Sorcerer's Ring

[Zosi]

Sounds like you just gave it a try with your sorc belt setup instead of figuring out what your actual target value is. Try it with the obi and see if you still activate it, and you'll be fine. If it doesn't, then yes, you'll need another hp- piece of gear to activate for obi. Also, if you want us to figure it out for you, you need to post your naked hp.

Naked HP is irrelevant. HP in nuking gear is what matters. Things like AF2 belt and Prism Cape raise your HP, which *DOES* affect the activation point.

[Ansems]

I couldnt try it cause its not ice or thun's day yet, but my naked hp on blm is 988.

[shieldsofwindurst]

Sounds like you just gave it a try with your sorc belt setup instead of figuring out what your actual target value is. Try it with the obi and see if you still activate it, and you'll be fine. If it doesn't, then yes, you'll need another hp- piece of gear to activate for obi. Also, if you want us to figure it out for you, you need to post your naked hp.

Naked HP is irrelevant. HP in nuking gear is what matters. Things like AF2 belt and Prism Cape raise your HP, which *DOES* affect the activation point.

-sigh- If we know his naked hp and we know his gear (and he posted it, so we do) then we can FIGURE OUT what the activation point is. I'm doing the math now.

[Omniyoji]

Post on another forum about said topic:

clicky here

[shieldsofwindurst]

Your -hp set gives:
zenith crown (-50)
zenith mitts (-50)
ether ring (-30)
electrum ring (-20)
blue cape (-15)
rostrums (-30)
penitent (-20)
50 + 50 + 30 + 20 + 15 + 30 + 20 = 215

For non-obi set:
988 + 20 (sorc belt) + 10 (prism cape) = 1018 *.75 = 763.5. Therefore target hp is ~763. Therefore you need a gearset that gives 988 - 763 = ~225 hp- to activate latent. (Not sure why this works then, I must be missing something)

For obi set:
988 + 10 (prism cape) = 998 * .75 = 748.5. Therefore target hp is ~748. Therefore you need a gearset that gives 988 - 745 = ~243 hp- to activate latent. Therefore, regardless of whatever minor thing I must be missing with the non-obi set, you will need another piece of about -20 hp to activate in an obi setup.

Edit: Assumed you had HQ blue cape.

[Chen]

was thinking about making this same thread as i've been confused about this for a while now.

i bought this ring for my gf a few months back and i have never seen a big difference like the one i was expecting when i got it, now after reading thread and the complications i'm wondering if the gear set she's using isnt working.

she's a taru, and with /whm she has 774hp. and /rdm 792hp.
so she needs. 580hp /whm and 594 /rdm, as far as i know (going for 75% hp exactly)
meaning -194 hp on whm, and - 198 on rdm

her gear is..
hairpin -12hp
ivory sickle 10hp converted
blue cape, 15hp converted
p.rope -20hp (nukes with this on)
errant feet, -20hp
ether/serket converted 80hp
z.mitts 50hp converted (nukes with this on)

that gives -207hp, when its all on. but she's nuking with 70 of that -hp on, (convert 50, and -20)
so she's well under the 75% of naked mark, but does the nuking with -hp ruin anything? i have a tiphia sting which i use on whm/nin(don't judge me ;; lol) will she need that, or is current gear working enough?

anyway, i know i should probably be able to work this out myself but for some reason it seems to confuse me, would just like question cleared up, would help to justify spending 1.1mil on this

edit: also switchs to prizm cape to nuke for is it +10hp?

[shieldsofwindurst]

@Chen:
If you have the ring active you *will* notice. It's a good 80-160 extra dmg. Doing your calculations, 792 hp @ /rdm:
792 - 20 (penitent rope) = 772 * .75 = 579 hp to activate. 792 - 207 hp = 585 hp, so yes, you are indeed not activating your ring. Similarly, 774 @ /whm -20 = 754 * .75 = 565.5, & 774-207 = 567, which is again JUST off. If you want proof, grab a poison potion and go out and double check.

[Chen]

thanks alot Shield, thats a really good answer ^^

[shieldsofwindurst]

np man

[Ansems]

Your -hp set gives:
zenith crown (-50)
zenith mitts (-50)
ether ring (-30)
electrum ring (-20)
blue cape (-15)
rostrums (-30)
penitent (-20)
50 + 50 + 30 + 20 + 15 + 30 + 20 = 215

For non-obi set:
988 + 20 (sorc belt) + 10 (prism cape) = 1018 *.75 = 763.5. Therefore target hp is ~763. Therefore you need a gearset that gives 988 - 763 = ~225 hp- to activate latent. (Not sure why this works then, I must be missing something)

For obi set:
988 + 10 (prism cape) = 998 * .75 = 748.5. Therefore target hp is ~748. Therefore you need a gearset that gives 988 - 745 = ~243 hp- to activate latent. Therefore, regardless of whatever minor thing I must be missing with the non-obi set, you will need another piece of about -20 hp to activate in an obi setup.

Edit: Assumed you had HQ blue cape.

>_> I tested it again and it didnt work, either way I know what I need to get now, thank you so very much guys.

