Battle Adjustments (05/28/2008)

[Lordwafik]

btw, sch cannot attain a -28dmg phalanx they are more around 24 with best gear possible. That is only possible on full merited RDM with the most possible enhancing magic in the game at this point(320skill). I have tested it on my second character. Now, however phalanx 2 will last 4min, and be -28dmg, a very good increase.

SCH can get a 26( well 26.6 , but it gets rounded) damage phalanx with AF1 pants, Enhancing torque, Merciful cape, Augmenting earring. Pretty close

edit : Forgot glamour jupon! although it just brings it to become 26.9 rather than .6, which sucks to be .1 away from 27 dmg phalanx.

Well at least RDM gets to have it close now eh?

[drewbixcube]

They've lowered the SC resist rates at least 3-4 separate times (maybe more) in FF history, two of which were over the last year. Each time the difference hasn't been noticeable, but the most recent one seems to hit the nail pretty well. On weaker mobs (easier merit PT mobs) you'll only see a resist around 20% of the time? Like say, on sea puks or in mire. An slightly tougher mobs, like mamool, it's probably around a 50% resist rate. On tougher mobs like in Einherjar, high floor Salvage bosses, etc, it's around 90% resist.

This is all just eyeballing and an educated guess, so don't take that in stone.

Sekkanoki has nothing to do with Overwhelm though. Storing up to 200 TP and using Sekkanoki to WS twice is the same damage as storing to 100 TP to WS followed by storing to 100 TP to use WS. I don't think most people get how it works. <.<

And again in the end, no one that knows what the JA does is going to want a SAM on any level for that reason.

its also fun when doing something when you can get in a meditate or two before fighting anything(nyzul lamps come to mind). i tend to use sekka in nyzul very often.

[drwaffles]

ib4 "but Tornado II on Kirin!"
ib4 "but Flood II on Suzaku and Tiamat!"
ib4 "but they look so pretty!"

[LD]

+80hp that you're likely to never see since your mage ought to have topped you up long before 32 seconds have passed. An emergency hate spike tool that is useful once in a blue moon is better than that.

Obviously, we're both seeing this from wildly different perspectives. I, the person who mostly campaigns and merits with pick-ups, and you, the person who only does anything with people he's known for 3 years, probably wont see eye to eye on this.

I've got BLM, SMN, NIN, and MNK at 75, and MNK is the only of those that has decent group 2s.

Fucking What?

Well, if you magic burst a lot and your spell happens to go off first, so the magic damage resistance doesn't weaken it, then I guess AM2s rock your world.

Otherwise they're just single target, MP inefficient, -ga3s which BLM had already without needing dozens of merit points. Hardly some huge addition to the job.

Or did I miss some element of AM2's Essential Awesomeness?

Since when do BLMs care about MP inefficiency? I thought your job was to do the most damage in the shortest amount of time. AM2s do at least 33% more damage than Thunder 4 for roughly the same percentage of its MP, even without a MB. They have their own inherent acc bonus, which is NOT dependant on MB, making them easier to land for full. Unlike MNK's G2s, there are TWO that you can make use of instead of just one. You use them very often in everything you do, flans, HNM, etc. So what, exactly, am *I* missing? I've never seen a Thunder 4 go over 1.2k, I frequently see AM2s over 2k. Factoring in resists, MP cost, I don't see how it's any more 'inefficient' than the rest of the nukes (besides -gas, but those are meant to be used on groups, and due to the magic damage formula, they'll get a high yield there.)

[drwaffles]

You use them very often in everything you do, flans, HNM, etc. So what, exactly, am *I* missing?

Maybe the odd Burst II on Faf/Nid for fun, Freeze II for zeging Aspid and the occasional Burst II on Tiamat if you're force landing it, but if you're using them whilst soloing Puddings ur doin it rawng. Outside of trying to pump out as much damage as possible in a short space of time AMII are fairly useless spells.

[LD]

Yes, but if I may be so frank, when DON'T you try to pump out damage ASAP, as hate allows it? And if hate is so much of a problem that you wouldn't do that, you obviously have enough time to rest a bit (barring stun rotation, of course.)

Just to clarify, I really don't see how, considering the extra damage output and such, it can be seen as 'MP inefficient.' You sure as hell wont be spamming it, but making it seem somehow worse is ridiculous when there are only a handful of things where Penance is even noticable.

