Colombia vs Venezuela vs Ecuador vs ???

[Kaylia]

Wiping a country off the map isnt that hard with the weapon we have today. Wiping it without pissing off other powerful country is the hard part.

[Takeno]

Well for one thing, paramilitary armies are still around. The union leaders are still ending up dead. There's still massive drug trade.

And how is this Uribe's fault?, all those things have been around for over 40 year. He has been fighting against them throughout his presidency. Because of Uribe, the drug trade has declined alot, Colombia is in the best economic position it ever has. Going to Colombia now is completely different than going 7 years ago when Pastrana was the president-there are constructions everywhere, the people have more money to spend, and pretty much everyone has a cellphone (a seemingly trivial fact to you is actually a huge thing in a 3rd world country). Thousands of members of FARC and paramilitaries have been reinstated into society and turned in their weapons. So I dont think you have any room to talk about the only president in Colombian history that has been reelected (maybe he's good? -.-)

The only thing Uribe has done was target FARC and make promises. The "official government" persons still have ties(family, business, etc) to the paramilitary drug lords. I just don't see where YOU see any improvements.

As I stated above, Uribe doesnt make promises, he acts. I have first-handedly experienced the change and progress the rule of Uribe has caused, and it is nothing a previous Colombian president has ever done. The fact that Uribe wants to protect his country from terrorist groups like FARC only make him an even more amazing individual who strives to improve his country in every way, shape or form.

Oh, and keep talking, I want to see how much misinformation you can throw at us.

[guartz]

Wow Takeno. Talk about a victim of propaganda.

I mean, WE are talking about the same Uribe, right?

The same Uribe who's father was wanted in United States for drug trafficking? The same Uribe who's waging war against FARC for killing his father? The same Uribe who issued pilots for Pablo Escobar's drug fleets when he was the Director of Aviation? The same fucking Uribe that disparaged his own countries supreme court for daring to launch an investigation that implicated his cousin with ties to paramilitary drug lords? I can keep going, because his shit doesn't end.

I just want to know, we are talking about the same Uribe?

[Takeno]

Wow Takeno. Talk about a victim of propaganda.

I mean, WE are talking about the same Uribe, right?

The same Uribe who's father was wanted in United States for drug trafficking? The same Uribe who's waging war against FARC for killing his father? The same Uribe who issued pilots for Pablo Escobar's drug fleets when he was the Director of Aviation? The same fucking Uribe that disparaged his own countries supreme court for daring to launch an investigation that implicated his cousin with ties to paramilitary drug lords? I can keep going, because his shit doesn't end.

I just want to know, we are talking about the same Uribe?

All that may or may not be true (would he be president if it all was proven true? Didnt think so either), but that doesnt have anything to do with Venezuela and Ecuador being bitches about an attack against armed forces against Colombia. Oh and just because FARC killed his father, doesnt mean its the only reason he is waging war against it.

Want a list of things FARC has done over the last 40 years? Here you go:
FARC rebels
• Have killed tens of thousands of Colombian citizens.
• Have off-trial executed hundreds of Colombian citizens.
• Have kidnapped thousands of Colombian citizens.
• Have attacked tens of towns in our country.
• Have performed tens of terrorist attacks to civilian targets.
• Have used high-power explosives to kill Colombian citizens in indiscriminate attacks.
• Have dynamited our oil pipelines.
• Have attacked national energy and roads infrastructure.
• Have planted thousands of anti-personnel landmines in rural areas of our country.
• Have used chemical substances such as ammonium nitrate to increase damage caused by its bombs.
• Have recruited hundreds of children for combat.
• Have attacked medical facilities, medical personnel and ambulances.
• Have produced displacement of more than 2 million of Colombians.
• Keep currently more than 700 kidnapped people, which they torture in Colombian forests.
• Have destroyed more than 98.000 acres of forest to seed coca and produce cocaine.
• Have trafficked hundreds of tons of cocaine.

[Kuya]

(would he be president if it all was proven true? Didnt think so either),

Your faith in him is disturbing.

[Takeno]

(would he be president if it all was proven true? Didnt think so either),

Your faith in him is disturbing.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

[Selamis]

(would he be president if it all was proven true? Didnt think so either),

Your faith in him is disturbing.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

That's only in America, and even then that is just by legal standards. Public opinion tends to follow the trend that a lot of European law follows, where you are guilty until proven innocent. (See also: Barry Bonds before he was actually indicted on purgury.)

Hell, take a look at our own president and the things he's gotten away with doing while in office "in the name of justice and security." Anyway, just read that Nicaragua has broken off all relations with Columbia....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080306/ap_ ... ZanUdvaA8F

The story continues.

[Takeno]

(would he be president if it all was proven true? Didnt think so either),

Your faith in him is disturbing.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

That's only in America, and even then that is just by legal standards. Public opinion tends to follow the trend that a lot of European law follows, where you are guilty until proven innocent. (See also: Barry Bonds before he was actually indicted on purgury.)

Hell, take a look at our own president and the things he's gotten away with doing while in office "in the name of justice and security." Anyway, just read that Nicaragua has broken off all relations with Columbia....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080306/ap_ ... ZanUdvaA8F

The story continues.

The socialist nations of South America breaking relations with Colombia. Colombia's actions may not have been correct, and some could argue that they are unjustifiable, but I just cant believe anybody would ever want to defend FARC...

