15 year old gay kid, killed

[BerenTebogo]

I am a very open, tolerant, accepting individual when it comes to homosexuality, by that I mean I'll be an asshole to you, no matter who you are. I have a few gay friends, I've known many gay people, in my late teens - early 20's it has never bothered me and I accept whatever people do as it's their choice, I have been hit on many times because I do like to wear tight-fighting clothing, go tanning, and take care of myself, I take it in stride.

That being said, if I was 13, and some boy in a dress hit on me, and flirted with me, I would have beat him rotten. Hell, I got into a bunch of fights because I spiked my hair up in liberty spikes in high school, it's the nature of boys to explore with bullying and territory assertation, if you think this is false you're kidding yourself, it helps make you a 'man' so to speak, in my eyes. I've gotten my ass kicked and I've kicked ass, and now I'm a laid back, functioning member of society. I'm not saying the kid deserved to be shot, not by any means, but should he have had his clock cleaned? Yeah, I think he should've, it's to be expected from kids that young, they aren't rational human beings.

Also, my dad beat the shit out of me when I dyed my hair, threatened to shave it off, etc and I had to dye it back til I was 16, if I had gotten any piercings he would've ripped them out, this is how YOU SHOULD BE RAISING YOUR CHILD. The whole reason little girls have STD's and little Dr. Frankfurters are getting shot is because parent's these days like to get drunk with their 14 year olds because "It's ok if they do it with me!" type of shit. This parental generation cares more about being cool, hip, and a friend than they do about shaping and molding a functional human being, and our kids are fucked to shit because of it.

The parents should NEVER, EVER have allowed their child to dress like that in middle school, you can teach a 13 year-old tolerance all you want, but it's like teaching a newborn puppy not to nip at you in play, it's fucking natural to be scared of the only normality you've ever really known at 13 "This is a boy, this is a girl"

Beat your kids, please, stop this fucking ridiculousness and bullshit that's going on, your kid isn't doing anything extreme enough to beat him over? Fine, send him out back and make him chop wood. BUILDING CHARACTER IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN HAVING THE COOLEST KID ON THE FUCKING BLOCK JESUS FUCKING CHRIST. And fathers of daughters? If your daughters boyfriends isn't scared to fucking death of you if she's not over 16, if he doesn't piss himself when he comes to the door, you're fucking failing.

MORE PARENTS, LESS "FRIENDS" and people will stop getting shot.

[Beckwin]

shut the fuck up sath.

maddox isn't meant to be taken seriously.

[BerenTebogo]

It has nothing to do with maddox, I'm a good human being because my father was strict with me, and I know many people who feel the same way.

[Beckwin]

beat your kids rah rah rah shut the fuck up

[BerenTebogo]

So then you're saying your happy with the continuing trend among children these days to completely slip into irrationality, and much more serious trouble than we ever got into?

Getting high off of human feces, there's a great example. The boundaries parents set in general are far too lax, and as a result you get, well, kids getting high off shit and little kids in dresses getting shot.

You'll excuse me if I yearn for the days of a stern spanking and a dress code.

[Beckwin]

So your reply to a kid getting shot is that parents shouldn't let their kids dress like flaming faggots and on top of that, to beat them.

I mean, it's not like brutal violence is the issue at hand here.

[BerenTebogo]

I'm not saying punch your kids in the face, but if I fucked up, I got a hand upside the head, not with the intent to hurt me but to let me know I was disappointing him and then I did fucking yardwork, for days.

I'm not advocating getting drunk and tossing your kid around like a rag doll, I am advocating a stern hand and some rules.

[Tyche]

I'm usually a fairly jaded wanderer of the internet, but for some reason I'm floored by many of the attitudes in this thread (mostly those on the first page). It's not that it's worse than many of the attitudes in other threads on this forum, but for some reason I didn't expect it from this situation. Kudos to Kuya, Tonko, and Lexa though, for your excellent and reasonable replies (maybe one or two others that I missed).


