Completed Relic/Mythic weapons list

[Kurt Cobain]

rofl at all the kor talk and super crits oh my fucking god i need a hockey puck sized aspirin

[Sylvrdragon]

I'm still waiting for someone to actually refute anything I said.

So far I've got nitpicking about the way I add emphasis to a point, some random shit about Stanislav with nothing to back it up, something about capped hate (which might be the closest thing to a legitimate reply I've gotten), and a bunch of outdated memes and a good amount of Ad Hominem.

You don't START (omg!) the fight with capped hate. That happens over time. I could calculate how long it might take to cap hate under perfect circumstances, but fuck you. Let's just say it takes at LEAST a few minutes, probably more unless you're absolutely perfect. During that time, a Chainsaw Sword will cap you 4% faster. Also, we mustn't forget that VE decays at ~60/second, and each Utsu shadow lowers CE by 25 per. You also lose hate for getting hit. Let's top it off with the reminder that you're trying to stay ABOVE the DDs in your group, and so speed and efficiency matter.

Now, hopefully we've gotten all of the "ZOMG U R ST00PID BCUZ U DIZAGRI WIF US" bullshit out of the way and someone can actually step up to the plate. Start with the original post.

Edit: PS. Even if that other guy agrees with me (I don't know, I didn't see capitalization, so I skipped it), I don't want to be associated with him.

[BadKarma]

where are you Tekki >.>

[Kurt Cobain]

epic troll is epic again

[Sylvrdragon]

epic troll is epic again

Why don't you go back and read some of my 469 posts? There is a big difference between trolling and disagreeing. You need to learn and acknowledge this difference. Are you capable of thinking and analyzing things for yourself, or do you need something with a nice big "Conformity" label before you'll listen to it? Have you ever had an original thought, or do you live by group-think only?

Hey guys, did you hear? Not thinking is totally cool now!

[Quizno]

I think the sky is pink at high noon.

I'm not trolling, I'm just disagreeing.

[Kurt Cobain]

ok, i'll bite, you can replace a few pieces. pgorget idle->peacock amulet, ethereal earring->suppanomimi, whatever other earring you use->brutal, you should already be wearing a speed belt, homam and turban. if your MP is fine or you have a ghorn brd (we have 4, not having one in tank party is a rare occurrence) you can even switch ares's cuirass for homam corazza, and on top of this you can use dorado sushi. (OMG ENMITY FUCK YEAH) I do this regularly and maintain absolute hate aside from roar or a DD trying to kill themselves (spamming WS or 2hring, if you think macahuitl+1 changes this, kill yourself). ^you don't have to change everything I listed, you can mix and match accordingly before you try the angle of overplaying the stats lost from what I listed.


with no madrigal or hunters roll, I sit on ~85% accuracy on khimaira and cerberus, while usually parsing #1/solo tanking most of the time. parsed accuracy is lower on Tiamat because after 2 or 3 flights I don't pay attention to disengaging and my accuracy plummets.

being that those 3 fights are as much HNM as I fight along with SW/DI(which excal is pretty decent for a lot of SW NMs, but mostly shitty on ixion) since I don't try suckle at nidhogg/kb/aspi's teat anymore (have my shit/don't care to risk my account anymore), I consider my excal more than 'just a toy.'

maybe your paladins or ones you saw with excal were just shitty. its a common correlation that excal -> shitty pld. tekki, stanislav and I have parses and people to vouch that its pretty fucking strong if you aren't roundhouse. if I had to choose burtgang or excalibur I'd take excalibur in the blink of an eye. what other relic enables you to kill khimaira in just over 30 minutes with a single party? ugh, didn't realize this post was devoid of most literacy and all structure, oh well, i hope a piano falls on your family

[Tsuko_Asura]

Why don't you go back and read some of my 469 posts? There is a big difference between trolling and disagreeing. You need to learn and acknowledge this difference. Are you capable of thinking and analyzing things for yourself, or do you need something with a nice big "Conformity" label before you'll listen to it? Have you ever had an original thought, or do you live by group-think only?

Hey guys, did you hear? Not thinking is totally cool now!

I'm not entirely sure why I'm even responding to this, but you seem to want a legitimate response, so I'll give you one.

No, Excalibur most certainly does not make you a better tank. It does nothing to help you hold enmity, it does nothing to help you stay alive, but here's the catch - neither of those two things are remotely difficult to do for any tank, least of all the one in question. By making slight alterations in food and equipment choice, neither of which are going to hinder your ability to do the aforementioned responsibilities of the job to any discernible degree, you bring our the potential of the weapon. Sure, the rate of activation isn't all that stellar, but when you consider the fact that its not particularly uncommon for a tank to be swinging their weapon at ~50-60% of their given delay, it becomes a moot point.

