RDM head and body equips in a merit PT - opinions wanted

[Lordwafik]

After getting my RDM af2 body from Bonanza, I finally had my "fast cast" crap. AF1+AF2 body during the refresh and haste cycle, there's usually 0 time while casting these on people to swap back for a tick of autorefresh, and if there is, 2 mp isn't gonna change anything for me. Anyway, after I'm done with the cycle, I press my macro that changes me back to af2 hat / morri body so I can build up MP while Idle/curing.

I noticed during this way, gives me more time to be relaxed, since before, it was like this

* not to scale *

now is like this :

http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/7049/refreshnl3.gif

[Freijah]

a RDM[...], was actively skilling up Enfeebling

Ok wow, why the hell would a RDM not be capped except for like 5 mins after leveling? :\

Alas, we all know you should be allowed to GM a RDM that isn't Refreshing anyway.

[Tomiko]

This post seriously needs to be a pop-up when you change jobs to RDM. You have to read it. And acknowledge that you understand it. So sick of seeing RDMs full-time turban, makes me want to scream.

The new nightmare: Rdm wearing Turban + Chasuble?

No, 5% conserve MP is NOT better than auto refresh on haste/refresh/cure III. 5% conserve MP is 1.4% MP saved on average, which for haste and refresh equals 0.56 MP per spell, and for cure III, 0.644 MP. 1 MP/tick will be better than this, and if you need the recast reduction, relic body offers the same reduction in recast (very slightly larger, actually), and also a significant decrease in casting time.

If that's your only Conserve MP gear, then yeah, it's not that great. But as he mentioned, when you stack it the effect becomes alot more noticable.

Right now I have the following I use:
Seveneyes - 7
Goliard Saio - 5
Cobra Gloves - 3

That's only 15 Conserve MP (just from equipment, working on Legs & Feet), but the amount of MP I usually save will usually add up to more than I would get from using a Refresh Body.

[Amastacia]

Err, you'd save fractionally more MP by using Seveneyes, Cobra gloves, and Auto-Refresh body.

Just sayin'.

p.s. Wafik - now you see why I end up wearing AF2 body so much - it's great for giving me more afk fap time during important events!

[Zoot]

I have always basically done the same thing as Lordwafik on Haste and Refresh; I use /wait1 followed by stpc. I add in the wait so that I have as minimal time as possible to assure that I have fast cast on my spell. I have tried swapping in other gear as I am casting the spell, but because of stpc on these spells the timing goes all amuck. Personally I weigh having fast cast proc above other benefits.

For cures, however, even though I do add in Warlock's Chapeau, Duelist's Body and Loq earring at start I do not use stpc, so that my cures land faster. I do swap into -emnity gear, for most of my cure sets, a fraction of a second before the spell lands. My macros for these add a /wait 1 after the cast which then swaps into -emnity gear, although I am not positive if this effect lands with 100% consistancy because of lag, etc.

Something I have never really understood is adding HP to your convert while being below this HP% otherwise at all times. This means you would have to cure yourself before using convert, which has a few negative factors.

The first would be having to save 45MP before a convert in order to cure yourself, or otherwise having to ask for the spell to be cast on you. The second is the time taken to cast the cure spell, and when I am soloing especially, I don't have that kind of time to waste. I understand if you're taru and can't reach a suitable convert ratio otherwise, but to me it is very counterproductive.

[Spekkio]

in a solo situation, the rules may be different (i'm last rate at rdm solo. i'm blm main and much much better geared on that, so if i need to solo something, i'll probably use that.) but for situations in which you're fighting w/ others (xp, events, etc) i find a convert gearset valuable. by saving the 24 or 45 mp to get off a cure2 or cure3 on myself and by having the extra HP/MP capacity, i can hit a big ass cure like DS cure4 and after i drop out of my convert gearset, i'll still be capped on MP. this is in contrast to if i did not use a convert setup, wherein i'd already be down 88 MP fresh off a convert. it also gives me some free mp to blast out a quick refresh or haste before i drop out of vert gear, buying me a fresh refresh instead of a stale one for no extra cost. as a taru i'm already forced to cure myself up to reach parity on hp/mp anyway, so since i'm already putting in this effort, it's valuable to eek out some extra MP capacity and the HP to match it to come out of it full. when you consider a goliard saio gets you halfway to the 88 extra MP you need anyway, it's not that hard to achieve.

[Callisto]

I wasn't advocating not using a specific Convert set, I do, albeit mine is currently gimped because it's down to buyable shit and I currently have better uses of 900k than A.Legs/Serket Ring, though those are soon on my list. My thing is the idea of an Elvaan/Galka/Taru trying to get a 1:1 ratio, it seems kind of pointless to me. As Elv, depending on subjob(I'll go with /DRK because that's what I use the most) I sit at 1230~/670~(no food). To get a 1:1 would sit me around 1k/1k, I convert, fire off 2 Cure IV's, and then I have a large amount of MP left over. If I change to my normal gear MP is capped but I'm missing 350~ HP.

