MDB + -Magic% Cap Question

[Virtuous Saint]

Does magic dmg continue to decrease if you were to go beyond 50MDB?

[Turambar]

Does magic dmg continue to decrease if you were to go beyond 50MDB?

Nah, the laws of algebra change for MDB values > 50.

[VZX]

Does magic dmg continue to decrease if you were to go beyond 50MDB?

Unless MDB have certain cap, Yes, magic damage will continue to decrease as you stack more MDB, but the effectiveness is getting smaller for every point you put there.

[Linktri]

@linktri: did the whitemage in your particular test use a blessed briault? (and if so did you account for it?)

I use Cleric's Pantaloons for just about everything on WHM. I haven't had a Blessed Briault (2 years?) in a long time, but if I recall correctly the bonuses for enhanced bareffect on both didn't stack.

[Amele]

I use Cleric's Pantaloons for just about everything on WHM. I haven't had a Blessed Briault (2 years?) in a long time, but if I recall correctly the bonuses for enhanced bareffect on both didn't stack.

"on both" being the briault and pantaloons?

briault is an MDB bonus to barspells(5); not a resist+ bonus; which is why I asked if it was involved in your testing. - I recognize that barspells and shell don't exactly have anything to do with each other but frequently both will be on the test subject anyway (the less damage you're taking the more hits you can take in a single test run etc.)

anyway; the reason for me asking is because my personal tests haven't shown an MDB effect on shell V - it's all been satisfactorily calculated based only on the %damage effect and flooring fractions.

[ringthree]

Assuming it works the same way as BLU's breath spells, then day/weather, MAB/MDB, stave bonus term are not part of the breath damage calculation.

Yes, I believe Breaths are their own category. At least for Kirin this is the case. The only thing that decreases it's Heat Breath damage is -Breath Damage %. MDB, Shell, -Magic Damage % and Staves all have no effect. Kirin is the easiest to test this on because it uses it so often and it caps at 500 so often.

[Linktri]

"on both" being the briault and pantaloons?

briault is an MDB bonus to barspells(5); not a resist+ bonus; which is why I asked if it was involved in your testing. - I recognize that barspells and shell don't exactly have anything to do with each other but frequently both will be on the test subject anyway (the less damage you're taking the more hits you can take in a single test run etc.)

anyway; the reason for me asking is because my personal tests haven't shown an MDB effect on shell V - it's all been satisfactorily calculated based only on the %damage effect and flooring fractions.

Yeah, "both" being the panties and the jeebus t-shirt. The Briault adds +5 MDB (which is half of MDB trait I) of the corresponding element at. Maybe this is why I thought they didn't stack. That's a very marginal bonus at approximately 0.4%. The Cleric's Pantaloons add +20/255 (I think) flat resistance at 12.75% to the corresponding element or effect.

Resist
Shellra V (62/256): 24.2%
Barelement (enhancing/5+40 = 91.2 at base (91/256)): 35.5% + 12.75% on pantaloons.

Total: +72.45% Resistance


MDB
Magic Defense Bonus IV: +16
Shellra V (level 5) MDB: +5
Barelement (level 5) MDB: +10 applied to element only. +0.4% on element for briault.

Total:+25.12% MDB

97.57% Ass insurance.

Unfortunately, as someone mentioned earlier... math doesn't apply correctly to bonuses over 50%/+50, the damage reductions are calculated separately and some defense/reduction bonuses don't apply to certain types of spells or effects. You can get in the ballpark, but getting a dead-on-balls accurate forecast of your potential damage is nigh impossible.

[Amele]

barspells +20 is adding +20 to the resist score - it's difficult to apply it directly to a % reduction because this affects the tier resist chance (although if you have solid math for how to get this I'd love to see the formulas) I haven't seen anything to lead me to believe this is x/255 (especially since you can get much higher than 255 elemental resistance)

and the math most certainly does apply correctly over 50%/+50 (if you're using the right math) the previous comment was sarcasm.

in particular, there's a cap on %damage reduction at 50%; there's no such cap on MDB to our knowledge - the properties of basic multiplication and division cause the 'diminishing returns' we're all so familiar with (the delta when going from x/100 to x/101 is larger than the delta from x/150 to x/151 etc).

anyway; (naked) I get a MDB % mod from the briault at ~4.3% (whm MDBIV = 16; briault = 21. 121/116 = 1.043) which is alot more than 0.4%(assuming you just misplaced a decimal; no big) and will be visible on anything doing more than about 20 damage and apparent on anything doing more than about 100.

[Suiram]

The tests I did a while back showed that shell 5 added no MDB. Unless I'm misjudging your remarks in the above post, it would seem that you are mistaken on a couple points regarding magic damage calculation. Perhaps if you supplied the data from your tests that showed Shell V giving MDB, then we could arrive at an understanding of why we reached different conclusions.

[Linktri]

I'll have to run some numbers and post when I get home. I absolutely suck at translating math to english.

[Suiram]

Just to be clear, I'm not interested in your math, only in the data you got in testing Shell 5 that led you to the conclusion that it added MDB. The idea here being that I would compare it against the math as I understood it and see if I was mistaken in my own testing, or else if your data also supports my own conclusions, at which point we could search for the error in your own calculations were you so inclined.

[Amele]

I'd be willing to look over your raw math myself - I don't need it in english as long as the expressions are complete.