Paladin Group 2 Merits: Advice/Suggestions Needed

[Tan]

So until recently I thought my group 2 merits were set in stone. I was planning on going 5/5 Fealty and 5/5 Chivalry. 5/5 Fealty for the resistance of all those fun status ailments, + the reduced damage from Meteor, Mijin Gakure, and Citadel Buster. 5/5 Chivalry was for the 10mins MP goodness. But after some responses I got from another thread as follows:

I can vouch for Guardian. I currently have it capped and all I can say is... wow.

You like Guardian? Cuz that just made my Group 2 Choices harder, was planning to go 5/5 Chivalry and 5/5 Fealty w/ these new updates. I'm currently 1 Guardian, 1 Fealty, 3 Chivalry, 1 Iron Will (hardly notice this).

I've recapped guardian too and it's definately impressive. My tanking partners already couldn't keep up with me when I was capped pre update. Now, it's even worse for them, although its not a problem when I'm solo tanking which I'll be doing alot more of when I finish my shield. I plan on going 5 Guardian then 3/2 in Fealty or Chivalry; dunno which is the 3 and which is the 2.

So heres the question out there, what group two merit combinations do you have? Why is it the "best choice" and/or what would be the optimum set of merits. I feel that this group 2 merit increase was nice and bad at the same time because it forces me to choose between those three abilities now (>.<)

[Pirian]

This should probably go in newbie, but anyways, I was 3/3 guardian before update and plan to take it 5/5. Putting 4 in Fealty and just leaving 1 in chiv. More often than not, I find myself in the position where Chiv is very useful but a lower recast won't really help all that much. I'm also usually in the position of 3 auto refresh + refresh + a 3rd refresh though so I usually have to really work at burning my mp in order to use it (and even then the whm usually hits me with devotion before I can chiv up, lol)

[Gadritan]

5/5 Guardian I think is just about a given to be honest. I'd say if you like fealty so much look at going perhaps 4/5 fealty and 1/5 chiv. I was going to go 4/5 chiv and 1/5 fealty...but you do have a great point about fealty. It's a lot more useful than many give it credit for, and chiv is more of a low man/solo ja. If you have decent support with you it's really not all that helpful (and that's coming from a galka).

That's my two cents, feel free to give me some change back.

[Eanae]

5/5 chiv, 1/5 fealty, 4/5 guardian

[Neosutra]

5/5 chiv, 1/5 fealty, 4/5 guardian

This is a solid answer, though I put a couple more into fealty because its just way overpowered.

[Dioma]

This should probably go in newbie, but anyways, I was 3/3 guardian before update and plan to take it 5/5. Putting 4 in Fealty and just leaving 1 in chiv. More often than not, I find myself in the position where Chiv is very useful but a lower recast won't really help all that much. I'm also usually in the position of 3 auto refresh + refresh + a 3rd refresh though so I usually have to really work at burning my mp in order to use it (and even then the whm usually hits me with devotion before I can chiv up, lol)

I'm with this reply more than anything. I rarely use chivalry in the HNM scene now after getting my Ares Body. That being said, it depends what you use your PLD most for and the rest of the gear you have to determine if you really need that lowered recast and also consider how long it takes you to get that 300 TP (with not engaging things like Tiamat) and really how useful would that lowered recast be to you. For me, it's just not worth it but I already have 2 merits in it so instead of redoing my merits I'll just put my last 2 into Fealty and call it good.

[Tan]

5/5 Guardian I think is just about a given to be honest. I'd say if you like fealty so much look at going perhaps 4/5 fealty and 1/5 chiv. I was going to go 4/5 chiv and 1/5 fealty...but you do have a great point about fealty. It's a lot more useful than many give it credit for, and chiv is more of a low man/solo ja. If you have decent support with you it's really not all that helpful (and that's coming from a galka).

That's my two cents, feel free to give me some change back.

Yeah I do think that fealty is a pretty damn good JA that is overlooked a lot. I was thinking a 10min recast would allow me to use it more frequently than I do now (only one merit). I think from what I've seen about the few merit combos here is that most people typically save Chivalry for an "Oh shit I'm out of mp situtation" (Thats what I do atleast now), and I was more or less thinking along the lines that if I had a 10min recast on it I would use it more often than the "Oh shit" situations. But that probably wouldn't be the case after all.

While were on the topic of PLD merits though, does anyone know if the spell interruption rate - w/ Iron Will affects everyone under Rampart status? I guess what I'm thinking is if you had two PLD/NIN's w/ maxed Rampart Recasts, Valor Coronet, and 5/5 Iron Will. You would have nearly 100% Spell interruption - for 1.5mins out of 4mins, thats 37.5% of the time your spells would be uninterruptible. So things that I'm not sure of are, is there a spell interruption - cap on Iron Will, and does it affect other people? And even if it did, is this worth while at all? On the third question, I can see it might not be too worthwhile now for someone w/ Aegis + Reprisal, but needless to say its a possible tactic and I was curious about it.

[RKenshin]

This is best in Standard/Newbie question forum, this topic comes up a lot and is usually discussed in better detail there. Moving it over!

[Jakson]

Isn't there a cap on spell interruption?

[Lyramion]

I wish my NIN had the problem of having to choce between Tier 2 merits

[Tan]

Isn't there a cap on spell interruption?

