Scholar Discussion #3 (post March patch)

[FailureMidgard]

Current setups:

Base Damage:
Stave
BLS +1
Phantom Tathlum
SCH Mortarboard (Will be +1'd after Gown)
Elemental Torque/Uggalepih (Damn you Prudence)
Moldavite
Loquacious (Damn you Love)
Errant Houppelande
Viscious Mufflers (Damn you Salvage x2)
Omega Ring
Snow Ring
Prism Cape
Obi/Penitent's (Damn you Dynamis)
Mahatma Slops
Goliard Clogs

As you can see, I still have a bit to go to finishing my sets. Each part is slowly being rectified.

Why are you using an Omega Ring? That's a pure loss of damage...and it's a worse trade-off than Ixion (-2int, +3macc as opposed to -1int, +5macc). The other poster is also using an Omega (for the record, I use an Omega too, and even on non-HNMs, I have yet to see these "floored resists" that people talk about...I get resisted on all the ZNMs/etc). I think Ixion cloak is vastly underrated by people because there are things that you are close to acc capp (where the huge int loss on body may not be worth the skill gain), but adding the 5 macc for very little loss isn't that bad.

[The Blackrose]

Why are you using an Omega Ring? That's a pure loss of damage...and it's a worse trade-off than Ixion (-2int, +3macc as opposed to -1int, +5macc). The other poster is also using an Omega (for the record, I use an Omega too, and even on non-HNMs, I have yet to see these "floored resists" that people talk about...I get resisted on all the ZNMs/etc). I think Ixion cloak is vastly underrated by people because there are things that you are close to acc capp (where the huge int loss on body may not be worth the skill gain), but adding the 5 macc for very little loss isn't that bad.

Base set is for Flan camp, etc. ZNMs, etc usually meet the Resist setup. Gear varies based on target.

[Ultimagi]

Omega Ring is pimp, that's why. I'm not supporting either side of the Ixion Cloak argument, but I'll never get one since I wouldn't use it on White Mage, Black Mage, Red Mage, Bard, or Blue Mage.

[FailureMidgard]

Base set is for Flan camp, etc. ZNMs, etc usually meet the Resist setup. Gear varies based on target.

Yet, you'd do better switching to an Ixion + Snow, is my point. More MACC -and- more int. I've never once done Flans...when I merit, I do it on sam or brd in a melee burn group, my buffer is 100% from Brothers really...so yea, can't speak about that really...I guess if people use their resist sets on ZNMs, then I'd just argue that the only setup that matters is your resist setup, who cares, why optimize a set of gear around doing something that is already subpar exp? ;p

Omega Ring is pimp, that's why. I'm not supporting either side of the Ixion Cloak argument, but I'll never get one since I wouldn't use it on White Mage, Black Mage, Red Mage, Bard, or Blue Mage.

I agree, and I use an Omega Ring on my Sch and Brd...I'm just saying it's inconsistent to use it and say Ixion Cloak is bad. Also, not really relevant for the scholar forums, but Ixion cloak is definitely situationally good for brd.

[The Blackrose]

Yet, you'd do better switching to an Ixion + Snow, is my point. More MACC -and- more int. I've never once done Flans...when I merit, I do it on sam or brd in a melee burn group, my buffer is 100% from Brothers really...so yea, can't speak about that really...I guess if people use their resist sets on ZNMs, then I'd just argue that the only setup that matters is your resist setup, who cares, why optimize a set of gear around doing something that is already subpar exp? ;p

Because I like to crush the hopes and dreams of Black Mages with just tier 4s.

[minsk]

why optimize a set of gear around doing something that is already subpar exp? ;p

I wouldn't call the fastest solo exp in the game subpar -_-

[Eldelphia]

HQ Staves Bugard +1
AF Head (will +1 when tem Mats drop)
AF Body (will +1)
Goliard Hands
P Rope/Obis
Mahatma Slops
Prism/Merciful
Yigit Crackows/Goliard Clogs
Moldy/Magnetic/Phantom
Phantom tathlum
Elemental torque/Uggly (when I own it, I sell it periodically >.>)
Snow/Tamas

My gear isn't uber but pretty solid and I have ele/enf/enh merits with 8/8 MP and about to start work on INT.

Omega Ring is pimp, that's why. I'm not supporting either side of the Ixion Cloak argument, but I'll never get one since I wouldn't use it on White Mage, Black Mage, Red Mage, Bard, or Blue Mage.

This is part of the reason why I won't either. WHM has Nobles/Cleric's, BLM has Sorc coat, RDM is 67 >.>, BRD has relic hat and SMN YYR. Having gotten super lucky and landed argute coat, I don't see the need to payout.

[Meian]

...
Sublimation - FFXIclopedia - a Wikia Gaming wiki

3rd to last bulletpoint

"Equip / unequip Scholar's Mortarboard or Argute Gown while charging will affect the charge rate."

