What do you think?

[Gergall]

We have paid 3 or 4 monthly fees since the last major update and it seems like SE couldn't come up with any real content so they shoved some job enhancements at us to shut us up.

Almost everyone was complaining about the patch notes right up until the final teaser which was "Job Adjustments" and then there was a lot of excitement.

They've collected $50 from each of us since the last major update and they did little more than buff some jobs. I am very unhappy with this update.

Edit: Also there was a lot of excitement about fixing cure-lock. This doesn't even seem to be fixed!

[Xno Kappa]

RDM: Annoyed for not having any update in years period.

Fixed.

Seriously, this update is fucking fail in my eyes. Someone said it already but this is EXACTLY why some new jobs should have never been added. So much of SCH's crap could have gone to WHM/BLM/RDM and easily would have given those jobs a breath of fresh air. What we're left with is WHM's stuck in limbo on a stand-by basis for serious shit, BLM's eventually going back to /WHM after fucking around with /SCH, and RDM's farting dust from five year old spells. I'm glad though SMN at least got hooked up with something substantially decent besides another lolavatar.
No new real mission progression and Campaign's that kick your ass when all you want is an XP buffer help to further suck this update. Interestingly enough, where the fuck is everyone fapping to their cure-lock fixes when they announced the teaser now?

[Katlan]

They did not rly add much. We got the same campaign, 3 new zones, some job adjustments, and thats it. They changed a few things about campaign, but being max rank i just use it to recap xp now when i die a few times in sea/ect. We got lazy quests/missions. co op's r still as rudamentary as ever. Its fuckin annoying to run 10 minutes to get into CN since 4 months after the xpac they STILL have not released choco's.

New Merit spots??? La Vaule (sp) is meh.. the main camp is so hard to pull w/o linking above and getting 3+ adds. Yeah the mobs arent hard to kill, but u have to be so careful on pulls that its near impossible to keep up good chains unless u just wanna keep linking tons of shit each pull. I liked Oz (had a lot of fun on that camp), but it takes a bit to actually get to the good merit spot in there. Most ppl dont wanna take 30+ minutes to get to a camp nymore in the day and age of runic portals. And freaken Gnats r worse then Lurkers... Still.. Each of those zones can hold 1 Merit PT... Oz is a nice merit spot. But unless thickets is camped to shit then they arent worth it. And id be pretty pissy if I took a PT to oz for merits (when it looked open). and another PT was 5 minutes ahead of us and got to the camp before we could lol... its just not user friendly

My main problem w/the xpac is this though, and its not a QQ just a concern... At first it seems like they made an entire xpac based on campaign. I kinda blew it off as it just being the intro and that they would add more down the road. But I don't see the potential for where this is gonna happen. And the more i think about it... they did JUST make an xpac based on campaign, and thats all. (common, the first update fixed more shit w/old content vs adding new stuff. thats a sign) Where is the potential for instances? The only unreleased zones so far is Xarca and Throne. ppl will always be camping the Zilart Kings, so I never expact SE to add something to outdo that. its not their style anymore considering a diff team makes each xpac. There is no short time content (assault, salavge, ect ect), just campaign and I think thats all this xpac is turning out to be. And there was no time line of stuff to look forward to (unlike what they did w/ ToA, which kinda makes me wonder). I would imagine that they will add new form of dynamis though, but dont worry cause it will be on the same timer as CoP/Zilart Dynamis!

[The Q]

I must say, I nearly forgot about it, but I was a little disappointed to see there was no monster base damage, monster stat, or PC Def/Vit adjustment to help facilitate tanking as they alluded too a while back.

Anyone else remember that? "We thought about adding a new tank job, but decided to work on making some of the current jobs better at tanking" or something along those lines.

This. Severely disappointed but not at all surprised.

They left out a lot of things they talked about adding, such as the damage reflection for PLD. I'm thinking their big addition to allow tanking was Retaliator on WAR.

[Gunslinger]

RDM: Annoyed for not having any update in years period.

Besides some of the most useful merited spells and the upgrade to dagger damage I'd agree with you.

But with the ability to solo things most jobs would only dream of, pretty much replacing whms in almost every pt, and the ability to effectivly tank most HNM, what more do rdms _actually_ need (if someone has a serious logical argument I'd love to hear it, the job is amazing as is)? Not being touched for awhile isn't cause for new stuff, it would just be fluff anyway.

