CoP 6-4 "One to be Feared" Summoner Burn?

[Shuemue]

(unless you count removing xp loss and adding xp reward as nerf)

lol that's absolutely a nerf... all you need to do is keep trying now, there's no risk.

[Tizoc]

eh I don't think its really a nerf... when i think of SE and Nerf together in the same sentence.... I think of what they did to Magic Mortar slashcry

[Shuemue]

Eh when you can repeatedly attempt something at zero risk, that makes it a lot more trivial.

[datacorpse2]

No. This fight is far away from being trivial and removing xp penalty just makes it more convinient but not easier -- > no nerf.

Besides, unless they are a static, you lose about 30-45 minutes per try not everyone can play a couple of hours straight.

[Shuemue]

If you can't play a couple of hours straight, you're playing the wrong game.

[datacorpse2]

Let me reword: Sky, Dynamis, Limbus (helpers), Assault...

[Shuemue]

Choosing to do other stuff really isn't a valid excuse for not beating a mission released in 2004.

[LinktheDeme]

therein lies the problem, the minute he gets hit hard with a few -ga spells and the whm cure bombs him, the mammet he was engaged on will go after the whm.

He shouldn't have been engaged to any or he's supertanking wrong

[Tizoc]

He shouldn't have been engaged to any or he's supertanking wrong

I know i was pointing that out to the other reply is all,

[Tsuko_Asura]

lol that's absolutely a nerf... all you need to do is keep trying now, there's no risk.

This~

[datacorpse2]

I wasn't aware helpers need a valid excuse to do other stuff.

[Shuemue]

I wasn't aware you were referring to helpers in general, after all, you didn't mention them except as an aside after 'limbus' in your second post.

[shukuffxi]

PLD/WAR tanks fine in this, a little extra mage support is nice if you're PLD tanking, RDM+WHM, instead of say NIN with WHM+BRD. Mamemmets are easy as pie, PLD super tanks them in a corner, Shield procs amazingly well, I manage to kill 1 Mammet completely by myself, then usually get another to anywhere from 20-50%HP, before the others are dead.

[boogers]

Eh when you can repeatedly attempt something at zero risk, that makes it a lot more trivial.

This is just retarded. If you are incapable of winning (due to lack of strategy, the right party setup, gear, etc), who cares if you can try it an infinite number of times? You do realize that if you did lose exp, you can just go get exp and try again, don't you? The only difference is how much time passes between each attempt. Being able to attempt a mission with little delay between each attempt in no way makes the mission easier.

Getting back on topic.

NIN WHM SMN BRD DDx2 is fine (DRK recommended), and in fact that is how my party ended up winning. WHM is preferred since you will rely on Erase and the rare Stona. The NIN should definitely be wearing Melody Earrings (that's +10 Evasion _SKILL_) and be given Mambo and March. For the mammets, just face aggro them and stand there shadow tanking as the rest of your party pulls them off one at a time. If the NIN never engages (until the last mob), you can curebomb the NIN without worries. If you can win without any deaths and about 35 minutes left on the clock, then you're doing fine. Otherwise just (die and) exit.

BRD makes this mission really easy. Omega speeds up his attacks as his HP gest lower, so Slow + Elegy makes the battle a little more manageable. Your WHM should have no problem landing Slow (might take more than one try). Having 6 CCBs (using them only for emergencies) is also helpful -- you can sell any you don't use, so think of them as insurance policies. In my opinion, Omega is the toughest part of the mission. You shouldn't have to use any CCBs until 50% HP or less -- having a form of Stun will definitely help. Just make sure you stun Guided Missle, and you should be fine. Use CCBs when it's around 25% (no more than three needed; two should be enough).

Ultima does not speed up as its HP drops. Slow + Elegy will really hamper Ultima. Moreover, its TP moves follow a strict patter. Read http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Promathia_Mission_6-4 for details on how the two machines behave depending on their HP. Once you understand how they attack, you should have very little problems. Regarding Ultima, the only thing to watch out for is the move _after_ Nuclear Waste. Have your stunner ready stun to prevent any one of the moves that immediately follow Nuclear Waste (your healer won't be able to Erase the effects of Nuclear Waste fast enough, and this also avoids making your healer do so many *-na spells for the subsequent TP move). Use CCBs around 40% and lower. Remember their duration is only 1 minute. We had our SMN 2hr once we used our pump on Ultima; our SMN managed 2 Astral Flows (and BRD using the appropriate threnody) and our DD also used 2hr abilities to quickly finish off Ultima (and save a few CCBs).

Note: if you decide to purposely wipe (and sometimes that may be a wise move rather than burn time keeping two people alive while barely doing damage), you may need to use a CCB once you re-engage Omega or Ultima (esp. when their HPs are low).

[Eldelphia]

This is just retarded. If you are incapable of winning (due to lack of strategy, the right party setup, gear, etc), who cares if you can try it an infinite number of times? You do realize that if you did lose exp, you can just go get exp and try again, don't you? The only difference is how much time passes between each attempt. Being able to attempt a mission with little delay between each attempt in no way makes the mission easier.

The point is, for some people, the cost of CCBs and meds is prohibitive alone. Let alone the cost to morale. Add in the elevated skill levels from merits, new jobs like BLU, better gear etc etc and generally yes, this fight has gotten easier.

You do need a decent group to win it, it does need players who can think and some strategy but not losing xp over and over again makes it easier on a) morale and b) getting help from people who've already done it.

There was a point in my shell when people could almost visibly be seen hiding when peeps needed help with this fight, these days most peeps think it's fun. On the whole we were really supportive of anyone trying to get through CoP, I did more CoP missions than most of the shell put together. But 6-4 at least in the early days was just horrible. And I didn't do it especially early.

The pressure is off when you're not losing xp. Financially the meds can still be a bit of a kicker for some but it's not too bad.

I was 1/1 on this fight because two friends who had Sea helped me out a lot. I helped a whole bunch of peeps get through it afterwards but so much has changed since the fight was released that yes, in all honesty, it feels like those doing it now have a much easier time of it.

[Shuemue]

Never heard the phrase, "Practise makes perfect." ?