Battle Adjustments (05/28/2008)

[aurik]

[quote=RKenshin]

5 penance 3 invigorate 1 formless 1 mantra

What's even the point of Mantra? If people want a 4% boost that badly, you'd probably want to go all the way. It's all or nothing, imo.

Mantra is a hate utility. Ever since Drain2, its actual use is severely diminished. Too bad it wasn't like +10% hp with a timer which, at 5/5, is constantly usable.

Ah, so it's like Diffusion for BLU, only not nearly as broken. Mantra and Formless do need recast and duration adjustments, making them both 3m duration and 5m recast would give them a lot more usability for the common man.

Mantra's far from broken, it's a really minimal hate spike...only useful if you can hit the whole party, then it's the same VE as boost.

I still figure it is better than a 4th in invigorate.

I've got such a bad obsession with Chakra that I might just max Invigorate as silly as it probably would be. But with where I use MNK I've never had a need for Formless Strikes, although Mantra as a hate spike sounds interesting.

Maxed would put me at like 800 HP recovered though, which is way overkill. Especially since I don't solo. But... must..feed...urge.[/quote:2jphm25n]

I use formless strikes probably 4-6 times a week. Very handy in Nyzul ("all amorphs" and "all ebony puddings" floors suck), in limbus, and against elementals. For someone who does everything as monk, it's a required JA.

[Sendra]

Oh, you can beat AV? Solo kirin? You can walk down the middle of Castle Otroja[S] and spit it all their faces and call their mother whores?

Take the new better buffed jobs and go do the MULTITUDE of shit there is to do in this game. All the while pushing the boundaries of just how few people you can take and still beat the challenges that took you an alliance(or 2) to beat a few years ago.

My favorite thing in the game is Soloing/Low manning shit that others cant beat with parties or more. The stronger they make my jobs, the more fun I have trying shit I never thought I could do.

You're acting like being able to low man something is the game's progression; it doesn't matter whether or not you can beat Tiamat with 4 people or something like that, because a group of eighteen unmerited retards can kill it for the same fire crystal. It'd be nice if those of us who AREN'T capable of low-manning shit for whatever reason (invalid jobs, busy linkshell, etc) could get a challenge every once in a while.. Especially considering that we most likely make up the majority of the playerbase

[Indalecia]

Smn side: always had all 6 BP's. Figure gonna go for 5 Geocrush for a decent damage Stun.

[Damane]

I wouldnt be surprised if SE introduces for some jobs new category 2 abilitys/spells with the increase of points in it at the same time.

[SephYuyX]

I wouldnt be surprised if SE introduces for some jobs new category 2 abilitys/spells with the increase of points in it at the same time.

Id be very very surprised.

[Kerberoz]

Oh, you can beat AV? Solo kirin? You can walk down the middle of Castle Otroja[S] and spit it all their faces and call their mother whores?

Take the new better buffed jobs and go do the MULTITUDE of shit there is to do in this game. All the while pushing the boundaries of just how few people you can take and still beat the challenges that took you an alliance(or 2) to beat a few years ago.

My favorite thing in the game is Soloing/Low manning shit that others cant beat with parties or more. The stronger they make my jobs, the more fun I have trying shit I never thought I could do.

You're acting like being able to low man something is the game's progression; it doesn't matter whether or not you can beat Tiamat with 4 people or something like that, because a group of eighteen unmerited retards can kill it for the same fire crystal. It'd be nice if those of us who AREN'T capable of low-manning shit for whatever reason (invalid jobs, busy linkshell, etc) could get a challenge every once in a while.. Especially considering that we most likely make up the majority of the playerbase

Even for those of us who can and do low-man things... it's retarded that the only challenge in the game is from forcing a handicap on yourself.

Awesome, you just killed Tiamat with 10 people! Too bad the next 17 pops will be claimed by the jaja linkshell with 50+ members and a holding alliance one day into the window, and they'll just throw PLDs and SMNs at it and kill in 4 hours with 36 people.

There's no challenge left without handicapping yourself. It's not necessarily that SE has buffed the players too much; it's that they've buffed the players while adding weaker and weaker mobs. There's a huge gap in difficulty between the "hardest" killable mobs and lolAV. Where's our challenging HNMs that don't rely on in-joke gimmicks that can't be beaten?

It's getting pointless to even bother being "good" anymore just so you can kill the same mobs slightly faster than the complete drooling idiots can.