[aurik]

Yes, but if I may be so frank, when DON'T you try to pump out damage ASAP, as hate allows it?

Most of the time. MP efficiency > squeezing out max damage.

[LD]

Yea, that wasn't the question though. I still believe you're exaggerating this, where as there is no argument against Penance seeing less action on the whole.

[aurik]

Yea, that wasn't the question though. I still believe you're exaggerating this, where as there is no argument against Penance seeing less action on the whole.

What the hell does penance have to do with AM2?

[drwaffles]

Constant Tier IV spells is a much safer (in terms of enmity accrued) and MP efficient practice than constantly rotating Tier IV and AMII. In the vast majority of endgame situations as BLM you should be able to freely use at least two of Thunder, Blizzard and Fire IV, and if alternating those isn't providing enough of a steady damage output then something's wrong.

[Spider-Dan]

Maybe in kick mode, 2A/3A will apply to your "main weapon"?

http://images.wikia.com/ffxi/images/...dra_Katars.png

[Genosync]

+80hp that you're likely to never see since your mage ought to have topped you up long before 32 seconds have passed. An emergency hate spike tool that is useful once in a blue moon is better than that.

Obviously, we're both seeing this from wildly different perspectives. I, the person who mostly campaigns and merits with pick-ups, and you, the person who only does anything with people he's known for 3 years, probably wont see eye to eye on this.

I've got BLM, SMN, NIN, and MNK at 75, and MNK is the only of those that has decent group 2s.

Fucking What?

Well, if you magic burst a lot and your spell happens to go off first, so the magic damage resistance doesn't weaken it, then I guess AM2s rock your world.

Otherwise they're just single target, MP inefficient, -ga3s which BLM had already without needing dozens of merit points. Hardly some huge addition to the job.

Or did I miss some element of AM2's Essential Awesomeness?

Since when do BLMs care about MP inefficiency? I thought your job was to do the most damage in the shortest amount of time. AM2s do at least 33% more damage than Thunder 4 for roughly the same percentage of its MP, even without a MB. They have their own inherent acc bonus, which is NOT dependant on MB, making them easier to land for full. Unlike MNK's G2s, there are TWO that you can make use of instead of just one. You use them very often in everything you do, flans, HNM, etc. So what, exactly, am *I* missing? I've never seen a Thunder 4 go over 1.2k, I frequently see AM2s over 2k. Factoring in resists, MP cost, I don't see how it's any more 'inefficient' than the rest of the nukes (besides -gas, but those are meant to be used on groups, and due to the magic damage formula, they'll get a high yield there.)

It's inefficent, shut the fuck up, stop talking about shit you don't know about.

You see T4s go over 1.2k on a lot of mobs, and I'm sure you're referencing your AM2 experience to puddings, in which case you can throw your numbers out the fucking window.

Look. AMII are decent for MBs if, like paul said, you're getting your nuke in there earlier than most of the BLMs. Other than that, it is a complete and total waste of MP, because if you're going to say anything about spending MP for magic accuracy, you're not gearing yourself right.

I talk about a lot of things because I have experience with pretty much, well, damn near everything. You don't, and I'd greatly appreciate it if you shut the fuck up.

[LD]

Yea, that wasn't the question though. I still believe you're exaggerating this, where as there is no argument against Penance seeing less action on the whole.

What the hell does penance have to do with AM2?

I've got BLM, SMN, NIN, and MNK at 75, and MNK is the only of those that has decent group 2s.

Fucking What?

Ya know, and this is to everyone, I'd really appreciate it if the people who piss off at me bothered to follow the line of conversation before engaging.

Constant Tier IV spells is a much safer (in terms of enmity accrued) and MP efficient practice than constantly rotating Tier IV and AMII. In the vast majority of endgame situations as BLM you should be able to freely use at least two of Thunder, Blizzard and Fire IV, and if alternating those isn't providing enough of a steady damage output then something's wrong.

I realize larger nukes are greater hate hazzards, that's not the point. The problem I'm having is the logic behind an AM2 being inefficient, especially as a means of making it seem worse than MNK merits, cuz imo, it stinks of the age old 'oh, poor BLM' crap I've been smelling for the past 2 years. I'm sure it's not AS efficient as a tier 4, but to present it as wildly so is insulting, especially considering it's greater technical reliability.