Meaning it won't stay the 4 mp per tic if you take them off...

[Ratatapa]

That'S not hard to understand and i agree with him, if you have a ixion cloak why not use it

While charging sublimation use gown + Af1 head

While Sub is full or waiting for the 30sec timer, use Ixion cloak WHILE idling

[jimbobsonofgod]

That'S not hard to understand and i agree with him, if you have a ixion cloak why not use it

While charging sublimation use gown + Af1 head

While Sub is full or waiting for the 30sec timer, use Ixion cloak WHILE idling

In an ideal world you should be using sublimation once its charged.
And 2.7 mil for 30 seconds well I'd rather just idle in something less costly with the same effect.

[Aemora]

When I got Argute Gown, I just copy & pasted my macro set to another book, and when I used Sublimation, it switches between books. When I'm in my normal set, I do everything that's doesn't involve Body/Head in Ix.Cloak, and my idle set has Ix.Cloak in it. When I'm in Sublimation mode, which changes me to another set of macros, I don't wear Ix.Cloak at all (cept for the odd spell here or there), and try to macro in either Sublimation item if not both on most of my spells, and idle in Af1/Af2 until Sublimation is complete. At which point, I tap my Sublimation macro, it changes me to my idle on me regular set, and I gain my MP.

Everything's a lot cheaper when you're in a HNMLS to get this shit, y'know.

[Epical]

Please keep the personal attacks out of this thread. If you want to talk about SCH then do so without the unneeded aggression.

[Shin Volcano]

In an ideal world you should be using sublimation once its charged.
And 2.7 mil for 30 seconds well I'd rather just idle in something less costly with the same effect.

In reality if your mp is already full or between 100-200 i wouldnt be using it the sublimation, the trick is to use it when you need the MP I.e when you are missing more then 260ish mp, it is expensive, i don't doubt that, as i stated tho i didn't pay for it, items are much better when you earn them. oterwise i won't ever spend 2.5 mil (that's how much they are here) on it. but it is SCHs ONLY refresh body as SE thought it would be a nice cruel laugh to not let the ONLY mage in the game not have a refresh AF peice, so it's entierly up to you, i personaly think it's worth...maybe 1 mil. they are quite common if you fight ixion reguraly, so they really shouldnt be THAT expensive. You use it smartly, not every 30 seconds. been in to many situations where i just ran out of mp and the claok gradually gives mp back when i end up kiting something as shit hits the fan, and kite long enough till i get enough MP back to do whatever it is i need to do to stop whatever is chasing me, Situatinal means, yes, but things like that is what makes it worth while,

[Ratatapa]

In an ideal world you should be using sublimation once its charged.
And 2.7 mil for 30 seconds well I'd rather just idle in something less costly with the same effect.

when i'm main healing i can last along time without needing sublimation (Staying in the 700-800 MP on 1000)

and most LS pass the ixion cloak to their members as LS propriety

[jimbobsonofgod]

And that's what I was talking about earlier about being more active with your MP so when sublimation you get the full use of the charge when its available.

Like Rdm who don't convert instead of converting when the timer is up.

If you are always sitting at 1000's of MP and always sitting at full sublimation

1 Tic refresh isn't gonna make your day and the 1 HP a tic isn't doing you any good either.

Be like every other linkshell and sell cloaks for relics/mythics and stop giving them to the schs

[Nevex]

People forget that the 4 hp/tick from AF1 hat+AF2 body combined adds up real quick.
You're looking at a 80 HP loss per minute, 60 if you idle in Orochi Nodowa.
There are no other full-time regen pieces for SCH other than Orochi and Cloak; the closest items to that are Lycopodium Sash and Garden Bangles, both of which work during daytime only.

Unless someone else is healing you (i.e. a PLD exploiting that to get hate, useful in theory but not always possible in practice), you will need to counter the dot by casting Stoneskin, Regen or Cures on yourself sooner or later.
Drain is an option, but not always applicable.

If you're soloing something that hits pretty hard, you definitely don't want a Stoneskin that quickly decays over time; nor you want to continuosly recast it, in Dark Arts, with increased MP cost, cast and recast timers.

Yes, you gain MP quicker over time using AF1+AF2 over Ixion Cloak, but you also use those MP up quicker by casting heals/buffs on yourself (again, unless someone else is doing that).

Let's say your base HP is 1000: since Sublimation caps at 25% of that value, it will be 250.
Not counting Stoneskin and regen pieces/sigil/sanction:
-with Ixion Cloak it takes 252 seconds (84 ticks) to gain 250 MP while you lose 83 HP in the process;
-with AF1+AF2 it takes 189 seconds (63 ticks) to gain 250 MP while you lose 250 HP.