Anyway, I think we all know the answer about what RDMs need:


Better melee abilities.


Hey, then they can cure, nuke, refresh, tank, support, and melee DD. We need more RDM burns, warriors are so 2007.


Also, to avoid just responding to someone elses post, I think the update is pretty nice for a lot of players. I haven't had a lot of time to explore the new areas, but I've heard good things.

[Xno Kappa]

RDM: Annoyed for not having any update in years period.

Besides some of the most useful merited spells and the upgrade to dagger damage I'd agree with you.

Yeah and this is where everyone stopped reading your post.

[ronin sparthos]

[quote=The Q]

I must say, I nearly forgot about it, but I was a little disappointed to see there was no monster base damage, monster stat, or PC Def/Vit adjustment to help facilitate tanking as they alluded too a while back.

Anyone else remember that? "We thought about adding a new tank job, but decided to work on making some of the current jobs better at tanking" or something along those lines.

This. Severely disappointed but not at all surprised.

They left out a lot of things they talked about adding, such as the damage reflection for PLD. I'm thinking their big addition to allow tanking was Retaliator on WAR.[/quote:uli48hm7]

An update that corrected DEF/VIT and allowed Warriors/Samurai to tank effectively in parties on par with NIN/PLD or just a step below would be the most revolutionary patch to hit the game since Nyzul/Salvage. Let NIN/PLD handle the HNM scene, but allow WAR/SAM at the least the ability to tank in exp on their own via defense. A new tank job is not needed, a tweak to the current formulas would allow the heavy armor classes to actually do something besides DD.

The rebirth of blood tanking.... it'll be like 2004 in 2008.

[Gunslinger]

Well played, but I think hitting for a few more damage by doing nothing is a notable change. Higher WS = easier soloing as well, right?

[Jkun]

All this update did, was make /NIN my new adventuring job instead of WHM, and ruin my PUP soloing techniques. (lolMortar replacing Knockout, yet Armor Piercer doesn't replace Daze? what the fuck SE, what the fuck.)

Also noticing how PUP is also on a new mage set. Yes, that's right, the same set with MAB. Once again, SE knows nothing about where this job is going or how to even play it. Nothing.

[ronin sparthos]

All this update did, was make /NIN my new adventuring job instead of WHM, and ruin my PUP soloing techniques. (lolMortar replacing Knockout, yet Armor Piercer doesn't replace Daze? what the fuck SE, what the fuck.)

Also noticing how PUP is also on a new mage set. Yes, that's right, the same set with MAB. Once again, SE knows nothing about where this job is going or how to even play it. Nothing.

Official explanation:

The reason PUP is given light armor is due to the fact that heavier/useful armor constricts the delicate hand movements that a puppetmaster needs to coordinate full control of an automaton. Besides, it makes way too much sense that a puppetmaster would use light harness-class armors like a scorpion harness or more gi type armors even though the job boasts martial training in the discription of saintis.

[millionsknives]

the update was as lazy as the expansion D: no missions?!

The SCH job should have had its ideas divided out between whm, blm and rdm to revamp them. There isnt any direction in the job which can be seen by how the update didnt bring anything new to the game, it just stole from other jobs to make sch wanted.

Seriously seems like this dev team just cant be assed, the expansion has an overall lazy and unfinished feel. As soon as i saw NPCs in Rdm AF shooting with a gun i lost hope -_- even if they change what those npcs wear (like they have with some others) the point is it shouldnt have been like that in the first place

ToAU was great, i think everyone is disappointed because we now have very high expectations. Sure besieged was screwed at the start etc, but the feel of the overall expansion was great and the job adjustments were 'wow'

wait... this isnt on topic any more...

[vagus]

/sigh SE.

Overall this patch isn't that spectacular. I'd give it a 3/5. The upgrades to Campaign, Scholar & new tele scrolls are spectacular, but that's about it. The new missions aren't very interesting. More merit friendly camps would be nice. No real great items. We'll have to wait for the next patch I suppose.

[Kenji]

We have paid 3 or 4 monthly fees since the last major update and it seems like SE couldn't come up with any real content so they shoved some job enhancements at us to shut us up.

