ITS ON NOW, Denmark!

[Tyche]

stuff

Ok, so one cartoon tried to say the holocaust was a hoax, and another tried to say all muslims are violent. A question, which do you think is even a little bit true? And furthermore, which do you think is going to cause the most violent riots and death threats? Perhaps the difference between this and when Mel and Kramer said this those was that the protests and outrage agaisnt it was actually civil and did not involve 100 dead people.

Did you forget the occurence where a woman wanted to name a teddybear Muhamed(sp?) because the kids wanted to, and muslims wanted her executed? Was it her intention to cause this and insult Islam? It's not just this cartoon thing that's reenforcing the view that some muslims are violent and irrational, we have had many such events where the people who commited the offense did it unknowlingly and without malicious intent and STILL got numerous death threats and even riots calling for execution.

So you saying that the Danish writers did it maliciously with the intent to incite muslims cannot be applied in the example of the brittish teacher, she had no malicious intent and still got treated the same. The Danish writers weren't just talking out of their asses here, there is a large amount of muslims who maintain this stereotype of violence, and the cartoon only proved them right. And the fact that this happend again in other moments just implies that there is a problem within the muslim community with this rampant use of violence.

So you basically think Muslims are inherently violent? As a Muslim, knowing what I believe in, I'll tell you I'll put my money on my own religion than whether a historical event which I have no first hand experience with.

You fail to realize how different Muslims around the world are. It's as if I was to take the "Christian" group who rallies around the death of U.S. soldiers stating that God is angry for how much America loves faggots, and say that those are all Christians. It's evident from a number of posts in this thread that there is no intimate knowledge of Islam here, rather a tidbit from a wiki-page or what have you. It's as though a number of people posting in this thread have lost sight of the fact that there are hundreds of millions of Muslims in the world, and that, similar to any grouping of people, they come in all colors of the spectrum.

If you think Muslims are inherently violent, understand that this is as fallacious as any other negative generalization, and you just open yourself to insults flying left and right and no conclusion anywhere.

If you think Islam is an inherently violent religion, please, do some adequate reading--I assure you that you are sorely mistaken.

If you want to believe one or the other, and could care less of doing research or approaching the subject, then whatever, keep on truckin'.

And those "Christians" are well within their right to protest the soldiers funerals. They are expressing their rights. They aren't killing people who oppose their views. Is muslim inherently violent? Maybe not, but the stereotype didn't stem out of thin air. Is there another religion that has killed half as many people in the name of their God in the past 20 years.

[Maxxthepenguin]

Holy shit, is somebody trying to kind of sideways defend the westboro baptist church?

[Faris]

stuff

Ok, so one cartoon tried to say the holocaust was a hoax, and another tried to say all muslims are violent. A question, which do you think is even a little bit true? And furthermore, which do you think is going to cause the most violent riots and death threats? Perhaps the difference between this and when Mel and Kramer said this those was that the protests and outrage agaisnt it was actually civil and did not involve 100 dead people.

Did you forget the occurence where a woman wanted to name a teddybear Muhamed(sp?) because the kids wanted to, and muslims wanted her executed? Was it her intention to cause this and insult Islam? It's not just this cartoon thing that's reenforcing the view that some muslims are violent and irrational, we have had many such events where the people who commited the offense did it unknowlingly and without malicious intent and STILL got numerous death threats and even riots calling for execution.

So you saying that the Danish writers did it maliciously with the intent to incite muslims cannot be applied in the example of the brittish teacher, she had no malicious intent and still got treated the same. The Danish writers weren't just talking out of their asses here, there is a large amount of muslims who maintain this stereotype of violence, and the cartoon only proved them right. And the fact that this happend again in other moments just implies that there is a problem within the muslim community with this rampant use of violence.

So you basically think Muslims are inherently violent? As a Muslim, knowing what I believe in, I'll tell you I'll put my money on my own religion than whether a historical event which I have no first hand experience with.