Thats what I thought also, thought it was somewhere around 50%? But if you can go 5/5 Iron Will thats, 5*19% = 95% spell interruption - rate, and if you had merits on top of that (if they stacked w/) you could hit higher than 100% (blasphemy). So that kinda seems a little bogus to me... But lets see if anyone has any testing / info on it I guess.

Edit: After moving it to Newbie area, the quick replies disappeared

[Tan]

I wish my NIN had the problem of having to choce between Tier 2 merits

Completely off topic, but have you ever thought about capping a San elemental spell 5/5 and going for a casting build (for shits and giggles if anything)? Not ideal for everything but I was discussing it with my buddy Callisto and we were thinking if a Ninja capped something like Thunder or Ice and went for a INT + MAB build w/ HQ staves and /rdm or something you could potentially generate a fair amount of hate / deal a lot of damage. Never really seen anyone w/ an extensive Ninjamage casting set on Ramuh though, kinda disappointing that people don't try stuff thats typically seen outside the box.

[RKenshin]

Less people monitor this section, but more people who will actually put thought into and answer questions are here. Other area you're more likely to get flamed, derailed, and end up with much less progress than here. And that's just what happens in advanced, it's not really punishable. But it is here.

Hence why this forum was made!

[Gadritan]

Completely off topic, but have you ever thought about capping a San elemental spell 5/5 and going for a casting build (for shits and giggles if anything)? Not ideal for everything but I was discussing it with my buddy Callisto and we were thinking if a Ninja capped something like Thunder or Ice and went for a INT + MAB build w/ HQ staves and /rdm or something you could potentially generate a fair amount of hate / deal a lot of damage. Never really seen anyone w/ an extensive Ninjamage casting set on Ramuh though, kinda disappointing that people don't try stuff thats typically seen outside the box.

5/5 Raiton San + 5/5 effect is always nice for hojo/slow. Same can be said for huton for jubaku/para. Idk, just seems to me that's the only practical use for a hnm nin build. Then again I am galka as well, so it's difficult for me to imagine doing chunks of dmg with San spells. Off topic I know, but I think debuff support is something that's more often than not overlooked for nin category II merits, so I had to put my 2 cents in there as well <.<

[Garret]

I think 5/5 Chiv 4/5 Guardian & 1/5 Fealty is a good answer myself, although it does depend on your playstyle and what you use Pld for.

Fealty is good, yes, however if you are doing mostly endgame then you are often going to be used to your mages erasing status ailments as a matter of course, and even if you are resisting them with fealty for 1/10 minutes with it 5/5 that's not really saving your mages much, if they even realize not to need to erase the ailments when fealty is up. I find it much more useful for situations where you know you are going to get bombarded with a bunch at once. Just don't think it has that much increased viability with a lower recast. I look at it as more of a once in a while useful ability.

In comparison Chivalry may not always be useful 100% of the time but it has widespread uses in a variety of situations and you can pretty easily find times to want to use it more often. Has much more of a static benefit than fealty, at times fealty can be used and have almost no impact even if you thought it would. Chivalry is something you can rely on for your MP pool for longer fights, really nice boost especially when coupled with Devotion.

Much better case I think for putting more into fealty than guardian though, but it's nice to have a sentinel where your hate reduction is almost nil while its in effect. Bit of a matter of preference, but I think you can always use more hate and less hate loss if you can manage it without the loss of more important areas, and I don't think fealty tops out as more important.

[Robert]

I'm meriting up to what Eanae said, more often than not I find myself in 3 man Faf/Nid tank parties and having a 10 min timer on chivalry really makes the difference, 1 in Fealty just to have it unlocked, and the rest in Guardian.

[Zumi]

Right now I have 5/5 Chivalry, 1 guardian, 1 iron will, 1 fealty. Now I am not sure where to put the last 2.

Is there really no reason to put more into iron will? Like if I really want to cast a spell but stuff keeps hitting me so I can't.

[Karinastar]

Is there really no reason to put more into iron will? Like if I really want to cast a spell but stuff keeps hitting me so I can't.

With the recent addition of Reprisal, there's not really any reason at all. If you really get caught, just toss it up (it casts fast) and there's a very good chance you'll block and get your spell through. Even without it, with a good shield skill macro you'll block half the time anyway.

[Callisto]

Less people monitor this section, but more people who will actually put thought into and answer questions are here. Other area you're more likely to get flamed, derailed, and end up with much less progress than here. And that's just what happens in advanced, it's not really punishable. But it is here.

Hence why this forum was made!

Tan's lucky, my first post on BG was a pDIF question for melee RDM. I was told to DIAF several times before it got moved to Newbie, lol.

[Tan]

Less people monitor this section, but more people who will actually put thought into and answer questions are here. Other area you're more likely to get flamed, derailed, and end up with much less progress than here. And that's just what happens in advanced, it's not really punishable. But it is here.

Hence why this forum was made!

Tan's lucky, my first post on BG was a pDIF question for melee RDM. I was told to DIAF several times before it got moved to Newbie, lol.

Eh, I knew more or less where I was posting, I honestly wanted the cold harsh reality asap, if it meant being told I'm most noobiest noob around well, shit happens.

It seems the consensus of this post so far is atleast 4/5 Guardian, 1/5 Chivalry, 1/5 Fealty, and the rest are where you feel like em between those 3. Which seems reasonable enough for me, as we all should want to tweak our playing style to what fits best for what we are doing most of the time. Unfortunately for me I'm still torn between those last few merits in Fealty and Chivalry as I seem to do a little bit of everything all the time, so I'll probably just end up splitting them throughout.