[Suiram]

Okay, so I've been playing around some. Like I was trying to say before, it has never been confirmed that all of your HP+/- gear is used in the calculation of your latent HP%, and it turns out it isn't, but rather than the visible gear vs. accessories thing, the only one that I tested that didn't work was back slot for whatever reason. So in summary:

The following affects Max HP for the purposes of latent calculation:
Main
Sub
Ammo
Head
Neck
Ear1 (L.ear)
Ear2 (R.ear)
Body
Hand
Ring1 (L.ring)
Waist
Legs
Feet
HP merits

The following does not affect Max HP for the purposes of latent calculation:
Ring2 (R.ring)
Back
Convert HP>MP gear
HP+% gear
Food

Unknown effect
Range

Beyond that, the function just seems to be current/total < 76%, so basically for now, unless you are using any gear with HP +/- in the slots listed as "Unknown" (read: I didn't bring gear for that slot with HP on it to test), then use your latent macro, unequip your back piece and any convert HP > MP or HP+% gear you have and type "<hpp>" and if you get 75% or lower you're good.

Proof of the back thing and evidence of the < 76% thing:
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/5...tuffet8.th.jpg

[Ansems]

I have 2 hp merits

[Suiram]

Well then, for now the people without HP merits can use that, and you can test for us later to see if they affect it.

[Seditedi]

Sorry if I'm repeating something that was already said lol.
But best example of it is that it works of your total HP before convert HP->MP gear even if you are wearing HP+ gear.

Say I'm a Galka BLM with 1000 HP and I used Sorcerer's Belt putting me at 1020 HP. The HP to activate latent would be (1020)(.75) so 765 HP.
Even if I slap on Zenith Mitts making my total HP 970, it will still get latent activated at less than 765 HP ( but you will not be in yellow).

Any other questions just PM me.

[shieldsofwindurst]

Okay, so I've been playing around some. Like I was trying to say before, it has never been confirmed that all of your HP+/- gear is used in the calculation of your latent HP%, and it turns out it isn't, but rather than the visible gear vs. accessories thing, the only one that I tested that didn't work was back slot for whatever reason. So in summary:

The following affects Max HP for the purposes of latent calculation:
Ammo
Head
Body
Ring
Waist
Legs
Feet

The following does not affect Max HP for the purposes of latent calculation:
Back
Convert HP>MP gear

Unknown effect
Main
Sub
Range
Neck
Ear
Hand
HP merits
Food

Beyond that, the function just seems to be current/total < 76%, so basically for now, unless you have HP merits, have eaten food with HP+ in it or are using any gear with HP +/- in the slots listed as "Unknown" (read: I didn't bring gear for that slot with HP on it to test), then use your latent macro, unequip your back piece and any convert HP > MP gear you have and type "<hpp>" and if you get 75% or lower you're good.

Proof of the back thing and evidence of the < 76% thing:
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/5...tuffet8.th.jpg

I'm confused then because I rely on my prism cape to keep me under 75%. I have 968 base hp, I wear prism & penitent while nuking, which puts me at effective 958. 958 * .75 = 718.5, and I macro down to 718 to activate. I know 718 activates since I've been using it for a year. I also tested with ppots and found the activation point to be about 720 or so.

If what you say is true about the back piece, that would put me at 968 - 20 = 948 * .76 = 720.48 so 720 or less, which works out... hmm. The calculation changes slightly but it's almost insignificant. Good to know.

[Seditedi]

I don't see how back would affect it any differently either.

[Suiram]

I don't see why either, just that it does. Another interesting note is that yellow HP is <75% so you have about a 6-10 HP buffer where you can trigger latent without blood aggro if you use morrigan cuffs instead of zenith mitts (unless you use rainbow/prism cape).

[_chuchu]

For my taru, I use this to push down:
Zenith Crown; 50
Zenith Slacks; 50
Blue Cape; 30
Zenith Mitts; 50
Rostrum Pumps; 30
/equip ring1 "sorcerer's Ring"


Then separately equip these after via macro:

/equip back "Prism Cape"
/equip head "demon helm +1"
/equip neck <insert your neck piece here> >_>
/equip ear2 "Novio Earring"
/equip ear1 "Moldavite Earring"
/equip body "Genie Weskit"
/equip back "Prism Cape"
/equip waist "Sorcerer's belt"
/equip legs "Mahatma Slops"
/equip feet "Yigit Crackows"
/equip ring2 "Tamas Ring"

You can use black cotehardie for yourself, hq version of blue cape, ether/astral/electrum combos, tiphia sting, and other gear you can still get on the auction house cheap if you do not want to go deep into zenith. Once you get close to the target hp, go through your HP swap macros to nuke gear in z mitts and take off your mitts. If your hp turns yellow, congrats you are "tapping the latent" with z mitts on.

Edit: don't forget to equip the ring!

[Suiram]

Tested HP merits and food, and updated my earlier post.

HP merits are factored into your max HP. Taru BLM/RDM with 4 HP merits 612/812 (75%) got latent, whereas if it had been calculated prior to merits it would have been 612/772 (79%). Food does not count toward max HP, as Hume BLM/WAR with Tiphia Sting I was 749/984 (76%) and latent was not active, eating a taco I was 749/1004 (74%), in which case latent should have activated but did not.

[Kaeko]

Really interesting. I actually always counted back (+10 HP Prism) when doing this calculation. I also always used 75% and not 76% as well. Turns out I still proc. it correctly (just barely, by 4 HP) even doing it wrong though.