Suggestions for SE (to help combat RMTs) *revised* subject

[Maxxthepenguin]

They are dealing with RMTs very well... I really don't have complaints anymore. The process is kind of slow but that's necessary to verify RMTness. They remove exploits that are quick and easy to exploit on a regular basis. They are a reality and they're being dealt with realistically. They don't absolutely dominate much anymore. Losing a mining point in Zhayolm to a RMT instead of a player is no big deal to me, it's not like they have a lockdown on the market.

At this point, thinking we need drastic changes is silly.

Note: This is talking about ingame exploits by RMTs, not hacking accounts. That is a separate issue that SE needs to step up on.

[Deathmist]

Yea Maxx, I'm talking about account hacks which SE does need to step it up on.

I'm just wondered if making adjustments to a handful of items for now would be considered a drastic change?

It's really just a thought I had, to help limit the potential gains RMTs could gain when they do hack an account.

Would hope that would dissuade more hacking going forward, and force RMTs to actually have to play the game and collect seals to make gil4sale if they really want.

Just hoping that would cut down on RMT profits, reduce RMT activity, and definitely limit the kind of aggravation they can bring to us regular players.

Thanks.

[#686578]

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[Deathmist]

They are dealing with RMTs very well... I really don't have complaints anymore. The process is kind of slow but that's necessary to verify RMTness. They remove exploits that are quick and easy to exploit on a regular basis. They are a reality and they're being dealt with realistically. They don't absolutely dominate much anymore. Losing a mining point in Zhayolm to a RMT instead of a player is no big deal to me, it's not like they have a lockdown on the market.

At this point, thinking we need drastic changes is silly.

Note: This is talking about ingame exploits by RMTs, not hacking accounts. That is a separate issue that SE needs to step up on.

Max said what I was trying to say. but nicely and intelligently, about nonhacking attempts at least.

Ya, that is true.

But when it comes to hacked accounts SE still has a long way to go.

In addition to implementing strategies like freezing accounts, and vamping up their ex/ra item recovery for hacked accounts, they could try to combat RMT activity in other ways.

I think by limiting the amount of payoff they could get for certain items that drop from HNMs would hamper the drive of these RMTs.

It's like this, if an RMT strikes gold and he gets a couple of hundred bucks per hacked account, is he gonna stop? He most likely will keep trying to milk it as best he can until something better comes along.

But if SE implements more obstacles and stratagems to impede RMTs before they hack accounts, then it could demoralize them. Hopefully it would cause them to realize that the time and effort they put into hacking accounts just doesn't add up to quick and big profit.

That could force them to have to make gil like the rest of us, or move on to some other MMORPG that is easier to exploit, etc.

[#686578]

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[ronin sparthos]

I wanted to text zoom this, but I'm distracted at the moment. Also it probably just woulda turned out queer so.

But if SE implements more obstacles and stratagems to impede RMTs before they hack accounts, then it could demoralize them. Hopefully it would cause them to realize that the time and effort they put into hacking accounts just doesn't add up to quick and big profit.

Did you forget who you're talking about?

Why would RMT be demoralized by using accounts that dont even belong to them, all they need is about 15mins to empty a character of the immediate items of value, 1hour to clear all ISP, AN, CP and Assault points? If even that much.

I imagine gil turns over quite quickly, so it'd be a matter of selling the money stolen from an account within a few days to get under the SE ban-radar, by that point they could care less if the account goes to hell in a handbasket.

I imagine the only demoralizing thing is when the bank gets banned, that might sting some.

RMT will never truely leave any MMO, none have ever been truely free of RMT even when the company sells their own currency in some kinda online shop. The best that can be done is to suppress all the strategies used by RMT as rapidly as possible to minimize collateral damage.

[SohJai]

I have some ideas reading this thread in regards to hacked accounts.

1. Locking items- Let users lock any item and let them choose the amount of days it takes to unlock. Locking makes it act like rare/ex and unthrowable.

Example - You chose to lock your Onion Sword , 2 days to unlock. Now your friend offers you 100,000gil for it. You go in and unlock it but you have to wait the 2 days before you can sell it to your friend.

Every time you log on, a message with the time left of unlocked would display in case someone tries to unlock your item without you noticing.

Bazaar items- Locked items cannot be bazaared. Bazaared items can be locked and taken off bazaar during locked period, but price cannot change. Sold locked items will have the gil gained locked for the remaining lock period.

This buys time for users to freeze their account and protect their locked items when they find out they are hacked.


Freezing- Not sure how accounts are freezed now. But I think any history CC info of that account is sufficient to instantly freeze an account for investigation, through a simple process form on their site. This wouldn't protect you from your friends, who has paid for you, to freeze your account and lot your Magicked Skull =X



2. Another idea I got for trusting friends.

Lend option- let players lend gear for set period of time. When the time is up, gear is sent back to the owner.

The owner will have 1 reserved spot for the returned item in the case he is full and the item cannot return.