[kayn]

One thing I don't understand about all the class buffs is... they keep buffing all jobs, increasing max merits, ect... but they do not ramp up the content difficulty to match all off these continuous buffs. I am not saying jobs don't deserve to be made better, they do & there is a need for balance.

But all we are gonna be left w/is a bunch of OP classes that make all the PvE content in this game easier than it already is. And i just don't see them adding harder content that requires all these new skills, yatta yatta. It's like the only way they believe to keep their player base is by adding new merits (ect...) and not adding harder content. And I am not talking about the difficult content that is based on pure random factors

tell me how easy teir III eins are again?

I just want to take a moment to say screw you, and point out that this is the only unique PLD spell that will be in the game. Every other spellcasting job until this point has had unique spells. All of them. Always have.

"Reflect" won't be gamebreaking. It will be fun, and give the stupid paladins a relatively large boost, and the intelligent ones a smaller boost. It's almost enough to make it into a merit party now to make up for all the exp PLDs lose in events getting all the other jobs their shit. We don't get a bonus 10% damage reduction right off the bat with the merits. So calm down, and if you are up to it, blow me.

That remains to be seen. if this spell ups shield proc rates % it could very well be a % dmg reduction

[evilpaul]

Well, the update says "Spells" and the only one listed so far is the PLD thing. Which hopefully means we'll see something cool for RDM, BLM, SMN, etc.

The MNK change looks very cool. It'll probably dethrone Destroyers at least in some circumstances as best non-relic weapon. Hades Sainti (or TM Hooks+2? ) might become pretty popular. I'm curious as to whether the "as well as a bonus to the amount of TP gained per kick" means Store TP or just higher delay, so you get more TP per hit? Maybe X-hit builds would become viable for MNK?

If the merit point requirements aren't 3, 4, 5, 5, 5 though, or if SE decides that the last two to a category scale differently than the first three, then the update is pretty "Meh."

I've got BLM, SMN, NIN, and MNK at 75, and MNK is the only of those that has decent group 2s.

No expansion of Magic or Combat skill merits is completely retarded though. SE should really let you cap out any combat/magic skill you can use and then pick which you want to be active while in your MH. If having them all active at once would be too overpowering.

[Lordender]

wow maybe if they keep buffing paladin's up you just might be able to straight tank AV in two-three years without any gimmicks!

[Rho]

Well, the update says "Spells" and the only one listed so far is the PLD thing. Which hopefully means we'll see something cool for RDM, BLM, SMN, etc.

Beyond working on completing Murgleis and capping Tier 2 again, I highly doubt RDM is getting anything this update. That said, they do seem to be taking care of 3-4 jobs per update. By process of elimination, maybe we'll see RDM in... hm... early 2010?

I'd wager MNKs would see JSE before that happens.

[Neosutra]

Honestly I am 100% convinced the pld counter spell will be a spikes effect and be -very- similar to dread spikes in short duration, limited reflect ability, and high MP cost. In the end it will be a marginal situational tool at best, and by no means help any pld that already sux, or break pld/nin.

Anyone that thinks SE is going to hand over a pld spell that is cheap, lasts a while, and bumps shield block ratio up to 80% all the while reflecting all the damage and curing cancer is out of their fucking mind. Everyone here KNOWS the spell will suck ass. I for one am just happy to get a new toy, if even situationally useful.

Monk I am fucking dissapointed in, but that depends on the implementation. If they make me fucking break usukane set for Dune boots by making kick stance better than H2H, im going to kill babies.

I am however fucking psyched about 10 min chilvary, chi blast and invigorate buffs, and feint every 2 minutes.

Add in nyzle relics not sucking and Ill be a happy camper this update.

[LD]

5 penance 3 invigorate 1 formless 1 mantra :roll:

What's even the point of Mantra? If people want a 4% boost that badly, you'd probably want to go all the way. It's all or nothing, imo.

Mantra is a hate utility. Ever since Drain2, its actual use is severely diminished. Too bad it wasn't like +10% hp with a timer which, at 5/5, is constantly usable.

Ah, so it's like Diffusion for BLU, only not nearly as broken. Mantra and Formless do need recast and duration adjustments, making them both 3m duration and 5m recast would give them a lot more usability for the common man.

Mantra's far from broken, it's a really minimal hate spike...only useful if you can hit the whole party, then it's the same VE as boost.

I still figure it is better than a 4th in invigorate.

