Bhaflau rampart question...

[ubermonkey]

Slightly noob question (okay very noob question)...

How do people fit in multiple ramparts and LBC in one run, ramparts seem to take ages if you fight them for their entire duration. Do people just kill them off early or are you all so awesome that you do all your running around in about 2 minutes? :D

[Drex]

Kill at 50% unless it's poppin' a lot of nms

[ubermonkey]

Kill at 50% unless it's poppin' a lot of nms

Thanks. That's what one of my peeps suggested, but wanted to be sure.

As yet we've yet to see a damn NM though. Salvage is fun -_-

[Wizerd]

Kill at 50% unless it has popped at least 1 NM

Fixed.

[Kaylia]

Our group is pretty much doing what everyone is doing

1st floor: 50-60% kill if it didnt pop anything
2nd floor: 50-60% kill if it didnt pop anything
3rd floor: 50-60% kill if we skipped 1st or 2nd
4th floor: spend the remaining on it, zone up when there is ~12-13min left (takes 8min to kill mega usually, but we would rather play it safe).

[Paegan]

As yet we've yet to see a damn NM though. Salvage is fun -_-

Don't worry, one day 6 Gate Widows will pop, and all proceed to drop nothing.

And then there was the time we got 9 35's in 2 days of BR.

Salvage is *extremes*

[Starlink]

Yesterday 5 6 Gate Widows 0 drop yes salvage is fun.

[Scorp]

I'm still of the opinion that the ramparts work differently. 1st Floor when active will generally pop a lot of gate widows. We've seen 4 gate widows in 4 runs and received 3 macha, 2 enlil. 2nd Floor i've seen pop nothing to 20% then pop out a hq bee which dropped.

Our group alone though would be a small sample size and most people still go with 50%.

Also our luck has transformed since we started pulling the rampart with an elemental spell of the same day. I.e. fire 1 nuke it to pull on firesday. If only it wasn't so random I'd say that worked

[Arthars]

Bhaflau remnants is *extremes*

fixed and to add on SSR is cockblock

[Arthars]

Also our luck has transformed since we started pulling the rampart with an elemental spell of the same day. I.e. fire 1 nuke it to pull on firesday. If only it wasn't so random I'd say that worked

i did that too since last year XD

but still, its random

[pchan]

We used to do the 50% thing, except our last 2 2F ramparts, which poped only one NM at ~20% and dropped usukane ..

[Ayn]

I'm still of the opinion that the ramparts work differently. 1st Floor when active will generally pop a lot of gate widows. We've seen 4 gate widows in 4 runs and received 3 macha, 2 enlil. 2nd Floor i've seen pop nothing to 20% then pop out a hq bee which dropped.

We've had plenty of runs until recently where the 1st floor Rampart didn't pop a single freaking NM.

Lately it's been popping them out more lately. Our highlight was 2 cuffs in one run.

Fortunately, I think we only need them for two more people?

[Hakamaru]

We used to do the 50% thing, except our last 2 2F ramparts, which poped only one NM at ~20% and dropped usukane ..

Did the in-game day change just before you saw the NM pop?

I had something like this happen to my group on Saturday, and I noted that the day shifted from firesday->earthsday right before the NMs began to pop @~30% rampart HP.

From my group's experience with this rampart, it seems like there might be a correlation between game-day and whether or not the rampart is "active" (i.e. can pop NMs). We've seen NMs pop on the following days: Windsday, Darksday, Earthsday. I posted on KI and someone else has reported seeing NMs pop on Lightningsday. Ok, so let's look at the days of the vana'diel week in order:

Lightsday
Darksday
Firesday
Earthsday
Watersday
Windsday
Iceday
Lightningsday

Couple this with the fact that we got no NM pops for 70% of a rampart on firesday, then 2 NMs pop from the last 30% of the same rampart on Earthsday and it at least gives me something to try.

:bagel: ?

[Hanyoko]

A friends shell was doing BR First floor Rampart at almost the exact same time we were and they had 6 spawns of GW each time dropping something whereas we had 0 spawns. Its random

[Hakamaru]

A friends shell was doing BR First floor Rampart at almost the exact same time we were and they had 6 spawns of GW each time dropping something whereas we had 0 spawns. Its random

come back when you have an actual counter-example for the pop-conditions I suggested. And, specifically, that would be a SS (or first-hand account) of an NM Bee popping on Lightsday, Firesday, Watersday or Iceday.

My post is only in regard to Bees. I didn't track our gate-widow pops because I'm not really concerned with them.

[Hanyoko]

A friends shell was doing BR First floor Rampart at almost the exact same time we were and they had 6 spawns of GW each time dropping something whereas we had 0 spawns. Its random

come back when you have an actual counter-example for the pop-conditions I suggested. And, specifically, that would be a SS (or first-hand account) of an NM Bee popping on Lightsday, Firesday, Watersday or Iceday.