I'm not sure about you but in most serious scenarios I'm too friggin busy to Convert, cast more than 2 Cures on myself, change back, cast another Cure, then go about my business. Half the time I only drop one Cure IV on myself, use the rest of my extra MP on a Haste for myself or someone else, cast Regen, then switch back to my normal gear and either Regen or Drain back to full.

I definitely think you should have a dedicated Convert set, just that going out of your way to get 1:1 ratio when half the excess MP would get wasted is somewhat pointless to me.

[Kyreth]

Hmm. When I'm being a total Refresh/Haste bitch, I might consider picking up some more of that Cobra gear. Even for us not-so-supergeared folks, I can still easily get Conserve MP +12 or so just with Fourth Mace + Cobra hands/legs/feet, and it's not bad Convert gear either since all of it is +MP +HP in equal amounts, and leave on my AF2 body + AF1 hat for the fast cast.

Edit: Although I've got a full Yigit set, too.

[Zoot]

In healing situations I'm already defaulted into my convert set, and honestly for most everything else besides soloing, so I'm not saying having a convert set isn't valuable. What I said was that, having +HP outside of what you would already be standing seems a little superfluous? It isn't difficult for a hume, elvaan or mithra to meet an MP pool where you'd have enough to cast CIV and a haste or refresh, should it be needed at the time, before dropping MP into a different set and losing nothing. And then it's not always needed, and if you are like me you already lose some MP when casting a cure spell (outside of the one you cast on yourself after convert) because of gearswaps. That isn't the case in merit situations though, so I could see the benefit there. What I'm saying is, 46MP lost, then gained from convert is a net value of 0 MP.

Something like goliard saio I understand, you could also be standing in that and might be casting in it as well, but an absurd convert set that adds in gear only for the +hp and +mp values seems pretty wasteful on inventory, at least for me. Aka, walahra turban, ogre vest, and various other crap you probably wouldn't be casting in anyways.

[Callisto]

Aside from that, I can't remember the last time I even had to Convert when playing Pink Mage, lol. The normal 6-7/tick with a BRD and resting a few ticks after my Haste cycle and I usually go hours without needing Convert, unless the DDs are being lazy on shadows/3E. I cast Haste a hell of a lot more than Cure, which is why I always idle in max Fast Cast.

[Kyreth]

Something like goliard saio I understand, you could also be standing in that and might be casting in it as well, but an absurd convert set that adds in gear only for the +hp and +mp values seems pretty wasteful on inventory, at least for me. Aka, walahra turban, ogre vest, and various other crap you probably wouldn't be casting in anyways.

That's why the Cobra stuff has me curious. For casting shit that I don't need other gear for right now- Refresh, Haste, lolCureIV's, etc. I usually end up /BLM in Dynamis, so I don't mind being able to stack a bunch of +HP/MP gear prior to a dead recovery statue, for example...and for some reason, the usual WHM in my PT likes to Cure V for me post-Converts. It's definitely situational, I know. Not like I'm using the six zillion AN I've got right now anyway.

[Zoot]

I actually like the cobra gear; I use fourth mace right now and I want the mitts, you really can't get too much better than +HP and MP and conserve mp on a hand piece for refresh and haste, and even convert.

And yea it is situational, I can understand a taru wanting to make the most out of convert. As a taru you might not even lose mp when switching to a different set. I'm usually too busy to ask for a cure (which I find that people with these HP sets tend to do alot since they forget to save for convert) or heal myself with a CIV and have to wait for the recast on it after I convert.

[Amastacia]

Something I have never really understood is adding HP to your convert while being below this HP% otherwise at all times. This means you would have to cure yourself before using convert, which has a few negative factors.

The first would be having to save 45MP before a convert in order to cure yourself, or otherwise having to ask for the spell to be cast on you. The second is the time taken to cast the cure spell, and when I am soloing especially, I don't have that kind of time to waste. I understand if you're taru and can't reach a suitable convert ratio otherwise, but to me it is very counterproductive.

Soloing, the time wasted may absolutely be more detrimental than the gains.

In party situations though, you can usually have a little more foresight and basically give yourself more MP to work with in the same span of time. HP is always cheaper than MP, so even curing up 100 HP above your normal amount only costs you 24 MP, and you end up with a net gain of 76 extra MP to play with after Convert. Since the HP cured per MP goes up with higher tier cures, you actually see slightly increasing returns on net MP gain with more +HP added.

I know for the most part that if I can bring myself to give a damn, I can always find more legit uses for MP in an 8:20 period. Right now my Convert ratio as a Mithra sits at around 1040/1040 (not perfectly 1:1, but close, and I can't recall the exact numbers off the top of my head from work), which is actually lower than my regular casting HP. If I had the ability, I'd gladly make it 1300/1300 and deal with the time and foresight needed to cure up the extra, because I'd find a use for the extra 260 MP.

