Chocobo Digging: Elemental Ores

[Thistle]

I've been chocobo digging for more than three and a half years now. I had really thought I knew everything about it, so upon digging up my first elemental ore, I was rather startled by what I got:

http://www.hot-hot-hot-catlove.com/f...WindOreBig.jpg

It was my assumption that you got the same type of ore as whatever weather was happening. (Which makes sense, since you get crystals/clusters of the same type of weather.) Is that incorrect? When I first got on my my bird it was raining, but within seconds it changed to the weather in the screenshot and it stayed that way the whole time -- that zone can't even get wind weather (Sanctuary of Zi'tah).

My digging bird knows Bore, which is why I'm posting instead of just saying my assumption was wrong. Could a raised bird's skills change what kind of elemental ore you get? Or is it really just totally random?

Edit: I belatedly notice it was Windsday when I got it, is it 'matches the day you dig it up, no matter what weather it is'?

[shihei]

Yup, matches the day of the v-week. Waxing Crescent moon phases only. Pretty hard to dig up even at max skill. I got 2 Fire Ores once in Batallia, but I stopped going for ore unless the day was for an ore with a good price since ore prices weren't worth it, when I was still playing, compared to going for Orich. and Coral maybe some Adaman. They were easier to dig up, alot more of them in digging 'pool'.

[Clyne]

it 'matches the day you dig it up, no matter what weather it is'?

This is correct.

And I wanna put this as nicely as possible, but you definatly don't know everything there is to know about Chocobo digging. I think this is the 3rd post of yours I've found on BG that exhibits this. I distinctly remember one from January that I found when searching for something specific:

viewtopic.php?f=31&t=28765&hilit=+chocobo+dig

I didn't find this until March, so I didn't want to necropost, but...yeah. I don't want this to be a personal attack on you, but it would seem that on this particular topic you want to do less posting and more research, cause I can tell you that someone who has no experience whatsoever w/ Chocobo Digging could be more knowledgeable about it in 20 minutes of internet research, than you've exhibited in your posts and your 3+ years of personal experience.

Seems to work for your personal needs, though, and grats on your first Ore!

[Thistle]

Yup, matches the day of the v-week. Waxing Crescent moon phases only. Pretty hard to dig up even at max skill.

Yeah, I knew the moon phase, skill level, weather elements (ha ha) to it, but not the day. Cool, thanks.

Usually I don't go for them, and I hate the waxing crescent moons because it's so impossible to dig anywhere, but my goldsmithing mule can use beads to skill, so...

And I wanna put this as nicely as possible, but you definatly don't know everything there is to know about Chocobo digging.

Please note that I did not say I knew everything about it. I said I thought I did, which (to me) is very different than someone saying outright that they knew everything. If anyone says they know everything about anything in the game, I'd question that statement. No one can know everything, other than (maybe) the SE programmers. I feel/think that I know a lot about digging, but that could be wrong.

I distinctly remember one from January that I found when searching for something specific:

viewtopic.php?f=31&t=28765&hilit=+chocobo+dig

I didn't find this until March, so I didn't want to necropost, but...yeah. I don't want this to be a personal attack on you, but it would seem that on this particular topic you want to do less posting and more research, cause I can tell you that someone who has no experience whatsoever w/ Chocobo Digging could be more knowledgeable about it in 20 minutes of internet research, than you've exhibited in your posts and your 3+ years of personal experience.

What are you disagreeing with in my posts in that thread? I was asked to write the digging section of the BG wiki based on my posts there (which I turned down), so I'd be curious to know your opinions on whatever you're disagreeing with.

[barber2006]

What are you disagreeing with in my posts in that thread? I was asked to write the digging section of the BG wiki based on my posts there (which I turned down), so I'd be curious to know your opinions on whatever you're disagreeing with.

I've been skilling chocobo digging nearly since I started playing, years and years now. I dig daily, without fail. I'm an A15 digger (second highest, top is A10). Thus I scoffed at him claiming he got to be an A10 digger in a year. (IF he did it pre-nerf and IF he botted it (dug 24/7), then maybe I could see it, but no way would a non-bot post-nerf digger get even close in a year.)

Skill level is judged in two ways: Delay after zoning and delay between digs. First thing you have to get rid of is your delay between digs. You start out as being able to dig 60 seconds after zoning and 60 seconds between each dig, then when you level up once you still have 60 seconds between zoning and 30 seconds between digs. (Don't quote me on the numbers, been years since I was that low.) Eventually you get to 60 seconds after zoning with 0 seconds (no delay) between digs. Once you hit that point, each time you level up your delay after zoning shortens.

