured by one of the other tanks etc. So you don't need to be in a full hp/enmity set up all the time.

Each tank should have a -25% magic damage set. This is easy to put together with the new polearm, look at wiki if you need a list of the gear.

2 Whms (one for each tank party) need Shell V, capped barspells for 10MDB and a Blessed Briault (5 more MDB to barspells).

Between the magic damage down set and the whm barspell/shell V you will have nearly -65% magic damage.

So lets work all this out roughly (yes this is not 100% correct but it will be very close).

Now lets plug this in and see what we get:

-Ga damage reduction based on number of targets:

T = Number of Targets

For 2-9 people
DMG = 0.9 - 0.05*T

For 10+ people
DMG = 0.4

Base damage for Aeroga V is 2000. So lets work it out.

0.9 - 0.05*6 (6 tanks) = 0.6

2000 * 0.6 = 1200dmg

That 1200dmg will be the damage each tank will take before the -65% magic reduction.

1200 * 0.35 = 420 damage a tank

(100% - 65% = 35%... I think you got it anwyay)

Now you can play with those numbers as you wish. Add more or less tanks to the situation. If you change anything like say add a Cor to your tank party for Magus roll (maybe another -10% magic damage?) you can reduce this more. For the most part each of those 6 PLD's can just cure themselves back up to full in between Aeroga V's.

Of course if you really want to get fancy you could have a rampart rotation during chainspell, every time -ga goes off, next person in line uses it. Also if you want to get fancy pants +1, you could get some rdm's with magic reduction sets, and have them cast stoneskin on themselves and just stand in range during Aeroga V, They'll barely take anything.

That might not be realistic for all shells to do, but it is for ours.. so..

K... so... Enjoy... /flamesuit mode on

[Breathing]

You can check LB/BBQ attempt number eight. We used teams of three people each to 'counter' any of Absolute Virtue's two-hours. We were able to make it to team number four before completely wiping, I believe.

Would you mind linking me to their attempts? I'll give them a look through for some counter-examples

Just to let you know Velocy I edited the above post to address your concerns.

[AsuraSoup]

It took the Dev team alot longer than 18 minutes.

If you didn't notice, the dev team was also spamming 2h's lol

[Kuuhalee]

You can check LB/BBQ attempt number eight. We used teams of three people each to 'counter' any of Absolute Virtue's two-hours. We were able to make it to team number four before completely wiping, I believe.

Would you mind linking me to their attempts? I'll give them a look through for some counter-examples

They're in my signature :O Unless you have signatures turned off for whatever reason.

[Seditedi]

It took the Dev team alot longer than 18 minutes.

If you didn't notice, the dev team was also spamming 2h's lol

I noticed, lol. If this is in fact how to kill AV it seems like there still has to be something more to it.

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Now playing: Soilwork - Martyr

[AsuraSoup]

It took the Dev team alot longer than 18 minutes.

If you didn't notice, the dev team was also spamming 2h's lol

I noticed, lol. If this is in fact how to kill AV it seems like there still has to be something more to it.

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Now playing: Soilwork - Martyr

Remember, this is only 100-79% we're working with, could be a whole other strat under 79%

[willriker]

well if this is true, and call wyvern is considered to have to effect as the other two hours youll have

initial 1:20
drg +1:20 =2:40
player2 +1:20 =4:00
player3 +1:20 =5:20
player4 +1:20 =6:40
player5 +1:20 =7:00
player6 +1:20 =8:20
player7 +1:20 =9:40
player8 +1:20 =10:00
player9 +1:20 =11:20
player10 +1:20 =12:40
player11 +1:20 =14:00
player12 +1:20 =15:20
player13 +1:20 =16:40
player14 +1:20 =18:00
player15 +1:20 =19:20
player16 +1:20 =20:40
drg +1:20 =22:00
player17 +1:20 =23:20
player18 +1:20 =24:40


this is asuming 1 drg in alliance, and an 18 man alliance, no swaping members, and 1 minute 20 seconds of time bought through using a 2 hour. somehow i dont think that is enough time for the av fight, even if you kill regen before putting this into action.

however this might just be enough time to get AV to 79%ish, then the arguement that he might behave differantly past this point gains some credibility

[Maytag]

I don't think we should discount a theory just because it would take an unrealistic amount of manpower.

We can infer from the dev team's actions that beating AV with an alliance of 18 probably *is* unrealistic, due to the fact that they had to cheat. I assume that the dev team *had* to cheat, because why else would they release a video in which they were specifically asked not to cheat, that contains cheating? I can think of no other explanation besides the fact that killing AV was too hard for them to accomplish without cheating, or perhaps precisely because it takes far more man-power than they could muster. (It also seems like they chopped the video up specifically to hide their cheating, but they did a pretty poor job I must say.)

[Valisk]

It took the Dev team alot longer than 18 minutes.

If you didn't notice, the dev team was also spamming 2h's lol

I noticed, lol. If this is in fact how to kill AV it seems like there still has to be something more to it.

Seems like this would be sufficent if this was all there was too it. The absolute virtue is what? Patience. This strat requires patience and careful planning for the entire fight, or 100-79% as AsuraSoup stated.

[Suiram]

I was talking about magic damage down sets with someone from here in PM's. If you want to best and most easily survive chainspell you'll want something like this:

6 tanks. In other words make 2 tank parties and have all of them in range.
Since there are more tanks, hate can be shared around between them. Whoevers getting hit will be cured by one of the other tanks etc. So you don't need to be in a full hp/enmity set up all the time.

While everything you wrote is more or less accurate, I don't see how it helps in chainspell. What you need is the fewest number of tanks so that the damage they take is survivable. For Demo LS the answer to that is 1 tank, and really since you should be able to hit 50% magic reduction without aegis it would be the same for any LS, but if you want to be safe I think 2 would be okay too. What you have to realize is that assuming that they can live through a single spell and be cured right away, the more tanks you add, the more healing is required. The amount of HP needed to cure N tanks with equal stats rises as N rises until you hit 10: 1 > 1.6 > 2.25 > 2.8 > 3.25 > 3.6, etc.

[Ferien]

well if this is true, and call wyvern is considered to have to effect as the other two hours youll have...etc

if you dismiss the rat at 100% you can call it back immediately

[Breathing]

Lol@me. Sorry Kuhalee, I just don't look at peoples signatures is my problem.

You don't happen to have text logs instead for the fight do you? It's a lot easier to look through and I can't really download the videos without it taking an awfully long time.

By the way to anyone that has time and inclination (and better bandwidth than me) could someone look at the video for demo fight 4. I must have stopped looking really pre-emptively at the logs for the fight as there are a few 2-hours in the logs following
[23:41:31]Absolute Virtue uses Blood Weapon.
but there is quite a large gap, no obvious player 2-hours and sometimes relatively few actions from AV.

I suspect the fact that a few tanks were defeated and AV was running all over the place and so some of the log (and a possible two hour by a player or AV might have been missed). If the theory is correct and no player two hours occurred AV should have two houred around [23:42:57] ish.

[Kuuhalee]

You don't happen to have text logs instead for the fight do you? It's a lot easier to look through and I can't really download the videos without it taking an awfully long time.

I don't, sorry. I'll record the chat log next time we try so there will be a transcript of the battle.