Maybe fighting back, even in a non-violent way, was not "smart", but that doesn't mean it wasn't still the right thing to do. It is often, in fact, very hard to do the right thing.

Maybe it wasn't "smart" for him to dress how he did, or act how he did. Maybe it isn't "smart" for women to wear revealing clothing if they don't want to get raped or harassed. Maybe it isn't "smart" for black people to act like they expect the treatment of an equal, in certain parts of certain places. But what is WRONG with doing it? Nothing. People shouldn't be in fear of their safety, for being themselves, in a way that harms absolutely no one. What does it say about our society, that they should have to?

Unfortunately, we don't live in a Utopian society where all of this applies. People shouldn't be afraid for being themselves, but they should have an awareness of how they will come across to others and know how to properly handle the situation when you get the bad apples of society to provoke you. Black people are usually well educated on how to handle racists (in most cases, maybe a black person can inform me if they know how to handle racism at 15, I'd assume their parents educated them well before they entered junior high), women are well-educated on how to handle drunk males at a bar, and gay guys should be educated on how to handle hecklers before they go out in heels and a dress. Now obviously, you can't stop the extreme like hate crimes against blacks, abduction/rape of females, and shooting someone in the head for being gay, but you should educate yourself as best as possible to avoid potential escalating situations. I just don't think he handled the bullying well. I don't know if you read the actual article (not just Kuya's cliffnotes), you'd get the impression that this was reoccurring, and through other kid's accounts, all parties involved seemed to have a firm grasp on the situation. We act like being gay and 15 is an automatic exclusion from being prone to making poor decisions. I'm sorry, this isn't the case. Yeah, he died, it's a terrible tragedy, but just because he died and he's gay doesn't mean he isn't at or below the same maturity level of his provokers (I'm trying hard to separate the bullying from the shooting here, the shooting is inexcusable). I'm not trying to diminish the tragedy or the shooting what-so-ever, I'm just trying to show that just because a kid died, and he's gay does not give him a pass. Sorry.

Take out the gay from the story and just say "One kid was bullied, he bullied back, he got shot". We'd all agree noone handled the situation properly.

[Stumblingdrunk]

I'm a good human being

I'm sure the number of people who post/lurk on these boards that disagree with that statement would be kind of large

[BerenTebogo]

I'm a good human being

I'm sure the number of people who post/lurk on these boards that disagree with that statement would be kind of large

You'd probably be correct, but my ridiculing of people and stance against blatant idiocy aside, you'll find I'm a very even-minded person, I don't like extremists of any group, but I'm honest, I treat my family and fellow humans well, and I function well in my surrounding.

Am I a saint? No, but I keep my nose clean, and I think that's I fit the standard where I can say that morally, I'm a good person.

[Kuya]

I remember a good time, where parents used to be stern with their kids, there was real discipline there. It was a time, where you could beat your daughter for wearing pants, where blacks weren't really people, where gays were aberrations of nature and therefore should be executed, where killing thousands of people was ok because they were protestants, where killing women who practiced medicine was ok becaue they were witches, where a woman's body was her parents' object, and where getting pregnant at the age of 12 was perfectly ok even though today that's actually considered rebellious.

Those times where parents were stricter with their kids were better times, it has nothing to do with the fact that people always think the era they currently live is actually worse than the ones before.

but my ridiculing of people and stance against blatant idiocy aside

What's the stance on yourself then?

[Stumblingdrunk]

I'm a good human being

I'm sure the number of people who post/lurk on these boards that disagree with that statement would be kind of large

You'd probably be correct, but my ridiculing of people and stance against blatant idiocy aside, you'll find I'm a very even-minded person, I don't like extremists of any group, but I'm honest, I treat my family and fellow humans well, and I function well in my surrounding.

Am I a saint? No, but I keep my nose clean, and I think that's I fit the standard where I can say that morally, I'm a good person.

Have you ever thought that maybe your upbringing might have something to do with why you tend to be so quick to anger, and be predisposed to violence?