As an additional note for consideration - how many RDMs do you know who really make an effort to squeeze every MP out before Converting? I know I try to aim for single-digit MP before Converting, but most don't since it can be risky. They have the MP on hand to top off extra HP if their Convert set pushes them over their regular casting amount. For the min/maxer's, it does take a bit more planning, but it's becoming increasingly uncommon that I Convert at the 8:20 mark anyway, so I can certainly adjust a little to account for the time and MP needed to take advantage of a higher total HP/MP than I otherwise have.

Edit: I can understand inventory constraints, but I'm a bit of a min/maxer and perfectionist. I'm usually at 65+/70 while playing RDM, without bringing a lot of the non-essential crap I would without space limitations. I bet I'd be fine leaving a lot of the situational stuff I do carry at home, but I wouldn't feel like I was playing RDM to the best of my ability given the gear and inventory space available to me. There isn't a whole lot I have a ton of desire to collect along the way that wouldn't fit into 5 inventory spaces, and if something unexpected does happen, I can always toss cheap food or something. To each their own on that regard, but there's no concrete benefit to being 40/70 instead of 65/70 to me.

[Callisto]

I typically try to get under 30 MP before vert, or rather low enough that I don't have enough MP for a meaningful buff. If I can still squeeze one more Haste/Refresh/Stoneskin out then I'll do that until I can't anymore. As far as inventory, I'm the exact same way, the big downside to most 'big' Convert gear aside from A.Hands and Hierach Belt(which the Cobra gear is somewhat nice for) is practically useless outside of Convert, so you're carrying around 5 extra pieces just for that, when as we all know 5 slots is a big deal on a full geared RDM.

[Zoot]

HP is always cheaper than MP, so even curing up 100 HP above your normal amount only costs you 24 MP, and you end up with a net gain of 76 extra MP to play with after Convert. Since the HP cured per MP goes up with higher tier cures, you actually see slightly increasing returns on net MP gain with more +HP added.

I know for the most part that if I can bring myself to give a damn, I can always find more legit uses for MP in an 8:20 period. Right now my Convert ratio as a Mithra sits at around 1040/1040 (not perfectly 1:1, but close, and I can't recall the exact numbers off the top of my head from work), which is actually lower than my regular casting HP. If I had the ability, I'd gladly make it 1300/1300 and deal with the time and foresight needed to cure up the extra, because I'd find a use for the extra 260 MP.

As an additional note for consideration - how many RDMs do you know who really make an effort to squeeze every MP out before Converting? I know I try to aim for single-digit MP before Converting, but most don't since it can be risky. They have the MP on hand to top off extra HP if their Convert set pushes them over their regular casting amount. For the min/maxer's, it does take a bit more planning, but it's becoming increasingly uncommon that I Convert at the 8:20 mark anyway, so I can certainly adjust a little to account for the time and MP needed to take advantage of a higher total HP/MP than I otherwise have.

When I cast haste and refresh, I drop about 40 MP,which is just under the amount I'd use for a Cure IV on myself. I don't usually have my convert gear on unless defaulted, and I know most people use gearswaps too. You could be gaining 200 or 300 mp from adding convert specific gear this set; But in all honesty, you probably won't touch too much of that MP.

My convert ratio sits about the same as yours, but right now I have more HP to work with in and haven't decided what to do with it yet. Anyways, I do tend to use convert when it's up in many situations, but I think that's just that red mages in my LS are expected to do a little more in certain situations. Whether or not a red mage pushes out the last drop of MP before convert I can't say, but I do know I see alot of people "oops"ing and asking for a cure before they convert. I personally squeeze out every bit of MP I can, but I also leave stoneskin and blink on fulltime.

[Amastacia]

Oh, I'll often ask for cures on stuff like Ouryu because I'll have put up a fresh Stoneskin, burned a lot of MP, and had something like back-to-back Bai Wings and Refresh falling happen all at once, thus leaving my HP down and no way to get enough MP back to fill it up besides getting and outside cure and Converting.

Shit happens, heh.

Having it happen regularly probably means laziness or lack of attention.

[Callisto]

I guess that's the nice thing about being Elvaan, lol. I require less cures to get enough for Vert! XD In that situation I usually try to eek out the last dregs of MP on Cure I & II if it's not an emergency vert now & get back to casting ASAP situation, if so I get to 700+, vert and go, would rather miss 100 MP and get a spell cast when it needs to be cast.

[terranova]

I used to wait til I'm down to single digits before converting, until there became increasing need to have SS up at all times. So I get down to 30-40, and then put up SS and convert. Sometimes I may put up refresh instead. I don't have a perfect 1:1. I have 910HP and 890MP(taru obviously). I don't have convert gear(dont have the room ><), so I swap around a bit and check my max before converting too. 8:40 convert. Getting those last points for 8:20 seem so long.