Helix Endgame

[Tempestwolf]

Since the update, their uniqueness has kinda gone out the window on many mobs. It's just more beneficial to just use a Parsimony'd Tier IV spell now for quick and steady damage.

The problem with using INT in the formula is that unlike BLM, a SCH cannot get a good 120INT/320 elemental skill necessary for effectively nuking high HNMs. A SCH who focuses on a solid elemental skill gear set can easily get off unresisted nukes for much more damage on these mobs anyway.

Nothing wrong with tossing down the Helix with the nuke though. I'm thinking of just using a skill setup @ first then work with what I get from that. Other ideas include the use of Klimaform / Helix, maybe w/ Klimaform you can stack raw INT.

~Edit~
I do have a LJ but wanted to wait till 75 Scholar before making a post (Ding'd last night) so I'll post w/e I get from there, only thing is not a PC player ;; wont see log pic's T .T;

[Kimiko]

Since the update, their uniqueness has kinda gone out the window on many mobs. It's just more beneficial to just use a Parsimony'd Tier IV spell now for quick and steady damage.

The problem with using INT in the formula is that unlike BLM, a SCH cannot get a good 120INT/320 elemental skill necessary for effectively nuking high HNMs. A SCH who focuses on a solid elemental skill gear set can easily get off unresisted nukes for much more damage on these mobs anyway.

Nothing wrong with tossing down the Helix with the nuke though. I'm thinking of just using a skill setup @ first then work with what I get from that. Other ideas include the use of Klimaform / Helix, maybe w/ Klimaform you can stack raw INT.

~Edit~
I do have a LJ but wanted to wait till 75 Scholar before making a post (Ding'd last night) so I'll post w/e I get from there, only thing is not a PC player ;; wont see log pic's T .T;

If I remember Kaeko's post correctly, Scholar can come close to the needed 320/120 needed for effective nukes vs. HNMs. We honestly need one or two more quality pieces to make it a reality, something I hope the June update will deliver.

[Tempestwolf]

Even better food would allow for it =/.

[Kimiko]

Scholar has a base Elemental Skill of 256 in Dark Arts at level 75. Adding +16 with merits, this comes out to a base of 272 Elemental Skill. For INT, a Scholar subbing Red Mage, will have a base INT of 77 - or 82 with full merits. So then, let's just start by seeing what the maximum + Elemental Skill and INT a Scholar can get from gear currently available. I'm going to exclude the weapon slot in this discussion since it should vary by element.

Sub Bugard Strap +1 INT +1
Ranged Phantom Tathlum INT +2
Head Elite Beret +1 Elemental Skill +5
Body Scholar's Gown Elemental Skill +15, INT +1
Hands Genie Gages Elemental Skill +8
Legs Druid's Slops Elemental Skill +5
Feet Goliard Clogs INT +4
Back Merciful Cape Elemental Skill +5
Waist Penitent's Rope INT +5
Neck Elemental Torque Elemental Skill +7
Ear 1 Elemental Earring Elemental Skill +3
Ear 2 Abyssal Earring INT +2
Ring 1 Tamas Ring INT +5
Ring 2 Snow Ring INT +5

This comes out to a total gain of + 48 Elemental Skill and + 25 INT excluding the staff.

If we combine these bonuses from the best gear available with the Scholar's Base stats in Dark Arts form, we come up with 320 Elemental Skill and 107 INT. If you add a typical Melon Pie +1 (+5INT), we end up with a total of...

320 Elemental Skill and 112 INT

[diemos]

SE said they will be releasing better food choices for mages.q

[Midnightjade]

I made a real effort to keep 2x INT etudes (top tier - ie Sing+String >+25) on one of our LS SCH in Temenos a week or so ago, plus relevant Threnody on target mob, and he seemed to enjoy the results with his Helix spells. I don't have any screenshots though - was busy running around after all those taru BLM.

Maybe I'll take notes next time, or a parse?

[Kimiko]

Suprisingly enough on normal mobs during the NW run, even in light arts I was getting around 180'ish dmg. That leads me to believe the weather has a massive influence upon M. Acc for the helix spells as well as damage.

[Forbidden16]

I haven't got to test Helixes much on high lvl endgame mobs but for the average IT mob I'm using a mix of all the INT I can get mixed with mAB, whatever seems like the smartest choice for a slot and like people have said, since it's lower numbers INT tends to be more effective for damage while at the same time increasing your M.Acc. I opted to replace Vicious Mufflers for full-time nuke/helix in Goliard Cuffs due to our lower Elemental Skill options and I find it way more convenient to have 4 mAcc. over 1 mAB in most cases (although Yigit Gages probably better for Helixes here).

