Pandemonium Warden - The aftermath theories.

[Max™]

5 Generals will be easy to get rid of.
4 Chariots won't be as easy, but odds are SOMEONE will have the titles in most groups.
3 AU Kings you're just gonna have to fight in most groups cause who kills them?
3 Asscandy titles? Good luck, though it would actually give an incentive for more people to go get it back.

So on average you will have to go through at least 6 or 7 forms cause have you EVER met someone with the asscandy BCNM title? AU Kings titles? I don't know anyone with those.

So that's hours upon hours of battling, for a system which was previously the very definition of casual content.

Awesome, I hope there is something less obvious but easier which we're missing, neither big standout theory seems very pleasant atm, mine or the title one.

[Byrd]

3 AU Kings you're just gonna have to fight in most groups cause who kills them?

People who want ToAU relics. You would only really ever have to kill them once; there's only going to be a few people in each LS who want to do ToAU relics, and you can make sure they are in on the kill. Do it once for each of the 3 kings, and you're set for life on both fronts.

[Kaddisfly]

I may or may not be contributing to this thread by saying this...

But am I the only one who finds it a bit humerous that we're all looking for some sort of order/structure on how to kill a mob thats name is a direct reference to chaos?

[Kaylia]

5 Generals will be easy to get rid of.
4 Chariots won't be as easy, but odds are SOMEONE will have the titles in most groups.
3 AU Kings you're just gonna have to fight in most groups cause who kills them?
3 Asscandy titles? Good luck, though it would actually give an incentive for more people to go get it back.

So on average you will have to go through at least 6 or 7 forms cause have you EVER met someone with the asscandy BCNM title? AU Kings titles? I don't know anyone with those.

So that's hours upon hours of battling, for a system which was previously the very definition of casual content.

Awesome, I hope there is something less obvious but easier which we're missing, neither big standout theory seems very pleasant atm, mine or the title one.

I dunno. My ls already have all those title. Four of us have the 3 AC BC titles, and 10 of us have the 3 kings. Almost everyone is doing salvage, and general's quest take 10min each to complete.
..and we don't even have 18 ppl.

[Judai]

5 Generals will be easy to get rid of.
4 Chariots won't be as easy, but odds are SOMEONE will have the titles in most groups.
3 AU Kings you're just gonna have to fight in most groups cause who kills them?
3 Asscandy titles? Good luck, though it would actually give an incentive for more people to go get it back.

So on average you will have to go through at least 6 or 7 forms cause have you EVER met someone with the asscandy BCNM title? AU Kings titles? I don't know anyone with those.

So that's hours upon hours of battling, for a system which was previously the very definition of casual content.

Awesome, I hope there is something less obvious but easier which we're missing, neither big standout theory seems very pleasant atm, mine or the title one.

I'm in the LS with Kay and I personally have every single title for TAU except Odin's, which I will have soon anyways. The titles really aren't hard to get, the AC Titles suck a little because it means you need to lose AC and be the first to get it back but nobody ever tries, my group got it back 3 of the last 4 times it was lost and got all three titles.

The AC BCs aren't even hard, especially Lamia which we almost beat on the first run. TAU Beastmen Kings aren't too bad either and only require 18 people. You are going to need 18 people to kill PW prolly anyways, so might as well take a day, have some fun doing new content(now old) and kills the Kings. Salvage Chariots are easy.

There may not be rewards for them(well good ones) but they are fun fights and I don't get why most people don't even bother doing shit. So many people bitch and cry about doing the same shit everyday and probably haven't even touched half the content in game.

I think it would be pretty cool if it required the titles because it rewards us for playing the game and doing everything people skip. What's so important in game you can't take some time to enjoy some really fun fights? Sitting in Aery for 3hrs? If people can't kill the mobs with those titles or can't find the people for it, they prolly can't kill PW anyways.

and we have more then 18 ppl in the LS now Kay.. >.>

[Demosthenes11]

if you don't have all 4 chariot titles at this point you fail at endgame

[ronin sparthos]

5 Generals will be easy to get rid of.
4 Chariots won't be as easy, but odds are SOMEONE will have the titles in most groups.
3 AU Kings you're just gonna have to fight in most groups cause who kills them?
3 Asscandy titles? Good luck, though it would actually give an incentive for more people to go get it back.