Either you're accentuating my point or you very badly misinterpreted what I was saying. I was saying that Diffusion's potentially broken, Mantra is not, but they are alike in that their best use is for hate, instead of what it was obviously meant to do. +80 HP out of my regen every 5 minutes seems more useful than a 3 minute 4% HP boost on a 10 minute recast that has to be healed to actually make any use of. At 1600 HP, that's 64 MP. It may be a weak regen, but you ARE technically getting more for you money (and more often) at least in terms of invig needing absolutely no maintenance. I'm not going to argue the usefulness of mantra on the whole, but I stick by my all or nothing statement.

I've got BLM, SMN, NIN, and MNK at 75, and MNK is the only of those that has decent group 2s.

Fucking What?

[Ahnuld]

Needs moar combat merits to be perfect update.

Fact.

[Virtuous Saint]

btw, sch cannot attain a -28dmg phalanx they are more around 24 with best gear possible. That is only possible on full merited RDM with the most possible enhancing magic in the game at this point(320skill). I have tested it on my second character. Now, however phalanx 2 will last 4min, and be -28dmg, a very good increase.

side note: bioIII is 2:30, and went from half good to very good, fully merited that is.

[aurik]

Either you're accentuating my point or you very badly misinterpreted what I was saying. I was saying that Diffusion's potentially broken, Mantra is not, but they are alike in that their best use is for hate, instead of what it was obviously meant to do. +80 HP out of my regen every 5 minutes seems more useful than a 3 minute 4% HP boost on a 10 minute recast that has to be healed to actually make any use of. At 1600 HP, that's 64 MP. It may be a weak regen, but you ARE technically getting more for you money (and more often) at least in terms of invig needing absolutely no maintenance. I'm not going to argue the usefulness of mantra on the whole, but I stick by my all or nothing statement.

+80hp that you're likely to never see since your mage ought to have topped you up long before 32 seconds have passed. An emergency hate spike tool that is useful once in a blue moon is better than that.

[Tempyst]

Well, the update says "Spells" and the only one listed so far is the PLD thing. Which hopefully means we'll see something cool for RDM, BLM, SMN, etc.

Beyond working on completing Murgleis and capping Tier 2 again, I highly doubt RDM is getting anything this update. That said, they do seem to be taking care of 3-4 jobs per update. By process of elimination, maybe we'll see RDM in... hm... early 2010?

I'd wager MNKs would see JSE before that happens.

I hear MNK gets a JSE piece that's better than every JSE set combined. I'll trade the hachiman set for it if they don't mind

[ismarc]

Well, the update says "Spells" and the only one listed so far is the PLD thing. Which hopefully means we'll see something cool for RDM, BLM, SMN, etc.

Beyond working on completing Murgleis and capping Tier 2 again, I highly doubt RDM is getting anything this update. That said, they do seem to be taking care of 3-4 jobs per update. By process of elimination, maybe we'll see RDM in... hm... early 2010?

I'd wager MNKs would see JSE before that happens.

I hear MNK gets a JSE piece that's better than every JSE set combined. I'll trade the hachiman set for it if they don't mind

I heard Hasso's better.

[Genosync]

I've got BLM, SMN, NIN, and MNK at 75, and MNK is the only of those that has decent group 2s.

Fucking What?

It's ok if you're one of the idiots that think it's actually worthwhile to cast Burst II in a non-MB situation. We'll forgive you.

Wait, maybe not, fuck that. AM2 suck. Fucking waste of MP, just not as much of a waste as AM1.

[Tempyst]

Well, the update says "Spells" and the only one listed so far is the PLD thing. Which hopefully means we'll see something cool for RDM, BLM, SMN, etc.

Beyond working on completing Murgleis and capping Tier 2 again, I highly doubt RDM is getting anything this update. That said, they do seem to be taking care of 3-4 jobs per update. By process of elimination, maybe we'll see RDM in... hm... early 2010?

I'd wager MNKs would see JSE before that happens.

I hear MNK gets a JSE piece that's better than every JSE set combined. I'll trade the hachiman set for it if they don't mind

I heard Hasso's better.

That's interesting I didn't know we were talking about job abilities instead of annoying mnks that qq about no jse

[evilpaul]

I've got BLM, SMN, NIN, and MNK at 75, and MNK is the only of those that has decent group 2s.

Fucking What?

Well, if you magic burst a lot and your spell happens to go off first, so the magic damage resistance doesn't weaken it, then I guess AM2s rock your world.

Otherwise they're just single target, MP inefficient, -ga3s which BLM had already without needing dozens of merit points. Hardly some huge addition to the job.

Or did I miss some element of AM2's Essential Awesomeness?