15 year old gay kid, killed

[Remyo]

If he was mature enough to ignore it, or report it to teachers, or the hundreds of other ways to help the issue he may still be alive. He (King) chose to be an enabler to the problem instead of trying to be a solution.

You realize of course that many a bully, when stood up to, will find a better doormat of a target and leave the kid that stands up to him alone. Many bullies when faced with the prospect of being hit on and emasculated in front of his friends will just pick a different target, therefore this retaliation that Larry engaged in very well could've solved the problem.

it didn't.

And there is no plan of action he could've taken that would've worked for certain. This could've worked, as could've other things. You don't know til you try, but it wasn't "a bad plan".

he got shot in the fucking head how is that not a bad plan?

[Deejay]

If he was mature enough to ignore it, or report it to teachers, or the hundreds of other ways to help the issue he may still be alive. He (King) chose to be an enabler to the problem instead of trying to be a solution.

You realize of course that many a bully, when stood up to, will find a better doormat of a target and leave the kid that stands up to him alone. Many bullies when faced with the prospect of being hit on and emasculated in front of his friends will just pick a different target, therefore this retaliation that Larry engaged in very well could've solved the problem.

it didn't.

And there is no plan of action he could've taken that would've worked for certain. This could've worked, as could've other things. You don't know til you try, but it wasn't "a bad plan".

You honestly think hitting on an obvious homophobe isn't opening up yourself for physical retaliation? Be realistic.

[Tonko]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apY0zq4dHd0&watch_response

Looks like a normal kid to me.

Of all of the fucking songs to have for the background...

Watched it without sound.

[archibaldcrane]

You honestly think hitting on an obvious homophobe isn't opening up yourself for physical retaliation? Be realistic.

It absolutely is opening yourself up for physical retaliation. It's also a method that could result in the bully leaving you alone. It could've worked, it didn't. You, sadly, shouldn't undertake this course of action if you aren't ready to get in a fight because of it, but getting into a fight isn't the end of the world. Again, it comes down to how much fear you are willing to live with as far as how it guides your actions. Good plans can have bad results, because you can't predict everything. Saying the kid should've expected to get shot is completely unreasonable, and arguing that the outcome defines whether the course of action was advisable is equally foolish. You can't live in fear of murder at the hands of a 14-year old.

[Remyo]

You honestly think hitting on an obvious homophobe isn't opening up yourself for physical retaliation? Be realistic.

It absolutely is opening yourself up for physical retaliation. It's also a method that could result in the bully leaving you alone. It could've worked, it didn't. You, sadly, shouldn't undertake this course of action if you aren't ready to get in a fight because of it, but getting into a fight isn't the end of the world.

he got shot, his world was ended. of all the cases I have heard of where this plan was implemented all users were killed. there were no survivors.

[archibaldcrane]

Yeah, he really should've known better - in fact, how dare he mock his bully!. Why didn't he have remyo's foresight and know he would've gotten murdered. What a stupid kid.

[Tonko]

Remoyo: Quit trolling. This thread in particular for starters. Posting in this thread again without contributing something constructive to the conversation will see you banned.

[Cyn]

Well, for better or worse, Remyo is still alive.

[Remyo]

Yeah, he really should've known better - in fact, how dare he mock his bully!. Why didn't he have remyo's foresight and know he would've gotten murdered. What a stupid kid.

pretty much. With the way shit happens these days with bullies and retaliations to bullies, people need to be a little smarter about it.

[archibaldcrane]

To clear up a couple things - from the article:

"He didn't like people insulting him," said his friend Miriam Lopez, 13. "Larry was brave enough to bring high heels and makeup to school and he wasn't afraid of anything."

Jerry Dannenberg, superintendent of the Hueneme School District...said that King was free to wear women's accessories with his uniform of white shirt and dark pants because the dress code prohibits only those items that could be a safety threat, such as steel-toed shoes.

"If girls are wearing jewelry, you can't stop boys from wearing it, too," he said. "Each gender has the right to wear what the other does."

[archibaldcrane]

Yeah, he really should've known better - in fact, how dare he mock his bully!. Why didn't he have remyo's foresight and know he would've gotten murdered. What a stupid kid.

pretty much. With the way shit happens these days with bullies and retaliations to bullies, people need to be a little smarter about it.

Shouldn't the bully have been as afraid of Larry as Larry should've been of the bully, in your "be afraid of everything" universe?