There are 12 levels, I think. Not a round number like 10. You don't get to be a "named" level until you're near the top. A25, A20, A15, A10. A is for Area, and it means your delay after zoning.

In truth, you really can make good money with digging, and if he really were an A10 digger it would be a selling point. I make more money through my digging than I do through my crafting, but it literally took years of daily digging to skill. In the last three years I missed a total of seven days digging (one vacation and once too sick to get to the computer).


wait times way off
zone times way off
number of levels off
dont need to have botted pre-nerf to hit max in a year (12kish stacks, thats 1k stacks per month or 33 stacks a day. If you had whm 38 pre-nerf you could do that in 90 minutes not counting synthing your finished product. 2 hours if some zones dug out)

Heck, I hit /a10 back in 2005 or early 06 in 8ish months start to finish without even using windower so I know you don't need to bot it.



On another note: from january-april the average take from my max bore/burrow choco at /a10 was 58k/day. That got a little higher after hqing logs/stones/etc, but you max out in like 13 minutes now. Totally sucks. It's pretty sad that somepage and a 3 year old ign thread are still the authorities on digging. It really could use a comprehensive writeup.

[kaisr]

wait times way off
zone times way off
number of levels off
dont need to have botted pre-nerf to hit max in a year (12kish stacks, thats 1k stacks per month or 33 stacks a day. If you had whm 38 pre-nerf you could do that in 90 minutes not counting synthing your finished product. 2 hours if some zones dug out)

Heck, I hit /a10 back in 2005 or early 06 in 8ish months start to finish without even using windower so I know you don't need to bot it.



On another note: from january-april the average take from my max bore/burrow choco at /a10 was 58k/day. That got a little higher after hqing logs/stones/etc, but you max out in like 13 minutes now. Totally sucks. It's pretty sad that somepage and a 3 year old ign thread are still the authorities on digging. It really could use a comprehensive writeup.

how about writing something up then? I've been interested in starting digging but I havent found any decent information which i'd call reliable to begin the apparently long trek

[Guitarman]

It would take somewhere in the neighborhood of 2 years digging to fatigue every day without missing a day to cap out your digging. Figure in you dont get to dig up the really good stuff like ores and whatnot until the highest tiers, I wouldn't recommend starting. I dig for the fun more than the profit. It's nice to turn on /anon and just mindlessly dig after dealing with HNM drama or other assorted bs.

[Thistle]

A25, A20, A15, A10. A is for Area, and it means your delay after zoning.

wait times way off
zone times way off
number of levels off

The hell? Those are the numbers I've seen anywhere I've looked online, the numbers I've heard from other diggers, and the numbers I've experienced in my own digging. What do you feel are the right numbers?

This is the first time I've ever seen anyone disagreeing with those figures.

[shihei]

Don't worry about it the guy seems half retarded to me. The selling point was at A10 he made 58k/day on a bird with bore/burrow. That is somthing I'd get on my worst day of digging ever I guess he doesn't know how to target stuff worth a damn. And bore/burrow actually screw you on getting the original loot pool's valuable items as often, I always dug on a rental.

Those zone times are all correct, some people have to do /6s instead of /5s cause of lag I have heard before, that's all I can think of that would make him say they are 'way off'. The only thing I sort of disagree with is you can actually get A5 in some zones which led me to believe A0 may have been possibly obtainable but it is so hard to tell after you zone, some zones I could dig literally as soon as I zoned in, like rolanberry.

I think they also changed how much is required to level up your skill, and people just tell you not to bother because they don't want people digging up their zones. When I started before the nerf people were also saying "It will take you 7mil+ and a year+ to get to max level" trying to persuade people to not do it. What they weren't saying was the truth, that you would actually make 7mil+ just skilling it up! It's a cutthroat business cause waiting 1 hour for a good zone to refill sucks when there is over a dozen diggers on your server at your time zone. Or figuring out the reloads in the desert..1;15 game time...cause other people were doing the same and keeping it dried out. I was A35 when they nerfed digging however it was also a fix since RMT couldn't bot(human-bot) 24/7 anymore. Was able to get 1 level every month or so and the last 2 levels actually felt like they flew right by. Hot and Cold also helps you get skill ups.