Not sure if SE can take items out and in from inventory of offline players, in the case the lender or owner are offline.

Lease time can increase or decrease if and only if both lender and owner agree through some option.

This wouldn't work for consumed items.


These are probably too hard to implement in though. =/

[yrpaine]

with the whole lending thing, there should be away to make a temporary item on the borrower which is rare/ex/temp of the item. Then keep a rare/ex non-equipable version on the owner. have rate/ex/temp dissapear after time is hit and allow owner to trade rare/ex non-equipable to npc after time is reached to obtain normal one back.

but this would take far too much practicality and foresight by SE.

[Mystics]

I haven't read much just skimmed through so I think im gonna add my two cents -.-

1) Having some kind of option to only let 1 or certain IP address's listed to access the account
-would have to call SE to verify what's ur IP address though
-Over all if this is possibe this could solve the hacking issue period unless the RMT managed to get enough info to call SE and have the IP(s) changed... Could do the lolNotary thing but might take forever and somewhere down the line the IP may change could be because of Dynamic Address that change or you could get another service or something...

2)Tracking items: it would be cool to have a unique number on ever piece of equipment out or just rare items
-could look in history at the time the account was claimed to be hacked and look at the item number then possibly track down the item from that time to today seeing who it has passed through and is using it.

[Avanarius]

I guess everyone here actually assumes this game is still alive and SE cares about it..lolz

well /comfort to you guys :D

I just want folders in my inventory to sort my mass amount of garbage out.

[siknoz]

3. More ways to make gil that can't be monopolized by a small group (i.e. RMT). SE did a great job removing all this RMT'd gil from the community, but now everyone is broke. My shit sits on auction for weeks before it sells. Maybe adjusting the gil reward from existing quests to match today's economy? But have them be repeatable only every so often so as to circumvent spamming by RMT.

BINGO

Now that SE made most the NM's drop rare/ex stuff, whats left to sell? Especially now since there are newer items that are rare/ex which are better than the old gear that is still sellable.

[BRP]

http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/i...rl/lolKrye.gif

Dead meme is a pretty cool guy. eh, people keep on messing up the first part and doesn't afraid of anything.


EDIT:

Oh, I should be on topic. They can include a lot of gil sources(from NPCs/quests/etc) and just continue to ban gil sellers. Sure RMT will exist, but huge amounts of money are still going to be deleted. RMT go from a problem to becoming a vital tool. Make these gil sources time consuming to reach(best thing I can think of is leveling a craft), so that they don't have time to exploit it much.

[Pace]

bad idea, hurts players, kills economy even more than it is now, and has no hope of combatting rmt.

RMT will just move onto another item, or another means of making gilz. Just need to face the truth, rmt is as much apart of this game as the Developers of this game have been.

If anything, IF SE has to do ANYTHING, they must fix and settle the "getting account hacked" issue. What does it matter if the items are rare/ex when they can hack your account and sell the rest of the shit you own in a matter of minutes.

[The Stig]

I haven't read much just skimmed through so I think im gonna add my two cents -.-

1) Having some kind of option to only let 1 or certain IP address's listed to access the account
-would have to call SE to verify what's ur IP address though
-Over all if this is possibe this could solve the hacking issue period unless the RMT managed to get enough info to call SE and have the IP(s) changed... Could do the lolNotary thing but might take forever and somewhere down the line the IP may change could be because of Dynamic Address that change or you could get another service or something...

This just made me thought, how about MAC Address Filtering instead? MAC Address can be changed but will be damn hard to duplicate without taking full control of someone's PC to find out what it is.

[end quick thought. Gotta run to work!]

[#686578]

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[Hanyoko]

I would approach the issue a different way then SE currently is.

Ok so we have detected that RMT are POSing to do some repeatable quest of some kind... Ok spend some time and figure out a very very fast amount of time an honest player can make that journey; set that as the threshold. If players do this quest well under that time add them to a STF list, each time this occurs raise their priority.

Create honeypots and let them ban themselves.

[Gere]

I can't wait until the day when rmt start POSing "the cold light of day".

[BRP]

bad idea, hurts players, kills economy even more than it is now, and has no hope of combatting rmt.

RMT will just move onto another item, or another means of making gilz. Just need to face the truth, rmt is as much apart of this game as the Developers of this game have been.

Are you actually going to list reasons? Also, the point was RMT was never going away, so banning them is a good to prevent inflation.

[Pace]

ok reasons:

SE made made EHP and LL rare/ex, rmt adapted and stopped camping. SE rare/ex'd fumas o kotes pcc... RMT adapted. Rare/ex versions were free, the rare items were put in bcnms and ksnms.... Rmt adapted and started spamming BC's, which killed the market on some bc ks items like erase... (remember when that was 1m). SE made alky bracelets, thf knife (2 VERY valuable items) poppable which took 25m+ thf knife to what -> 50k-100k, further made alky bracelets from like 30m-> barely 1m..