You fail to realize how different Muslims around the world are. It's as if I was to take the "Christian" group who rallies around the death of U.S. soldiers stating that God is angry for how much America loves faggots, and say that those are all Christians. It's evident from a number of posts in this thread that there is no intimate knowledge of Islam here, rather a tidbit from a wiki-page or what have you. It's as though a number of people posting in this thread have lost sight of the fact that there are hundreds of millions of Muslims in the world, and that, similar to any grouping of people, they come in all colors of the spectrum.

If you think Muslims are inherently violent, understand that this is as fallacious as any other negative generalization, and you just open yourself to insults flying left and right and no conclusion anywhere.

If you think Islam is an inherently violent religion, please, do some adequate reading--I assure you that you are sorely mistaken.

If you want to believe one or the other, and could care less of doing research or approaching the subject, then whatever, keep on truckin'.

And those "Christians" are well within their right to protest the soldiers funerals. They are expressing their rights. They aren't killing people who oppose their views. Is muslim inherently violent? Maybe not, but the stereotype didn't stem out of thin air. Is there another religion that has killed half as many people in the name of their God in the past 20 years.

Israelis killing Palestinians/Lebanese/Egyptians. does that count? cus thats a big number too.

Well, not really killing in the name of God, but oil. would you consider that too? i.e. Iraq

[Maxxthepenguin]

Well, not really killing in the name of God, but oil. would you consider that too? i.e. Iraq

The Isrealis are fighting for their own place to live. Now it being Isreal specifically does have religious background, but it is not in the name of god.

We aren't fighting for oil. Our gas prices and general oil prices having increased so much over the time of the Iraq war attests to that (though Bush just failing hard could easily be the reason.)

[Faris]

Well, not really killing in the name of God, but oil. would you consider that too? i.e. Iraq

The isrealis are fighting for their own place to live

We aren't fighting for oil. Our gas prices having increased so much over the time of the Iraq war attests to that.

your opinion, my opinion. My point is they are killing people for a reason, and its not a defensive reason

[Kuya]

The argument is about Muslims, Islam, Denmark, and whether the writers are at fault, the muslims are at fault, or do they both get spanked. It has nothing to do with Isreal because they aren't even related. Stick to the main argument at hand.

[Maxxthepenguin]

Well, not really killing in the name of God, but oil. would you consider that too? i.e. Iraq

The isrealis are fighting for their own place to live

We aren't fighting for oil. Our gas prices having increased so much over the time of the Iraq war attests to that.

your opinion, my opinion. My point is they are killing people for a reason, and its not a defensive reason

At this point, the Isrealis are on the defensive >_________>

Let's not get into this again. It's irrelevant to the fact that 100 people were killed over a cartoon and one teacher was almost killed over a freaking teddy bear, and you haven't addressed either point and rejected (or denounced) those who perpetrated those acts.

[Faris]

Let's not get into this again. It's irrelevant to the fact that 100 people were killed over a cartoon and one teacher was almost killed over a freaking teddy bear, and you haven't addressed either point and rejected (or denounced) those who perpetrated those acts.

I'm sorry, but are you blind or something? i did point out i personally reject those acts..made it in bold big fonts too, i think its in page 2. I'm not going to quote myself, go look for it before talking nonsense.

[Vigilia]

This whole cartoon drama reminds me of when Monty Python's Life of Brian first came out and conservative christians went apeshit picketing cinemas and film festivals demanding for it to be banned. You're always going to have some fundamentalists in the world who can't see the humour in dealing with what they see as a holy subject. Yet freedom of speech and religion is exactly that, especially for cartoonists and comedians. You are allowed to express the funny and lighthearted side of what is otherwise a serious subject. I'm sure the cartoonists behind controversial images never intended them as offending to anyone. They simply looked at a subject from the outside, thought it funny and wanted to share that.

[Maxxthepenguin]

I missed it cause it was in an edit

[Faris]

I missed it cause it was in an edit

well then im sorry

[Day]

Why so offended in the first place? I think that's what we all want to know here, well at least I do, and no one is really answering that.