[Majestic]

A25, A20, A15, A10. A is for Area, and it means your delay after zoning.

wait times way off
zone times way off
number of levels off

The hell? Those are the numbers I've seen anywhere I've looked online, the numbers I've heard from other diggers, and the numbers I've experienced in my own digging. What do you feel are the right numbers?

This is the first time I've ever seen anyone disagreeing with those figures.

Well, he has some points. There are 11 levels, not 12. You said:

You start out as being able to dig 60 seconds after zoning and 60 seconds between each dig, then when you level up once you still have 60 seconds between zoning and 30 seconds between digs.

60 seconds between each dig? Are you retarded? It's 16, then 11, then 6, then 0 for the remainder.

About the zone times, you start at 60 seconds from zone until being able to dig, and it goes down 5 seconds per level until you arrive at the highest level, A10.

[Thistle]

Voice of reason.

Thanks, I was starting to feel like I was on Mars or something, nothing was making sense!

I vary between my Bore bird and a rental bird, depending on what I try to get. That's the only place where we're not 100% in agreement.

The only thing I sort of disagree with is you can actually get A5 in some zones which led me to believe A0 may have been possibly obtainable but it is so hard to tell

This morning I was crafting ammo on my wood mule. The low HQs were getting slow HQ animation, then he HQ3ed once and it was fast three-ring animation. For the first time I saw where people were getting that 'you can tell what kind of HQ you're getting from the animation!' idea... but it was really just lag (after that one, I got fast low HQ ones). The amount of lag we see in the game would make it really hard to tell if delays are 0-5-10 seconds. (I personally believe that A10 is the fastest you can get, but what's the point in worrying if it's A10, A5, A0? Is 10 seconds going to make or break someone's day? :D )

Anyway, thanks for the agreement, I really felt like the world had gone upside down or something. I'm totally open to being wrong -- being wrong is a chance to learn something new! But the claims that the basic numbers were wrong just made no sense.

Edit: Typo.

[barber2006]

A25, A20, A15, A10. A is for Area, and it means your delay after zoning.

wait times way off
zone times way off
number of levels off

The hell? Those are the numbers I've seen anywhere I've looked online, the numbers I've heard from other diggers, and the numbers I've experienced in my own digging. What do you feel are the right numbers?

This is the first time I've ever seen anyone disagreeing with those figures.

Yes, your wait times are off. As mentioned it starts at 16......not 60 as you indicated in your post I quoted earlier.
Yes, your zone times are off. Leveling up and keeping /a60 with a /wait 30? No.
Yes, as mentioned your number of levels are off.

Level 0: Area Wait 60, Dig wait 16
Level 1: Area Wait 55, Dig wait 11
Level 2: Area Wait 50, Dig wait 6
Level 3: Area Wait 45, Dig wait 0
Level 4: Area Wait 40, Dig wait 0
Level 5: Area Wait 35, Dig wait 0
Level 6: Area Wait 30, Dig wait 0
Level 7: Area Wait 25, Dig wait 0
Level 8: Area Wait 20, Dig wait 0
Level 9: Area Wait 15, Dig wait 0
Level 10: Area Wait 10, Dig wait 0


And, yes, I average 58k in 13 minutes to fatigue. As I mentioned, due to max woodworking its much more efficient to dig up 58k in TaU then Hq the logs into 90k worth of lumber in 20 minutes then it is to fight the billion people in the deserts getting 6 items before the area depletes everytime. Seriously, you are not talking to someone who recently capped, I'm fully aware that you can make more before fatigue but as someone with ebisu, max fishing, max crafting (wood, cooking, and cloth on 3 characters), and max digging it's much more beneficial to get on my bird and finish than it is to fight the competition that doesn't have other options like I do.

Just sit down for 30 minutes and read this entire thread:

The only things that have changed are burrow/bore, fatigue, and the impact chocobo hot and cold plays on leveling up (and possibly total green count, but people who maxed 3 years ago don't tend to pay attention to that). Seriously, I'm only trying to help. I've easily spent more than 3-4x the greens since I hit max as I did getting to max. Being called out and called a moron by an /a35 and hearing someone who didn't know elemental ore digging conditions say he can't understand how he might be wrong are a bit perplexing to me.

/a0 is a myth unless it takes more than 50k stacks of greens (which I am closing in on). Also, a simple /clock on macro will help clear up your variance in /area times in different zones. If you really want help with area loot pool refreshing times, ori ore refresh times, or a spreadsheet on nearly 800 elemental ores on which part of waxing crescent yields the most, then we can have a discussion......but it won't happen in a thread where in the OP you say "I was wrong" then a few posts later say "What the hell? How can I be wrong? YOU are wrong!"