If all items were made rare/ex or had the option of making things rare/ex by like signing it or w/e, your taking the items worth outa the game. Say i wanted to make my gaiters rare/ex ... 1) my linkshell would be mega pissed, because after all they are not "mine" they are the linkshells 2) you just made a 30m item worth 0 gil congratulations.... 30m outa the game...

Why rmt's could careless. Do you seriously think that all they do is camp items these days? rmt has a hand in every worthwhile gil-making venture... they camp materials, they spam pos hack repeatable quests, they bojack the ah, they scam items, they hack accounts to take gils and items--and this is what players know about... If there was a way of making gilz in this game, 99.9999% of the time rmt have figured it out.

So i redirect this question, what does making herald's gaiters, novio, novia rare/ex really do to fight rmt. How does making 3 items rare/ex hurt rmt. On ragnarok the only time a rmt gets there hands on gaiters or novio, is if they hack it off someones account. If this is applied to regular items like genie weskit or even lame carapace harness or something... why would you want to kill the value.. why would you want to GIVE 3m away by making it rare/ex.

Like i understand you want to get rid of rmt, but at what cost. I know people that lost almost 100m gil because they decided to make thf knife and alky bracelets poppable. Over night, losing 100m gilz because SE thought it was a good idea. What your proposing is players being able to loose there OWN gil on PURPOSE!! While we're at it, why dont we just get rid of gil all together, why dont we get rid of trading, AH, and bazaaring too. Make all items rare/ex and you can only get them by camping and killing the monster. This will stop rmt! oh wait, rmt figured out how to get gil from that too (byakko haidate) : /shout "Byakko haidate" {Do you need it} 3m gilz!

So like i said, the only thing that REALLY should be addressed, is players getting hacked and ALLLLL there items and gil taken and sold in a matter of minutes. rather than making items worthless and gil alltogether worthless, why not fix the issues that REALLY need fixing. At any given moment, what if your account had around 100-200m worth of net gil, seems alot more lucrative to just steal it from them in 2 mins, then to camp, farm it for 1 month. They dont fear account bannings like we do. They seem to have no problems creating a new account and operating behind a proxy server to avoid detection.

I dunno, maybe instead of making items worthless, SE should further improve the apparatus in targetting gil BUYERS!!! and not fuck with the players that play this game legit. Maybe they should target the players who buy accounts (hello berrima) and those who buy gilz (hello unctgtg) and ban them. Maybe less supply side economics and more demand side economics.

My proposal, make it public who buys gilz or sells/buys accounts. Remember ffxiapp? and the drama the ensued from that...
this will never happen, but IMO it stands the best chance of fighting rmt

If you disagree with what im saying, you are entitled to do so, this is just a counterargument, i have respect for all arguments posted here etc...

[ronin sparthos]

Point is at this phase in the game most items of value are R/EX already (endgame, salvage, einherjar specials) so the question of value only comes down to a small handful of items. We all know the main items of value, the rest of the items dont need to be touched in any way at all much like you stated. So SE lets crafters create R/EX enchanted versions of the popular items like haubs, scorp harnesses and vermies - all that does is open up a new market which would stimulate the economy.

Like i understand you want to get rid of rmt, but at what cost. I know people that lost almost 100m gil because they decided to make thf knife and alky bracelets poppable. Over night, losing 100m gilz because SE thought it was a good idea. What your proposing is players being able to loose there OWN gil on PURPOSE!! While we're at it, why dont we just get rid of gil all together, why dont we get rid of trading, AH, and bazaaring too. Make all items rare/ex and you can only get them by camping and killing the monster. This will stop rmt! oh wait, rmt figured out how to get gil from that too (byakko haidate) : /shout "Byakko haidate" {Do you need it} 3m gilz

The THF knife 'fix', alky/pallas 'fix' were controversial but hardly something that negatively affected the game - SE merely took items that at one point were obtainable only by paying off RMT or buying for a rediculous price on the AH obtainable by working for a pop item and killing the NM yourself. Epeens were damaged in the process but ultimately it was a great solution for fixing what had become an RMT/hardcore campers venture. 100m? Maybe 2-3years ago thats how much THF knife was but those were inflated times.

I dont see what the problem with making more items 'pop and drop', you actually get a fair shot at getting what you want and it eliminates the competition factor. (which boils down to basically people botting) Almost every pop NM has been a success ultimately even with the dismal drop rates - people get a chance to at the least *try* for the goal.

This will stop rmt! oh wait, rmt figured out how to get gil from that too (byakko haidate) : /shout "Byakko haidate" {Do you need it} 3m gilz!

Yeah, you have 5mins to make a sale - RMT tried this with Charybdis and they stopped because they couldnt secure buyers fast enough. Yeah, they can sell pop 'n drop items but that doesnt make it as easy as throwing junk on the AH and its also non-intrusive to the main players. Whats worse? RMT selling something they popped from an item or RMT claiming your 4-5 hour lottery spawn NM that can be AH'd?