March 10th PUP WS testing~

[Spira]

aaaand I was right.

TP300% + 3 Fire Maneuvers + Fire Holder + 6/1542 (1536 missing) = 1536 damage

http://www.clipartheaven.com/clipart...ne-clipart.gif

Seems like they're capping the return on Magic Mortar at 1dmg : 1 hp lost.

[Toth]

Hmm what is the total damage without fire manuevers?

[miokomioko]

I just tested it without the maneuvers.

Fire Holder now does either nothing for Magic Mortar, or either caps out at 100% of HP missing.

::EDIT:: DISREGARD THAT, I FAILED MISERABLY

[Spira]

based on multiple reports thus far.. no fire Mnv is about the same.. (HPmax-HPcurrent)/2 and then i think + TP bonus above 100%.

[Jones]

aaaand I was right.

TP300% + 3 Fire Maneuvers + Fire Holder + 6/1542 (1536 missing) = 1536 damage

So apparently something that was painful to setup and impractical to use on almost every mob was too good for PUP.

Working that hard for 1.5k dmg is a crock.

[spooky]

aaaand I was right.

TP300% + 3 Fire Maneuvers + Fire Holder + 6/1542 (1536 missing) = 1536 damage

Where's your BLM nerf now!

[Toth]

If you don't need Fire Maneuvers any more, it could be easier to get off with Overload. Or perhaps another Maneuver effects it.

[miokomioko]

However, this is a more realistic thing for such a NM as Jailer of Love, 3 Fire Maneuvers at 100% might easily boost it up to that [100% of hp missing damage] "cap" they seem to have applied. Thus, consistant 1500 dmg Magic Mortars are still somewhat probable. My automaton just died on that last test since it didn't kill the mob... so I'm too lazy to get right back out there and test more.

Looking back at that other dude's damage...

950ish dmg at 150hp with 2 fire maneuvers and 250% TP.

1500hp total, so, from what it looks like... fire holder does nothing at all?

[Psion]

Tried with Oniwaka at 34/1507 hp and 8/246 mp, valorquin setup. Flame holder, tension spring II, and inhibitor. Had 300 tp and did 1887 damage. I wonder... perhaps SE made it based on hp and mp? Or perhaps they made it affected by attack now. I tried loudspeaker and ice maker, ice wasnt taken and no extra damage.

[Spira]

from alla...

3 Fire Maneuvers, ~100/1376 HP, vs. Lesser Colibri
907 damage

3 Fire Maneuvers, 13/1376 HP, ~100 TP, Lesser Colibri
1075 damage

fire mnv's still do something but i'm guessing they cap at.. say 1.5x wth 3 mnvs? or HP lost, whichever comes first, probably

[miokomioko]

Tried with Oniwaka at 34/1507 hp and 8/246 mp, valorquin setup. Flame holder, tension spring II, and inhibitor. Had 300 tp and did 1887 damage. I wonder... perhaps SE made it based on hp and mp? Or perhaps they made it affected by attack now. I tried loudspeaker and ice maker, ice wasnt taken and no extra damage.

That's interesting... not based on MP though, mine had 0/266 MP in these tests. Even so, Attack being added into the mix might = shit for HNM usage.

[Spira]

Tried with Oniwaka at 34/1507 hp and 8/246 mp, valorquin setup. Flame holder, tension spring II, and inhibitor. Had 300 tp and did 1887 damage. I wonder... perhaps SE made it based on hp and mp? Or perhaps they made it affected by attack now. I tried loudspeaker and ice maker, ice wasnt taken and no extra damage.

ok.. so that throws the HP cap out of the table..

its either not capped that way, or it could be capped at (MaxHP-CurrentHP) + (MaxMP-Current MP)... or somewhere thereabouts.. cos it comes rather close anyway

edit: read post above me..
hmm.. then no clue lol. requires far more testing again...
but gonna sleep anyway

[miokomioko]

ok guys, I am fucking retarded and such, blah blah blah, I didn't even have flame holder on.
I guess I was a little riled up and rushed myself >_>
redoing it now...

http://stickandballguy.com/blog/wp-c...k-forehead.jpg

though I guess we can rule out STR+6 affecting magic mortar >_>

[Gaea]

ok guys, I am fucking retarded and such, blah blah blah, I didn't even have flame holder on.
I guess I was a little riled up and rushed myself >_>
redoing it now...

http://stickandballguy.com/blog/wp-c...k-forehead.jpg

though I guess we can rule out STR+6 affecting magic mortar >_>

LOL

[miokomioko]

TP:300%
mHP: 1356
3 Fire Maneuvers eaten by Flame Holder

1737 damage (381 increase from 3 fire maneuvers) (28% increase... wat?)

The "nerf" could be simply reducing Flame Holder's damage enhancement on Magic Mortar from +100% to +10%.

[Gaea]

TP:300%
mHP: 1356
3 Fire Maneuvers eaten by Flame Holder

1737 damage (381 increase from 3 fire maneuvers) (28% increase... wat?)

The "nerf" could be simply reducing Flame Holder's damage enhancement on Magic Mortar from +100% to +10%.

This makes sense. SE possibly only tried the WS with one Fire Maneuver in testing. I can't imagine how they weren't aware of the max possible damage regarding HP missing since they created the formula in the first place.

[Psion]

Tried with soulsoother setup with double auto repairs and a mana tank II to boost his mp as well. 19/1023 hp 3/960 mp and 300 tp, 3 fire maneuvers with flame holder did 1286 damage. guess that shoots the mana thing out the window. i also had double loudspeakers equipped.

[miokomioko]

TP:300%
mHP: 1528
3 Fire Maneuvers eaten by Flame Holder

1957 damage (381 increase from 3 fire maneuvers) (28% increase... again?)

It looks like Flame Holder now boosts the damage 9.3333% for each Fire Maneuver eaten. BORING.

I guess it's still capable of doing 4k dmg with an entirely unresisted Light skillchain although conditions needs to be perfect.

magic attachments have been tested = nothing
attack attachmenbts have been tested = nothing.

I am concluding from this data that SE simply nerfed down Flame Holder's effect on Magic Mortar down to only +10%ish from each fire maneuver eaten. Pretty lame.

So, in a realistic sense of just going at about 100% TP and not waiting for 300%, a triple-fire-maneuver with Flame Holder, Magic Mortar (if still unresisted by HNMs) can do about 1000 damage every 100% TP if you have good AutomatonHP gear and drop your Automaton down to single-digit HP.

Meh.

[Jkun]

This thread should be archived as the moment in time PUP was so good, SE had to put us back to where we started.

It's utter bullshit to be honest, the other 2 WSs don't make up for this at all now, and after waking up for my normal maintenance nap half of me thought it was a cruel joke by the OP.

Thanks for your tests Mioko, as always.

[Genosync]

Really didn't think it needed to be nerfed that hard, I'd honestly have been cool if it was capped at like 3k or so. 2k seems a little lame for that much prep work.