[barber2006]

I don't spend a lot of time reading forums. In re-reading I see I called an /a10 digger a /a35. My apologies. I certainly understand the investment it takes to ding max level and don't want to take anything away from that accomplishment. I think my point of 90k in 20 minutes>>>>>>>120k in an hour still stands if you have other gil making methods like I do.

[Clyne]

I'm totally open to being wrong -- being wrong is a chance to learn something new! But the claims that the basic numbers were wrong just made no sense.

See the post below yours...hope it CLEARLY makes sense to you now, with him having to hit your over the head with it, rather than you actually looking it up and seeing how you were wrong overall.

And additionally, your dismissal of A5 in the original linked post when you weren't even A10 is almost laughable. I'm not sure I believe it or not, and with lag, yes it probably doesn't make that much difference if at all. But I'd try not to presume to know something I don't have any first hand experience with like that. More than anything, I took issue with your posts in that thread because it does an incredible disservice to the knowledge on the craft with you making a bunch of half-assed comments with nothing to back it up. If it's taken you 3+ years of digging to get to A10, and you only missed a handful of days in that time ever, then I'll offer a small bit of advice: you're doing it wrong.

Even using the old stacks/level numbers under the new 100 item-cap, it shouldn't take you much more than 2 years. And the fact is, those stack numbers no longer apply. I know from personal experience that it's significantly less. So while the account for sale probably didn't get there in a year (it did in fact say MORE THAN a solid year), it's within the realm of possibility that it took around 15 months.

Like I said, glad it works for your personal need. But you ARE wrong about enough of your chocobo digging knowledge that you should just sit back, do some reading, ask more questions like this, and take it as your chance to learn something new.

Don't worry about it the guy seems half retarded to me.

Funny...from my perspective you come across as the bigger retard. You actually have some positive information to contribute to the discussion, but your credibility goes to shit when you side with TC's blatant mis-information as being ok.

The only thing I sort of disagree with is you can actually get A5

If the only thing you sort of disagree with is the A5 issue in that post, you're overlooking quite a bit. The zone times, the wait times, the elemental ore; all these are examples of where we're trying to illustrate to TC is that while he thought he knew everything about digging (as he stated at the start of this topic), he actually has a lot to learn before he should be advising others on the matter. If he had written the BG-wiki topic on digging, it would have been torn to shreads. Thankfully, he seems to have a really good head on his shoulders about the situation, and I'm truthfully really glad he started the topic, so this will come up when people search the boards, rather than the January topic (hopefully).

[Clyne]

how about writing something up then? I've been interested in starting digging but I havent found any decent information which i'd call reliable to begin the apparently long trek

I know I personally don't have the time to write something up from scratch, but if you're interested in it, I can offer a few of the following things:

1. Patience - it won't take THAT long to get to /wait 0, but it is a relatively long time, and it absolutely sucks until you do. /wait 6 isn't too bad, but the first 2 lvls should take you about 3-4 weeks if you dig to fatigue every day. That could be cut down a lot if you also do Hot & Cold religiously, but the effect is really unknown, so it's hard to say how much.

2. Raise a digging bird - I personally have bore & burrow on mine because I'm more concerned with getting my 100 items over and done with rather than maxing my potential gil. But as others have stated, Bore & Burrow typically isn't the best combination. Ideally you'll have another craft that you can use your dug items in conjunction with, so you'll do Bore or Burrow, whichever helps you the most in your target zones. Also, you must have a raised bird in order to participate in Hot & Cold.

3. Inventory - the more free slots to go digging the better

4. Know your competition - nothing worse than arriving at a zone only to find it dug up cause someone is already there.

Plenty more, but that would give you a good start. Hope it works out for you if you try. I'm going to start on my alt-charater soon from scratch, so I hope to be able to generate some more concrete numbers on what it takes in terms of RL time and stacks to lvl from scratch...it's gonna suck.

[aurik]

Levelling choco digging is a real pain since the patch. Trust me, it's still hundreds+ stacks per tier, except you can only do like 15 stacks a day because of fatigue. So whereas prepatch you could easily burn through a hundred on a rainy saturday while not really paying attention, now you have to schedule a bit of time each and every day.

190 stacks into A50 here, virtually all post-patch, before I gave up.