I try to put myself in others shoes in most situations, but I just don't see how getting that offended at a cartoon and/or teddy bear is a rational reaction at all. Even if I was a die hard christian and saw the raptor jesus or southpark jesus, I may get offended yes, but enough to make this big of a deal about it, I really don't think so. And this is leaving the whole violence thing aside, as it's clear not all muslims believe in the violence, I think we all know that, but why the "OMG, I kno he didn't, not MY God", where as most rational people would just ignore it or laugh it off.

[Faris]

Why so offended in the first place? I think that's what we all want to know here, well at least I do, and no one is really answering that.

I try to put myself in others shoes in most situations, but I just don't see how getting that offended at a cartoon and/or teddy bear is a rational reaction at all. Even if I was a die hard christian and saw the raptor jesus or southpark jesus, I may get offended yes, but enough to make this big of a deal about it, I really don't think so. And this is leaving the whole violence thing aside, as it's clear not all muslims believe in the violence, I think we all know that, but why the "OMG, I kno he didn't, not MY God", where as most rational people would just ignore it or laugh it off.

It was just a silly cartoon, and then it evolved..who made this evolution? i blame both sides.
They publicized it in a provokative manner, muslims overreacted, it became an issue of rights, of freedom, of religion, of all that. Now, the Danish are pissed off because of the death threats, and the muslims are pissed off because of the cartoons 1st and 2nd print.

A Minority of the muslims, yes started burning flags and attacking embassies, and the death threats. But the major attack from the muslim is the boycott, and as a retaliation to our retaliation, other countries started printing the cartoons, and then reprinted them. and thats that.

[Tyche]

the Danish are pissed off because of the death threats, and the muslims are pissed off because of the cartoons 1st and 2nd print.

Repeat this to yourself 10 times and realize how absurd this all is. Go outside and find a random person and say this to them.

[Day]

Ah so it's all about the he says, she says bullshit.

(Thats right I fuckin quoted Limp Bizkit)

[Faris]

the Danish are pissed off because of the death threats, and the muslims are pissed off because of the cartoons 1st and 2nd print.

Repeat this to yourself 10 times and realize how absurd this all is. Go outside and find a random person and say this to them.

wut? they'll think im crazy

P.S: I added more to it

[Mizango]

the Danish are pissed off because of the death threats, and the muslims are pissed off because of the cartoons 1st and 2nd print.

Repeat this to yourself 10 times and realize how absurd this all is. Go outside and find a random person and say this to them.

wut? they'll think im crazy

lol Exactly.

[Faris]

okok, lets just get things straight here. Whats upseting you now?

the fact that we are upset about the cartoons? I think we have the right to


the fact that there are people sending death threats to those cartoonists? I think thats stupid and extreme, bad image to our religion and nation


the fact that the cartoons are silly and really wasnt worth all this trouble? I agree with you

the fact that most of us are boycotting Danish products? We have the right to do whatever we please, for a cartoon, or for a bucket of water. none of anyones business

[Enkidu]

A Minority of the muslims, yes started burning flags and attacking embassies, and the death threats. But the major attack from the muslim is the boycott, and as a retaliation to our retaliation, other countries started printing the cartoons, and then reprinted them. and thats that.

The major attack is not the boycott, be serious now... You live in a rather well-off Muslim area, but most muslims in the world are poor. Your boycott is pointless. The people who died, however... That's not pointless.

They didn't reprint the images to piss off Muslims or to make fun of a boycott, they did so to show that they wont be violently pressured to give up their freedom of speech. If you can't understand that, then there is nothing more to discuss.

[archibaldcrane]

I still don't understand why all the exporters in Denmark should be responsible for the actions of a single newspaper. The exporters you are punishing can't stop the newspaper from printing this cartoon every single day from now til the end of time. Boycott the paper, not a bunch of unrelated companies.

You're sending a message that you don't understand how capitalism, secular nations, and freedom of expression work.