[guartz]

Nobody is defending FARC. Not even Chavez.

Even through they started out as poor farmers defending themselves from drug lords. Even though most of their targets were drug traffickers and their families, FARC are by no means the
"good guys". And certainly not Uribe.

[Rhinox]

wait.. guartz you're siding with Chavez and Ecuador in this conflict? Knowing full well FARC is a terrorist group and there is some Evidence to suggest that they are backed by Venezuela? and your only reason is that Uribe father was a drug trafficker? also you claim that Columbia is "Baby Burner" bad. Can i see some of these sources you are getting this from? Are they a Corrupt government? maybe but in Latin america that is hardly a shocking proclamation.

Not saying FARC consists of innocent angels... but compared, they might be. At least(lol?) when farc attacks a village they only kill combatants, and not every man, woman and child.

You're really fucking retarded if you think they only kill Combatants. They kidnap anyone who will bring a sizable income through ransoms. It can be anyone from Low level police officers til Politicians or anyone with money really. Guess what happens if they dont pay up genius? they kill them. so before you start spewing retarded lines and trying to pass them off as facts read up on them a little bit more. they only reason they do not kill every man, women and child is because there is no monetary gain from doing so.

lol and you accused Takeno of being a victim of Propoganda.

my take on this situation is the US should stay the fuck away from this conflict.



Edit: i'm intrested Guartz on your take on Israel doing the same thing you cant be totally naive can you?

[Lee]

Except that U.S could wipe all three governments off the map without breaking a sweat.

Given our track record in Afghanistan and Iraq, its pretty silly to be still boasting that the US can 'wipe people off the map'. If anything this war has probably taught that mentality a thing a two.

We'll be too busy chasing terror into Iran to bother about what South Americas doing anyway, if some of these politicians have their way.

There's a difference between fighting Guerillas and fighting a National Army, one hides in towns and trees and shit, while the other is supposed to be wearing uniform and attacking in the open. If we had a war with any of their National Armies, you could bet that we would be having a MUCH easier time then we did in Vietnam, and now in Iraq/Afghanistan.

[guartz]

wait.. guartz you're siding with Chavez and Ecuador in this conflict? Knowing full well FARC is a terrorist group and there is some Evidence to suggest that they are backed by Venezuela? and your only reason is that Uribe father was a drug trafficker? also you claim that Columbia is "Baby Burner" bad. Can i see some of these sources you are getting this from? Are they a Corrupt government? maybe but in Latin america that is hardly a shocking proclamation.
You're really fucking retarded if you think they only kill Combatants. They kidnap anyone who will bring a sizable income through ransoms. It can be anyone from Low level police officers til Politicians or anyone with money really. Guess what happens if they dont pay up genius? they kill them. so before you start spewing retarded lines and trying to pass them off as facts read up on them a little bit more. they only reason they do not kill every man, women and child is because there is no monetary gain from doing so.

lol and you accused Takeno of being a victim of Propoganda.

my take on this situation is the US should stay the fuck away from this conflict.



Edit: i'm intrested Guartz on your take on Israel doing the same thing you cant be totally naive can you?

I recommend reading comprehension 101.

[Takeno]

wait.. guartz you're siding with Chavez and Ecuador in this conflict? Knowing full well FARC is a terrorist group and there is some Evidence to suggest that they are backed by Venezuela? and your only reason is that Uribe father was a drug trafficker? also you claim that Columbia is "Baby Burner" bad. Can i see some of these sources you are getting this from? Are they a Corrupt government? maybe but in Latin america that is hardly a shocking proclamation.
You're really fucking retarded if you think they only kill Combatants. They kidnap anyone who will bring a sizable income through ransoms. It can be anyone from Low level police officers til Politicians or anyone with money really. Guess what happens if they dont pay up genius? they kill them. so before you start spewing retarded lines and trying to pass them off as facts read up on them a little bit more. they only reason they do not kill every man, women and child is because there is no monetary gain from doing so.

lol and you accused Takeno of being a victim of Propoganda.

my take on this situation is the US should stay the fuck away from this conflict.

I still dont see any sources. and if you are thinking I'm a victim of propaganda then you are very wrong, I lived in Colombia for 13 years, my uncle was kidnapped by FARC and I first handedly experienced the atrocities they have committed. How does it feel to have weeks of energy surges because the douches bombed electrical towers? Yeah, shut up and bring some sources to the table before you comment on something you have little experience on.


Edit: i'm intrested Guartz on your take on Israel doing the same thing you cant be totally naive can you?

I recommend reading comprehension 101.

[evilbau]

Venezuela, Colombia make peace
Cross-border attack on rebels sparked crisis; second rebel leader slain

CARACAS, Venezuela - The presidents of Colombia, Ecuador and Venezuela agreed Friday to resolve their angry recriminations over a cross-border Colombian commando raid, a crisis that has brought troop movements and talk of war.

The uneasy neighbors joined in a declaration noting that Colombian President Alvaro Uribe apologized for the last weekend’s attack on a Colombian rebel base in Ecuadorean territory and that he pledged not to violate another nation’s sovereignty again.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23521758/

[guartz]

Now if somebody could do that to U.S, that would be great!

[evilbau]

I don't think this will turn into a full scale war, especially with the United States getting involved.