Almost everyone was complaining about the patch notes right up until the final teaser which was "Job Adjustments" and then there was a lot of excitement.

They've collected $50 from each of us since the last major update and they did little more than buff some jobs. I am very unhappy with this update.

Edit: Also there was a lot of excitement about fixing cure-lock. This doesn't even seem to be fixed!

This made a lot of sense to me awhile ago. But then someone said something that shifted my view:

"You're paying for the game as is, not how you'd like it to be."

And it's true. Rightly or wrongly, your monthly fee pays for your access to the game as is, and for SE to maintain your character. It's like your phone bill or internet bill. You're paying for the service as is. You want to get more for your money; we all do, it's human nature. It's kinda like saying "I've been paying Verizon 25 bucks a month, and they haven't provided me with a skype-like service, or any line upgrades in a fuckin year!"

Honest question here, but what makes MMO customer/consumers different?

[Hyan]

The job adjustments were better than I thought. There's still too little content though, so I'd give it a 7/10. Overall pretty nice patch, mainly because I wasn't expecting stuff like endgame events 'cause they never add it so early.

[ronin sparthos]

I think he was talking about the fact that half of the things this update brought to the table (new zones, campaign tweaks) were something that should have been placed in the game since the beginning of the new expansion.

Monthly fees are static yes, but thats no excuse for halfassed service and in many cases the game comes down to just chilling out w/friends. Glorified AIM status. I doubt anyone minds paying a monthly fee but the updates are starting to space out more (maybe its just me or maybe i didnt notice the gaps when the updates were more fufilling) people expect more per update.

Sandworm.... the one HNM that ive anticipated highly since like early CoP and he on the fast track to ToAU Beastkings dropwise. Seriously, is the Sandworm a big internal SE joke or something? i just dont get it. AV video took a long time and people are stumped, can they begin the scavenger hunt ingame for clues as an event or something?

"You're paying for the game as is, not how you'd like it to be."

True, but this is a double-edged sword. In one hand you can make the playerbase very happy by focusing on their requests but on the other hand interpreting what the playerbase can be very hard and lead to alot of nonsense requests being granted.

Look at Cheese Sandwich, a horrible idea yet SE took that idea and ran with it.

This update shows that WoTG is going to be all about the Campaigning - it will remain the main draw of the expansion along with whatever endgame event they provide, granted it isnt something like Einherjar 2.0.

[Gergall]

Honest question here, but what makes MMO customer/consumers different?

I appreciate your response and here is my honest answer: look at other MMOs and the content additions they get. I don't think I have to tell you which one I have in mind. There is a standard being set which FFXI did not live up to this update.

You do say that I am paying for the game as is. I don't entirely agree. I believe that I am paying for a service which includes everything from my character and items to customer service to version updates and more.

In other words I am paying for the "status quo" as is, which up until recently included quality content updates on a regular basis.

[Lordender]

I hope the dev's read this thread and see how boring their patch was, it seriously wasent good enough to warrant a 4 month wait. I would have no problem waiting 4-5months for a patch if the content matched the wait. I mean lol @ this thread, almost no one is remotely happy with this patch except if you were a scholar who got a huge make over.

[Septimus]

RDM: Annoyed for not having any update in years period.

Besides some of the most useful merited spells and the upgrade to dagger damage I'd agree with you.

But with the ability to solo things most jobs would only dream of, pretty much replacing whms in almost every pt, and the ability to effectivly tank most HNM, what more do rdms _actually_ need (if someone has a serious logical argument I'd love to hear it, the job is amazing as is)? Not being touched for awhile isn't cause for new stuff, it would just be fluff anyway.

Anyway, I think we all know the answer about what RDMs need:


Better melee abilities.


Hey, then they can cure, nuke, refresh, tank, support, and melee DD. We need more RDM burns, warriors are so 2007.


Also, to avoid just responding to someone elses post, I think the update is pretty nice for a lot of players. I haven't had a lot of time to explore the new areas, but I've heard good things.

What more do Red Mages actually need?

Hmm...

I don't know, maybe the ability to land our enfeebles on everything that matters? You know- Shijin, Jailers, ToAU world spawns. Nothing like full enfeebling merits with millions of gil and years spent getting some of the best gear possible only to have most of your spells resist.