[Rhinox]

Sorry for the late post but I've read people try to pin this on age. Something somewhat similar happened before here. I personally believe age did have something to do with it. I mean I remember when i was 15 i was extremely homophobic but that was because of ignorance rather then actual hatred. I had never associated with gays in anyway til college so the only thing i had to go on was what other people (sadly friends and family) were telling me. that being said theres no excuse for murder no matter what the cause. I think what the son did is telling about how he was raised on. what his friends and family views are and by extension his friends families views on homosexuals.


Edit:fail at grammer

[Remyo]

Yeah, he really should've known better - in fact, how dare he mock his bully!. Why didn't he have remyo's foresight and know he would've gotten murdered. What a stupid kid.

pretty much. With the way shit happens these days with bullies and retaliations to bullies, people need to be a little smarter about it.

Shouldn't the bully have been as afraid of Larry as Larry should've been of the bully, in your "be afraid of everything" universe?

you mistake fear with respect, not in the respect him because he is a homo, but respect him because people go batshit crazy these days.

[archibaldcrane]

I'm amazed that in 10 pages no one has brought up the typical (laughable) defense for this crime:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay_panic_defense

According to the gay panic defense, the defendant claims that he or she was the object of romantic or sexual advances by the victim. The defendant found the propositions so offensive and frightening that it brought on a psychotic state characterized by unusual violence.

[Ryushii]

I read the first two pages and the last two, and wanted to throw my hat in the ring:

To the people trying to blame Larry King: I agree completely with the idea that the easiest way to deal with a bully is to show him/her that their words/actions have no effect on you. I was heavily bullied during middle school (not gonna lie, I still carry a few emotional scars from it). I was called gay (I'm not) and everything. Everytime anyone would get on me and try to drag me down, I'd cry and scream and get upset. Everytime I let them hurt me it became easier and easier for them to get to me. I remember spending an entire period in the bathroom cryingand crying, with the counselor outside the door asking me to come out and everything, all because of one silly comment made to me by a kid during lunch. The point here is that kids in middle school are brutal, and I'm certain I'm not the only one that was unable to stand up against my bullies.

That being said, imagine how things would have changed had I not let them bother me. Eventually they would have gotten tired of trying to get to me and would have found a more intertaining topic. Do you persist in something that has no forseeable profit? Bullies pick on kids to see it get to them, for a feeling of power and control. If their words or actions are having no effect on their victims, then they aren't feeling that power nor that satisfaction. That's why bullies always target the kids that are most easily affected: it creates the easiest, greatest satisfaction.

This kid, the gay kid, showed the bullies that he was not going to let their taunts affect him. Yes, dressing like a drag queen gets you made fun of in school, duh. Even with him acting strong and flirting with the guys to get them to lay off, he was still bound to recieve that torment until he either changed his ways or they grew out of the bullying stage (post HS most likely). Was that going to lead to physical violence? Most likely. Emotional violence? Definately. Murder? Hell no. I don't care what the hell you think about this kid's tactics or his dress and manner. I sure as hell don't think he should have dressed that way, but do you honestly think this would have ended differently if he were in normal clothes? He was still acting gay and flirting with the bullies. And that disturbed one of them enough to kill him. Stop blaming dress codes or the kid's actions. His attempts to quell his tormentors were exactly what a bullied student should do: fight back and give them a taste of their own medicine. In any normal situation it would work perfectly well.

As far as blame goes, I am not so certain. I see the biggest problems being gun control (how the hell do kids keep getting guns?), schools ineffectively dealing with bullying (always a problem even in normal situations), parents of the killer not dealing with their child effectively (whether the child had mental problems, upbringing problems or whatnot), and social norms causing this severe reaction from the child.

Long post done.

[archibaldcrane]

you mistake fear with respect, not in the respect him because he is a homo, but respect him because people go batshit crazy these days.

Not acting a certain way because you think someone might go bat-shit crazy isn't not acting out of respect, it's not acting out of fear. I'm not mistaking one for the other.

[Cyn]

Why is that so amazing? Nobody here is even attempting to defend it.

[Remyo]

you mistake fear with respect, not in the respect him because he is a homo, but respect him because people go batshit crazy these days.

Not acting a certain way because you think someone might go bat-shit crazy isn't not acting out of respect, it's not acting out of fear. I'm not mistaking one for the other.

sense this post makes none.

[archibaldcrane]

Read you should learn to.

[Remyo]

Read you should learn to.

isn't not acting out of respect, it's not acting out of fear. I'm not mistaking one for the other.

Is not not acting out of respect = acting out of respect
it's not acting out of fear

how is that a rebuttal? Help me learn oh great and tolerant archibald.