My post is only in regard to Bees. I didn't track our gate-widow pops because I'm not really concerned with them.

Thats nice that your post was about bees. However my post was in relation to the 3 earlier mentions of GW. I'm sure if someone has some proof for/against your claim they will quote it and show their proof. My intention was to point out that GW is very random with its appearance and drops.

[Hakamaru]

Thats nice that your post was about bees. However my post was in relation to the 3 earlier mentions of GW. I'm sure if someone has some proof for/against your claim they will quote it and show their proof. My intention was to point out that GW is very random with its appearance and drops.

Ah, well grats on finding the quote function I suppose (it helps avoid these little confusions you know). If the bees rampart isn't just random (and I'm convinced it isn't), then I also doubt the Gate Widows rampart is just random. There's another group in my shell that's on a 4-run streak of seeing bees NMs AND Gate Widows from both ramparts. They farm the area exclusively on Earthsday.

Also, the fact that your friend saw NMs and you didn't proves nothing in the first place. It's possible for a rampart to be "on" and not pop any NMs because well... there's always bad luck on top of whether the rampart is "on" or not.

If I get some more confirmation on the bees rampart, maybe I'll try and come back and say something the Gate Widows. What would be helpful... is screenshots from any of the rampart NMs that have popped with "/clock on" output in the log.

[shieldsofwindurst]

Thats nice that your post was about bees. However my post was in relation to the 3 earlier mentions of GW. I'm sure if someone has some proof for/against your claim they will quote it and show their proof. My intention was to point out that GW is very random with its appearance and drops.

Ah, well grats on finding the quote function I suppose (it helps avoid these little confusions you know). If the bees rampart isn't just random (and I'm convinced it isn't), then I also doubt the Gate Widows rampart is just random. There's another group in my shell that's on a 4-run streak of seeing bees NMs AND Gate Widows from both ramparts. They farm the area exclusively on Earthsday.

Also, the fact that your friend saw NMs and you didn't proves nothing in the first place. It's possible for a rampart to be "on" and not pop any NMs because well... there's always bad luck on top of whether the rampart is "on" or not.

If I get some more confirmation on the bees rampart, maybe I'll try and come back and say something the Gate Widows. What would be helpful... is screenshots from any of the rampart NMs that have popped with "/clock on" output in the log.

As much as I'd like to think there's a way to force the ramparts to give up NMs, my personal belief is that it's just random, like everything else in salvage. Bhaflau is different from the other zones in that (if I'm right) you cannot force (rampart) NM pops; however, it's (relatively) balanced in that you can get multiple pops of each NM. The only thing that is somewhat unbalanced is the mad bomber on the first floor; since you can force the rampart pop on all of the other floors, it's somewhat surprising that there's no way to force him to pop on your side. In fact, when I was checking on him 2 days ago I thought I saw him pop right in front of me (though he was probably just on the edge of my viewing range).

This begs the question though, Is it better to farm the chariot and/or the flayer a guaranteed 1x per run in Arrapago (depending on 6th floor) reliably and not get anything, or see 0-4 (more likely 0-1 or 0-2, but those outlying cases exist) widows & bees in Bhaflau? I don't know which is better; I do know that I've seen more usu pants drops than I have widow & bee drops. I also know that other groups have seen the exact opposite. This leads me to the simple conclusion that salvage drops suck, no matter the zone, and you just need to deal with the randomness. If you manage to find something that forces the ramparts to put out, by all means share and earn the adulation of the rest of us, but 1x guaranteed vs random 0-5 pops seems like a reasonable balance and something SE would do, and I don't really mind too much just taking my chances (if I did, I wouldn't be grinding salvage in the first goddamn place).

[Hanyoko]

Also, the fact that your friend saw NMs and you didn't proves nothing in the first place. It's possible for a rampart to be "on" and not pop any NMs because well... there's always bad luck on top of whether the rampart is "on" or not.

If I get some more confirmation on the bees rampart, maybe I'll try and come back and say something the Gate Widows. What would be helpful... is screenshots from any of the rampart NMs that have popped with "/clock on" output in the log.

Well given that current day/moon phase were the same the only difference being current game time the different groups did actions.
One group having frequent spawns each kill dropping a piece
Other group having no spawns

Whatever happened with that dawn/dusk thread? Have you looked over that info?

[Hakamaru]

I just combed an old BR thread and found a couple SSs of popped bee NMs with the clock visible. Guess what... all on game days I predicted.

viewtopic.php?p=588263#p588263


http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/1039 ... 122mv5.jpg (Thundersday)
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e175/ ... /skirm.jpg (Earthsday)
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p76/ ... g_0163.png (Darksday)

Most the SSs show people's drops, which is maddening because it covers the clock.