Also, how about the effects of Slow II and Paralyze II being slightly more inline with the costs? Slow II is three times the MP of Slow, but only marginally (6% or so) better. How about Slow II being 50% slow like Carnage Elegy? Crazy talk! Paralyze II is 6 times the MP cost of Paralyze, you would be hard-pressed to fond anyone who would say that it is 6 times better. (Two-times, maybe.) And while I am talking about Paralyze II, how about having its increased accuracy prevent partial resists? Nothing like blowing 36 MP and have the spell fall off 20 seconds later with 0 procs. >_<

How about our B+ enhancing magic skill actually mattering for the spells we cast most often? I've been casting Refresh and Haste for like 3.5 years, yet they are exactly the same as when I got them. Maybe higher enhancing skill could affect their duration? That would be... helpful!

You know, that's just off the top of my head. Give me some time and I can come up with a list of improvements for the job.

[Xno Kappa]

RDM: Annoyed for not having any update in years period.

Besides some of the most useful merited spells and the upgrade to dagger damage I'd agree with you.

But with the ability to solo things most jobs would only dream of, pretty much replacing whms in almost every pt, and the ability to effectivly tank most HNM, what more do rdms _actually_ need (if someone has a serious logical argument I'd love to hear it, the job is amazing as is)? Not being touched for awhile isn't cause for new stuff, it would just be fluff anyway.

Anyway, I think we all know the answer about what RDMs need:


Better melee abilities.


Hey, then they can cure, nuke, refresh, tank, support, and melee DD. We need more RDM burns, warriors are so 2007.


Also, to avoid just responding to someone elses post, I think the update is pretty nice for a lot of players. I haven't had a lot of time to explore the new areas, but I've heard good things.

What more do Red Mages actually need?

Hmm...

I don't know, maybe the ability to land our enfeebles on everything that matters? You know- Shijin, Jailers, ToAU world spawns. Nothing like full enfeebling merits with millions of gil and years spent getting some of the best gear possible only to have most of your spells resist.

Also, how about the effects of Slow II and Paralyze II being slightly more inline with the costs? Slow II is three times the MP of Slow, but only marginally (6% or so) better. How about Slow II being 50% slow like Carnage Elegy? Crazy talk! Paralyze II is 6 times the MP cost of Paralyze, you would be hard-pressed to fond anyone who would say that it is 6 times better. (Two-times, maybe.) And while I am talking about Paralyze II, how about having its increased accuracy prevent partial resists? Nothing like blowing 36 MP and have the spell fall off 20 seconds later with 0 procs. >_<

How about our B+ enhancing magic skill actually mattering for the spells we cast most often? I've been casting Refresh and Haste for like 3.5 years, yet they are exactly the same as when I got them. Maybe higher enhancing skill could affect their duration? That would be... helpful!

You know, that's just off the top of my head. Give me some time and I can come up with a list of improvements for the job.

Like I said, it was better to stop reading where I bolded.

[BRP]

Group II merits are still capped at 3 instead of 5. This really should be changed soon. But RDM still got boosts along with other jobs with the addition of new merit category 2, so you can't say they are entirely ignored. Also, SE said RDMs will get better at meleeing in this expansion, so be prepared for disappointment if the dagger boost is a joke to you.



As for the update, it still targets lower levels which isn't a good idea at this point. Shame too, since you need to woo the higher levels first since everyone in this game has sheep mentality, either that or help pre-level 10 since that's when most people quit. They did do a good job of fixing things, but not so much adding stuff. They did a good job with the fixing too. Hopefully this will come with next update.

The storyline I fear is moving as slow and easy as ToAU. I guess that's what happens when everyone cries about CoP being too "tough" and "tedious". Hopefully things will pick-up earlier than the last two updates which was the case with ToAU. The three mission line interests me. I just hope they don't end up being less meaty than the last mission line. I do appreciate SE getting better in their writing and directing of cutscenes, even if it's scattered all over the place with quests and missions being split.

In the mean time, I guess that'll mean more threads being about bitching about the same thing in news topics. So much for being on-topic these next 3 months. Oh hey, there's a egg event thread, that must be related to the update content. Let's show SE just how hardcore we are.