So on average you will have to go through at least 6 or 7 forms cause have you EVER met someone with the asscandy BCNM title? AU Kings titles? I don't know anyone with those.

So that's hours upon hours of battling, for a system which was previously the very definition of casual content.

Awesome, I hope there is something less obvious but easier which we're missing, neither big standout theory seems very pleasant atm, mine or the title one.

Its a scaling system though and the low tier 1 stuff is pretty much something anyone can go out and do - casual or hardcore HNMer. Up until tier 4, any casual group can go out and kill the pop monsters and have quite a challenge presented to them but the tier 4 and PW tier are obviously the kickbacks for the hardcore HNM shells that would have otherwise bitched that no real challenge was given to them with this new system.

It pretty much breaks down to:

Tier 1 - Small-man/Soloer Content
Tier 2 - 2 party/Soloer/Casual LS Content
Tier 3 - Greenhorn LS/3 party/HNMLS/Casual LS Content
Tier 4 - Active HNMLS Content
Tier 5 - Hardcore/Challenge-seeking HNMLS Content

[Max™]

if you don't have all 4 chariot titles at this point you fail at endgame

Salvage failed me, Ares set is arguably one of the worst, the only thing it excels at is Drg jump, Drk guilly, and uh.. Steel Cyclone in pieces.

As I said though, that part at least I am sure we could find people with the titles, though believe it or not, not everyone drools over salvage gear. Are's legs is the only piece I'd carry and use constantly, I don't drop steels as much as I used too pre-crit RR.

Pretty, useless gear (as Vistani put it) isn't awesome enough to do salvage for.

<== I have much cheaper easier to get pretty, useless gear.


Most any shell with halfway competent members can do T1-4, even the AU HNM's aren't exactly hard fights once you know what is going on in them.

Then you get PW which possibly requires a nearly full tour of AU including titles which some servers (I'm still pretty sure there's an undefeated in Besieged server) don't have ANYONE with, nevermind that the AU kings are arguably harder than T4.

I don't personally know of anyone who is doing a Nyzul relic, the 50k Alex's kind of killed any serious interest for all the ones I know.

[Kaylia]

You would fail at "endgame" for having a single melee job in your case. People who arent doing salvage need to get up with time.

[Spira]

the 50k alex thing seems like it will be adjusted.. as will the conditions for other 3 paths.
SE did say in an interview it was pretty harsh..

Nyzul relic quests haven't been fully implemented anyway, but I was still under the impression that you only choose one of the 4 (einherjar spam, assault spam, nyzul spam, salvage spam) paths, which is why I'm currently working on the nyzul spam path.

the NM titles aren't that hard to obtain when u look at it.. since they're all 18mannable other than Odin (who i'm pretty certain isn't involved with PW).

I fail to see why you seem to emphasize how ZNM is supposed to be all casual and all but that is really a normative statement to be making. The ZNM system is clearly endgame, but it scales at a very comfortable level so long as you have the correct strategy / setup involved. Otherwise, there are NMs in tier 1 that could easily wreck full alliances anyway, and I don't really consider that to be 'casual' anymore.

[Max™]

Eh, my job leveling views and everyone elses has been discussed, I'd rather not derail this into a big rant about that.

It's moot point in this case either way, if the title theory pans out, sucks for Lakshmi, Siren, Bismarck, as they have 0-a handful of AC losses, so that's a rather random and unfair penalty for an entire server to have an extended PW fight because they were GOOD at Besieged?

Would it be nice for the people who have all of those titles? Yeah.