So you're basically gaining 33% more MP at the expense of triple HP loss (again, this not counting Stoneskin).
Those calculations are different if you count regen pieces and Stoneskin, but the basic idea is there.

As genereal rule, if HP loss is not a concern or easily counterable, then AF1+AF2 > Cloak during Sublimation.
If the opposite is true, then Cloak > AF1+AF2 for efficiency/survival.
Needless to say, if you get hit pretty hard and you drop into <50% base HP then Cloak > AF1/AF2 for obvious reasons.

[Yugl]

In reality if your mp is already full or between 100-200 i wouldnt be using it the sublimation, the trick is to use it when you need the MP I.e when you are missing more then 260ish mp, it is expensive, i don't doubt that, as i stated tho i didn't pay for it, items are much better when you earn them.

Two issues with that:

1 - Items are items. They do not become "better" when you receive the item through your LS. It's the same item whether you farm the gil for it or receive it from your LS; and to regard the former as receiving without earning is ridiculous. Players work to earn gil just as they work to build an LS. You may undermine the effort of gil making by saying gil buyers bypass the work, but same could be said about LS members who rarely attend events, yet receive grant scale items.

2 - You take for granted the fact that your LS both camps Ixion and gives items to their members. You suggest that every good SCH can make their way into a LS camping Ixion, but that it's simply untrue. Not all LSs camp HNMs. Even fewer LSs fight Ixion, and not all LSs hand out items over selling them. In other words, you're limiting yourself to a small range of LSs if you want Ixion Cloak handed to you by an LS. Those LSs can only accept a limited amount of members and even fewer amount of SCH. Consequently, the slots available for "good SCHs" is limited. Since that is the case, obtaining Ixion Cloak through an LS isn't necessarily as viable a solution as you make it appear.

oterwise i won't ever spend 2.5 mil (that's how much they are here) on it. but it is SCHs ONLY refresh body as SE thought it would be a nice cruel laugh to not let the ONLY mage in the game not have a refresh AF peice, so it's entierly up to you,

Royal Cloak - FFXIclopedia - a Wikia Gaming wiki

[Acturus]

So, if I'm reading this correctly, at this point in the thread:

1. Ixion Cloak is a top-tier idle piece, especially when Sublimation-generated HP loss is a liability.

2. Ixion Cloak is a good nuking piece, and can be considered an upgrade at endgame (depending on the situation and gear in other slots), but it is not the best item to take up the head and body slots for any nuking sets, given possible alternatives.

SCH's nature makes a lot of these discussions much more volatile than they have to be, because playstyle (and even perception of playstyle) varies so widely amongst those of us who've leveled SCH.

I think a big reason why many people are downplaying the value of Ixion Cloak is due to its inflated cost. It's become a vanity piece for the simple fact that 1) it's an HNM drop, and 2) there are still better pieces of gear out there.

That doesn't stop the Ixion Cloak from being a very worthwhile piece in any SCH's gear set, and relative belief about its worth is going to color these sorts of discussions the way that it has this one.

[Shin Volcano]

SCH is a very situational job, i'm sure people who have played sch and understand it, know this by now, there is NO such thing is a one-time peice for everything, even SE desinged them that way, when AF came out and i saw AF hat with ehanced sublimation i was glad, i was OMG faster mp storage! but then when i switched to elite beret for sleeps and kept it on i was like WTF??? lost the 1 extra tick, it was the same deal with the AF body you don't keep the +15 skill, now i can understand the enfeebling skill, but i DON'T understand WHY you can't keep the sublimation effect, after a while i just started saying forget it and using whatever i had i thought was better for the situation then when relic body came out i saw it had the same curse and NO refresh on it and i was like "...........................", because to this day, if i need to cure i'll just switch to errant if nuking morgans or ixion cloak or Af for resistant mobs, im not going to keep relic body on full time just for the full effect...i'd rather just take the 2 mp, The cloak is a valuble peice to SCH imo, but of course it's NOT the only peice you will ever use, i atm carry 4 diffrent bodies givin the situation, so there is a never a point im using one for everything. atm it's perfect for paralyze and slow tho, since the pants grant the 15 skill. SE seems to be saying "you can't have your cake and eat it to", it really seems to depend entierly on how you play as SCH as watching many other SCH most play it comepelty diffrent, some have no clue, others play it correctly, but at most i'v only seen 2 SCHs here that acttualy know what they doing.

This begs the question of...."Why does SE have a grudge agaisnt refresh with Sublimation???"

[Acturus]

This begs the question of...."Why does SE have a grudge agaisnt refresh with Sublimation???"

It's not that. SE just loves to give Opportunity Costs. Leveling SCH has its own limitations, Refresh and Strat charges are chief among them. I get the feeling that SE intended for Sublimation +4 the entire time, and now that we have the capability, trading it with Refresh makes a lot more sense than pre-AF hat and pre-Relic body.