Geno: Prove it. How do you know what I'm referencing and how do I know you're not referencing from something just as conditional or hypothetical. Your level and experience mean nothing to me unless you can actually back it up, because you can be just as ignorant and deluded as you seem to think I am. Or worse, you could be exaggerating to defend your personal beliefs, which I think is what's happening. I shudder to think what I'd be like if I believed everything from every jack off who said he was 75 in something.

[Max™]

I know it's been said, but Burst II really is awesome looking, especially from taru pov on a large mob. I'm not a mage, so as a melee it's even more dramatic watching an SC go off and then KERPOW! big sparkly!

[ShuttleXpC]

Curious why every topic that has great potential on these forums turns into an elitist whinefest.

On Topic: Yay for BST, I can merit some more and have a level 73-75 Fungy.

[LD]

Curious why every topic that has great potential on these forums turns into an elitist whinefest.

Elisist? Where?

[Lordwafik]

I'll put it to you bluntly without sounding too insulting I hope.

The BLM you are describing are the blms with "Tarutaru syndrome", Symptoms of this include : Nuking for the highest damage possible without any attention or care for the consequences until you are out of MP. Dying is a side effect of how awesome you are.


Now blms with Tarutaru syndrome (Which I refer to as TTS) are what we call inefficient. Blowing through loads of MP on spells that do not have a high DMG rating in the DMG:MP ratio is not the wisest choice, and there are many things in the game which spamming t4 nukes is much more efficient than spamming AM2.

Smarter blms know when the time and place calls for them to either be efficient and conservative, or turn fall under TTS.

In a situation like merits in a pudding burn party, if you nuke solely with AM2, you'll find yourself out of MP and out of your chain.

[chapstick]

I think I might suffer from mild TTS sometimes. D:

[Genosync]

Yea, that wasn't the question though. I still believe you're exaggerating this, where as there is no argument against Penance seeing less action on the whole.

What the hell does penance have to do with AM2?

I've got BLM, SMN, NIN, and MNK at 75, and MNK is the only of those that has decent group 2s.

Fucking What?

Ya know, and this is to everyone, I'd really appreciate it if the people who piss off at me bothered to follow the line of conversation before engaging.

Constant Tier IV spells is a much safer (in terms of enmity accrued) and MP efficient practice than constantly rotating Tier IV and AMII. In the vast majority of endgame situations as BLM you should be able to freely use at least two of Thunder, Blizzard and Fire IV, and if alternating those isn't providing enough of a steady damage output then something's wrong.

I realize larger nukes are greater hate hazzards, that's not the point. The problem I'm having is the logic behind an AM2 being inefficient, especially as a means of making it seem worse than MNK merits, cuz imo, it stinks of the age old 'oh, poor BLM' crap I've been smelling for the past 2 years. I'm sure it's not AS efficient as a tier 4, but to present it as wildly so is insulting, especially considering it's greater technical reliability.


Geno: Prove it.

I'd prove it if you maybe would fucking read posts and realize that no one is wildly saying 'OMG BLM TIER II MERITS SUCK SO HARD WAH WAH THEY SUCK COMPARED TO MONK SO BAD WAH WAH' or something. Seriously, it's just a general consensus that BLM Tier II merits, in general, are not as useful as the Monk merits. It's not bitching and whining of emo BLMs that don't want to be 'nerfed', or the 'oh, poor BLM' crap you state, it's just plain and simple fact that AM2 is so onesided compared to what Monk Cat2s offer.

Shut..... the fuck up.

And yes, people who actually know shit, compared to the ones that think they know what's going on, definently are elitist. Excuse me while I throw my out my ... 1400ish? job levels and full end-game experience on all sides of the battlefield and let some idiot with much less experience than me try to tell me and others that we're wrong.

[LD]

Ok, one more time. Plainly as I can.

It doesn't take anything more than a calculator to figure out Thunder 4 is more MP efficient than all of the AM2s. My Point is that saying AM2s are worthless or worse than Penance is insulting to my intelligence. I don't expect them to be spammed for reasons beyond their recast, my POINT is these people are blowing their inefficiency out of proportion.


I'd love to hear this general consensus. So EVERYONE thinks AM2s are worse than Penance?


Also, "elitist: One who despises people or things regarded as inferior, especially because of social or intellectual pretension."

I deny nothing, but I'm not a hypocrite, Geno.