Would it suck for any group that is missing any of them due to any reason (again: there are servers without ANYONE who has the AC recovery titles, and it isn't something you can exactly predict or plan for), personal, or serverwide? Yeah.

[Spira]

I think the idea with the theory was that having the titles would be a bonus, not a necessity to defeating PW. If you could just shortlist it to like 3 transformations beyond the original, I don' think that would be hard to accomplish.

In the first place, SE isn't making PW unbeatable unless you have all (theorized) 18 titles.. It just means you'd have a little more work on your hands but you do your best to minimize it.

As for those servers who have never lost the AC, this is what you call a Trade-Off.
You can't have your cake and eat it too.

[Kaylia]

Eh, my job leveling views and everyone elses has been discussed, I'd rather not derail this into a big rant about that.

It's moot point in this case either way, if the title theory pans out, sucks for Lakshmi, Siren, Bismarck, as they have 0-a handful of AC losses, so that's a rather random and unfair penalty for an entire server to have an extended PW fight because they were GOOD at Besieged?

Would it be nice for the people who have all of those titles? Yeah.

Would it suck for any group that is missing any of them due to any reason (again: there are servers without ANYONE who has the AC recovery titles, and it isn't something you can exactly predict or plan for), personal, or serverwide? Yeah.

They never lost it during maintenance? It's always gone on ifrit after update.

[Max™]

Siren has never lost it.

So now you have 1 server who rocks at Besieged who, by this theory, would get penalized on every PW pop for it.

Two or three have lost 3 or 4 times, so it's possible noone remaining on the server has the title.

So it goes from servers that could have 1 or 2 forms, to ones that will absolutely take 4 or more.

How much HP does he have btw, the main Warden, how much could you do with just DoT's, and how long would THAT take?

[Judai]

Siren has never lost it.

So now you have 1 server who rocks at Besieged who, by this theory, would get penalized on every PW pop for it.

Two or three have lost 3 or 4 times, so it's possible noone remaining on the server has the title.

So it goes from servers that could have 1 or 2 forms, to ones that will absolutely take 4 or more.

How much HP does he have btw, the main Warden, how much could you do with just DoT's, and how long would THAT take?

Kinda funny how hardcore you are QQing about a theory that hasn't been tested and requires people to get off their asses, out of their MH or Aery and do some fun fights.

btw, pro-tip on losing Besieged: Train the mobs to the AC room. Watched some dude train like 10 mobs into the Ac room a couple months ago, somehow we fought them out but it was funny.

[rath]

I am pretty sure that I saw a report of Discoid off the repopped chariot, but could be wrong of course.

Yeah it's pretty ridiculous to fight without killing them, as has been said time and time and time and time again, but the point still stands, is it more or less ridiculous than 10-15 repops?

Could the lamps actually have one hidden among them that is different? Like in nyzul you can find "impossible to gauge" normal mob when you need to eliminate specified enemy. I mean it could be something like one lamp that isn't ITG, and the rest are. Kill it first and maybe he gives some colourful text about your insight and changes back for a limited time, or the other lamps no longer link, which would allow you a more reasonable timeframe to kill him in.

[Secksi]

Pretty sure Siren lost it once. Either that or one of the other crazy ass servers only lost once.

Edit-seems I'm uh, kinda wrong?

http://www.sirenffxi.com/modules.php...ewtopic&t=9068

Last post in that thread says that Siren lost but it was taken off the record?

[euph]

the answer is glory crown, obviously.

[Max™]

No, I'm bitching because I have a different theory which I'd like to see debunked or proven first, cause it would at least conceiveably be simpler and possibly result in just a single annoying fight, vs all the prep fights, title getting, and in some cases still having multiple repops.

[Kaddisfly]

I'll say it again, we're all trying to find structure/order in a mob named Pandomonium. I love the irony. I truly hope this is a mob in which you just have to go balls to the walls against and clear all 18 forms and then I hope it drops some useless shit so we can all quit talkin about it.