[BerenTebogo]

I'm a good human being

I'm sure the number of people who post/lurk on these boards that disagree with that statement would be kind of large

You'd probably be correct, but my ridiculing of people and stance against blatant idiocy aside, you'll find I'm a very even-minded person, I don't like extremists of any group, but I'm honest, I treat my family and fellow humans well, and I function well in my surrounding.

Am I a saint? No, but I keep my nose clean, and I think that's I fit the standard where I can say that morally, I'm a good person.

Have you ever thought that maybe your upbringing might have something to do with why you tend to be so quick to anger, and be predisposed to violence?

Violence? Believe I already stated I'm pretty laid back, and I'm not quick to anger either, I may dish out a quick, stinging retort, hell I may even press the caps lock key for added effect, but it's rare anything other than blatant, repeated, belligerent idiocy in the face of rationality that gets me going. That and I have a thing for extremely drunk guys getting too hands-on with women, I won't stand for that, period.

If you want to cite me for the latter, be my guest.

Edit: and for the record, most of the time as I'm writing my "BIG ANGRY RANTS" I'm actually doing so with a smile on my face or laughing, it's all in good fun for me, there are a few people I genuinely don't like but that's normal.

[Plow]

Larry King was a gay eighth-grader who used to come to school in makeup, high heels and earrings

Wow, learn something new every day.

[Deejay]

Finally, I thought of a situation that parallels the one in the story:

Suppose a loud obnoxious black girl is on her cell phone riding the bus. You, the observer, are incredibly intolerant of loud, obnoxious black women. You say to the loud obnoxious black girl, "hey, will shut the fuck up with your loud talking? It's annoying the fuck out of me and I hate it. You loud obnoxious black girls need to learn to shut the fuck up." The black girl responds by not only screaming louder into her phone, but approaches you and screams into your face as she screams into the phone. Growing increasingly more angry, you decide to shoot the girl weeks later after she continues to talk loudly on her cell phone around you.

Does this make your actions ok? Hell no, but isn't she also in the wrong for purposefully provoking you? The article said that the boy wore womens clothing to school. I'm betting that this is the inherent reason why he was getting picked on. Provoking the boys and making the situation worse for himself by hitting on them is the reason why I said he made a bad choice. If he chose to just simply say that he doesn't care what the bigots think, he may still be alive.

K now i'm finally done.

[Kuya]

You shot her.

I'm i taking crazy pills here, or does it seem like some people are really trying too hard to find a way to blame something on the gay kid?

edit: the example was terrible, you have the black woman actively doing something that anyone would find annoying, a kid using make up and heels is a completely different situation. Another problem, you shot her for yelling, you shot her, honestly now. The guy who shot her wasn't even a racist apperently, he just hated her yelling, as opposed to kids being expertly trained in the arts of gays are bad.

[BerenTebogo]

In case it's not coming across, I'm 100% blaming the parents.

[Deejay]

No ones blaming him, i'm saying that if it were my son I would have told him to handle the situation differently.

[Tyche]

I wish I could shoot black people in movie theaters

[Stumblingdrunk]

Violence? Believe I already stated I'm pretty laid back, and I'm not quick to anger either, I may dish out a quick, stinging retort, hell I may even press the caps lock key for added effect, but it's rare anything other than blatant, repeated, belligerent idiocy in the face of rationality that gets me going. That and I have a thing for extremely drunk guys getting too hands-on with women, I won't stand for that, period.

If you want to cite me for the latter, be my guest.

Edit: and for the record, most of the time as I'm writing my "BIG ANGRY RANTS" I'm actually doing so with a smile on my face or laughing, it's all in good fun for me, there are a few people I genuinely don't like but that's normal.

I would have beat him rotten.

should he have had his clock cleaned? Yeah,

Beat your kids

I've gotten my ass kicked and I've kicked ass,

I know the last one may not seem so bad but, there are plenty of people who go their entire lives never getting into fights. I'm not going to bother going further than this post for quotes.