Hot&cold, that may help, dunno. But just raw digging is slow as hell.

[Darkyrm]

Going after Elemental Ores sucks A LOT, i barely try to go after them after the 100cap nerf and if its JP time its even worst so most of the time I just do an standard run

I think they also changed how much is required to level up your skill, and people just tell you not to bother because they don't want people digging up their zones. When I started before the nerf people were also saying "It will take you 7mil+ and a year+ to get to max level" trying to persuade people to not do it. What they weren't saying was the truth, that you would actually make 7mil+ just skilling it up! It's a cutthroat business cause waiting 1 hour for a good zone to refill sucks when there is over a dozen diggers on your server at your time zone. Or figuring out the reloads in the desert..1;15 game time...cause other people were doing the same and keeping it dried out. I was A35 when they nerfed digging however it was also a fix since RMT couldn't bot(human-bot) 24/7 anymore. Was able to get 1 level every month or so and the last 2 levels actually felt like they flew right by. Hot and Cold also helps you get skill ups.

Before the nerf people obviously tried to discourage others (with unlimited time to spend digging was really "overpowered") but seriously I leveled digging to have a good way of income that required a reasonable effort (plus I have allways enjoyed digging a lot) and since the nerf even at max level I just make some pocket cash to keep my character normal expenses. Yes I could follow the repops and enhace my income before reaching the cap but that would mean expending a lot more time which i dont find it worth it at this point, an standard digging run (fast runs) plus crafting and muling allready takes about 50 min - 1h.

I cant count the the times I have desired I did use the time to level digging in other things because its a bit on the fustrating side of things to level it because it was a powerful "farming" system and now at max level after the nerf its potential its just stupid low from what it was. Im not even totally cursing the nerf because it was a good solution to keep RMT out of digging but SE should have given legit diggers another way to enhace their potential digging (raised chocobos or hot and cold dont help that much).

Im not even trying to discourage anyone from digging, its a fun way to make some pocket cash, it doesnt cost money to level because you usually get the cost back while leveling but it takes really really really long to get to max level only to find that there are allready a LOT of top level diggers (even more at JP time) and the cash potential of the 100cap its not that great...

[/end of rant]

[Guitarman]

I think they also changed how much is required to level up your skill, and people just tell you not to bother because they don't want people digging up their zones. When I started before the nerf people were also saying "It will take you 7mil+ and a year+ to get to max level" trying to persuade people to not do it. What they weren't saying was the truth, that you would actually make 7mil+ just skilling it up!

Ok are you on atomos or some shit? Because on MY server the "good" zones are dug up nearly round the clock. Don't go feeding lies to people saying that its this zomg fantastic gil, because it isnt. Yeah on a good day i can make some decent money, and over time i had made back my investment in greens, but it took a long long time to start selling things other than stacks of bone chips and giant femurs.

If someone has an interest in chocobo digging, read the link barber put up, it's a real eye opener. Yeah competition sucks but i would much MUCH rather have a legit person trying to make money competing with me than the RMT that dig around the clock on countless mules. I've had far too many friends, or know too many people that put in a huge chunk of gil expecting instant gratification from chocobo digging and be disappointed. Bottom line, if you dont enjoy it, theres better money making alternatives.

Edit: Darkyrm's rant, =D> Amen.

[cdgreg]

Just sit down for 30 minutes and read this entire thread:

Barber I began to read this link since I'm bored at work and most of the replies kept referring back to the "original thread". I believe this is the original thread?:

I know nothing about choc digging however I do love reading about all aspects of the game, so are they both great reads, or is the original thread so dated only an experienced digger can reasonably determine which are bogus theories and which are solid bits of information?

[barber2006]

Yes, that is the 'original thread'. Notice the dates of the posts: 2004. This was before wikis listed the possible digging items and most people still believed in a 'promotion test item' because someone found the idea on a JP blog.

It's pretty neat to see the progression of ideas as the thread evolves over the next 18 months. The theories that are put to bed and the theories that end up being true are pretty evident based on the testimony given there. If you remember that it was before raised chocs, item digging fatigue, burrow/bore, and chocobo hot and cold it should be understandable. All 3 threads are like 50 pages all together though. Most of the conclusions from the reputable diggers there are yet to be refuted (although obviously with raised chocs the possibilities are more vast now).

To be honest, it was real easy to see when you could get on a bird and dig for 6 hours straight. It's a bit tougher now to see trends/patterns/lootpools/etc when you are limited to just a few minutes digging.