I'd advice to treat Helixes resists the same way you take care for your normal nukes, equip Elemental Skill+ gears when you know the mob has a higher chance of resisting to at least increase your chances of the helix landing. Always try to cast helix with corresponding weather on and if possible in relation to the mob's weakness match it with the current day as well; I always Ebullience them too. The average decent Helix on stronger stuff will do from 80-120+ this way I'd say (Salvage NMs, IT mobs). I got to do little testing on Nyzul Isle Cerberus and my damage was pathetic but I think that's very expected on him, and I don't expect any different from Sky gods or the real ToAU versions.

Anyway that's the way I've gotten to treat Helix spells from the little time I've been playing with them, and future tests will hopefully lead to more solid Helix damage output conclusions. Although I think they are very useful spells for things mobs that take time or that you are required to do mostly healing, which allows to contribute a good deal of damage while filling that role (as long as you don't have to depend much on Addendum: White).

[Hanyoko]

Can a Helix be used as a Magic Burst?
If so and it does receive a boost of damage as well as accuracy; I could be usefull in certain situations.

Hmmm MB Helix on a qutrub could be funny to see haha

[Spekkio]

Can a Helix be used as a Magic Burst?
If so and it does receive a boost of damage as well as accuracy; I could be usefull in certain situations.

Hmmm MB Helix on a qutrub could be funny to see haha

as far as i know, a helix is like any other spell and yeah, can be magic burst. i'm not sure if we know if the MB affects the duration.

[Thris]

Damn it would be sweet to get some solid results from int stacking ;/

[Tempestwolf]

Minor update.
I've not gotten much testing in lately on anything big with helices, we have been doing mostly little things, Ix DRK, Limbus, Dynamis. On the note of Limbus, in Temenos I was working Luminohelix off with INT etudes X2 in full INT gear + Light Obi.
My numbers were usually around 220, I had a couple 234's as well. INT makes more of a difference then I was hoping though, I tested out a Helix in my half skill / MaB set I have for nukes, this resulted in a 155, however I believe my Etudes had worn.
(I believe all had Ebullience on)

Dynamis I popped off a few Noctohelix, fairly decent numbers usually around 170 (Ebullience no dark obi).
In Limbus Apollyon Kings Path I was stuck main healing so did not get much testing off, I did try a Cryohelix on the turtle though I believe I got around 32 using all INT and Klimaform, no ebullience iirc. Unfortunately I was main healing so did not get to play with much other setups I think would have been more effective, next time =(.

That's all I have for now, we should be doing JoJ and JoP tonight so I will run as much tests as possible. I'll be posting all info up in mah LJ soon <. < as soon as I get around to it > .>! Stay tuned.

[Spekkio]

Minor update.
I've not gotten much testing in lately on anything big with helices, we have been doing mostly little things, Ix DRK, Limbus, Dynamis. On the note of Limbus, in Temenos I was working Luminohelix off with INT etudes X2 in full INT gear + Light Obi.
My numbers were usually around 220, I had a couple 234's as well. INT makes more of a difference then I was hoping though, I tested out a Helix in my half skill / MaB set I have for nukes, this resulted in a 155, however I believe my Etudes had worn.
(I believe all had Ebullience on)

Dynamis I popped off a few Noctohelix, fairly decent numbers usually around 170 (Ebullience no dark obi).
In Limbus Apollyon Kings Path I was stuck main healing so did not get much testing off, I did try a Cryohelix on the turtle though I believe I got around 32 using all INT and Klimaform, no ebullience iirc. Unfortunately I was main healing so did not get to play with much other setups I think would have been more effective, next time =(.

That's all I have for now, we should be doing JoJ and JoP tonight so I will run as much tests as possible. I'll be posting all info up in mah LJ soon <. < as soon as I get around to it > .>! Stay tuned.

got a link to your LJ? maybe add it to your profile? i look forward to reading your data. i've always been fascinated by helix spells since they came out (if you remember, i was the crazy person who tried to turn a helix into a single tick of damage for hundreds of thousands of damage, but to my knowledge, there have never been enough sch standing around in 1 place to try it. not that i expect it to work anyway...) so i'm very interested by the testing. also, i wonder if by using tools with magic accuracy on them like the omega ring might allow us to slack off some on the elemental magic requirement, enabling HNM nuking to be possible even without the exceedingly specific (and probably expensive) gear build kaeko put forward.

[Tempestwolf]

I almost have the build Kaeko sugested, I'm short Mercifull Cape, Elite Beret +1 and Druid Slops (Which I refuse to use <.<).
I'll add the link to my LJ when my post is done up (I think later today I'll finally do it).