Its really about being multifaceted, which the misinformed player tends to believe to be an absurdity when spoken about in regards to a job with such a clearly defined role. The fact of the matter is- and I'll use your own numbers to make this close to home- a Macuahuitl +1 is going to get you to the point of capped CE 4% faster, while an Excalibur can allow your tank to participate in nearly, if not more than 20% of a fight's total damage. Now I ask you; In the grand scheme of things, which is going to be more beneficial to your alliance? Letting your damage-dealers let loose a bit faster, or do more damage than any of them would have individually done in the first place?

[Kurt Cobain]

actually, just wanted to expand on the nothing to help you hold enmity bit, normal hits do give hate, when you're already stacked up on enmity, and merited, it does slightly help, and tiamat is pretty squishy, a 251 hit behind 15ish enmity, while not substantial, does help, as well as the atonement goodness<3

[Aurara]

but omg guys FOUR ENMITY

[Kurt Cobain]

thats FOUR PERCENT volatile enmity bro, its not to be taken lightly

[Aurara]

4 enmity doesnt help when your tanks suck and gets hit for 250-350 on mobs...

[Neosutra]

Ill address a few of your points, though many people have already addressed them. I will then consider the matter closed and hope you stop posting here on this subject.

1. Your estimation of pld inability to hit any mob is inaccurate. With my standard haste/idle set I can maintain around an 80% hit rate on most HNMs with just sushi (that thats assuming Im not using acc neck/rings). With double march and access to a good chunk of haste gear, a pld with excal can put up exceptional damage on any straight tanked fight (ground kings, ToAU kings, Tiamat/wyrms, Jailers, and many more). Having a spot that used to be reserved by a person just to hold the NM with hate now be replaced by someone that can be the number1 DD and hold hate is amazing. (Cue responses about the recent PW fight)

2. Excal offers amazing results for the capabilities of pld soloing. Pld/rdm with excal offers an offensive edge on an already overpowered defensive powerhouse. This combined with the added regen from KoTR make this combination very deadly.

3. /nin Hauteclaire is nigh worthless, and chainsaw provides accelerated emnity generation on a small scale for the first part of the fight. Neither of these compare to what excal offers in these situations.

Please stop arguing things simply to argue.

[Not Kuno]

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y38...BlackHole2.jpg

wat

[Sylvrdragon]

I have one problem with that. Once you start sacrificing strictly tanking setup for hybrid DD setup, where do you stop? I've seen this before. What this ends up being is the PLD insisting on filling a DD slot and only half-ass tanking things. Not saying everyone will do this, but it certainly isn't unheard of.

It goes back to the subject of min/maxing. If you're willing to give up X amount of tanking stats and deem it OK, then why did you bother getting that gear in the first place? Where do you draw the line? If it's so good, then why don't people do this anyway even without Excal? Even without the add effect, you can build TP for Atonement spam.

I'm not against PLDs contributing to the damage if the circumstances permit it. Hell, I leveled PLD from 60-75 in a Hauby and whatever other DD gear I could afford. I've done PLD burns where everyone had Justice/Joy and it was great. Thing is, there are jobs that can do better than even an Excal PLD without a relic, but there aren't too many jobs that can truly do a PLD's job.

Question: What are the details of this famous 20% parse from Stanislav? Was it a lowman fight? If you only have 6 people, and 2-3 of them are support, then 20% starts to look not quite so good.

[Waef]

Wasn't there something about Stan holding Cerb with 4 people and him DDing it down to like 40% before people got there? Or maybe I'm just imagining things.

But someone should post that parse on JoL (before the nerf) where Stan just let his char whack at it with Excal.

[Tonyanjaii]

Since I got my Excalibur I've been messing around with it on a few things. Things like Cerberus, Dark Ixion and did all 3 Sea Jailers this evening. I really enjoy the DPS that it has to offer not only it does extra dmg on the mob but hit for hit its a pretty high dmg weapon and also the 2.5 can proc as well.

The one thing that Pld lacks is hate through damage. They mainly focus on abilities and magic. The sword adds a nice touch to deal more damage which is also a form of a way to accumulate hate.

You might as well say the Aegis is garbage too since it has no enmity and you take less damage which results less HP to cure to accumulate hate, amirate? w

My current setup I have 27 enmity and I really don't see a need for anything more to be honest and I tank just fine and if anything the sword has made tanking more enjoyable.

And last the wooden paddle sword is just plain ugly. I'm so glad i finally got rid of that thing!

[Aurara]

Question: What are the details of this famous 20% parse from Stanislav? Was it a lowman fight? If you only have 6 people, and 2-3 of them are support, then 20% starts to look not quite so good.

iirc, it was a JoL where they had some xtra tanks, and stan just engaged JoL and started wailing on it(again, this is from memory was a long time ago from when i read this)

[Neosutra]

Ok I tried, the guy is still arguing. You guys can have him.

[Sylvrdragon]

I'll concede the point this far: If you're skilled enough, and geared enough that your performance won't suffer as a result, then I suppose the Excalibur can provide a positive effect on straight-tanked, TP-friendly mobs.