Sarah Palin, Republican Vice Presidential Candidate

[kuronosan]

You're not heartless, just ignorant. If you think healthcare should be a right, but only for children, you still think it should be a right, nimrod.

Oh, and looks like Johnny's pulling out all the stops:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27064786/

[Beckwin]

Demos, answer me yes or no: do we require that hospitals provide care to anyone that comes into an ER?

now tell me that by definition, healthcare is not currently a right.

[Shuvo]

to be completely honest, I was again thinking of voting for the guy but this made me turn down the idea completely

Healthcare being a right is fucking ridiculous. Tell me I have no heart, I don't care. Children maybe should, but beyond that, get the fuck out

What's wrong with free healthcare? O_o

[Maxxthepenguin]

to be completely honest, I was again thinking of voting for the guy but this made me turn down the idea completely

Healthcare being a right is fucking ridiculous. Tell me I have no heart, I don't care. Children maybe should, but beyond that, get the fuck out

Without your health, no other right really matters.

That's my line of thinking.

[0ni0n]

to be completely honest, I was again thinking of voting for the guy but this made me turn down the idea completely

Healthcare being a right is fucking ridiculous. Tell me I have no heart, I don't care. Children maybe should, but beyond that, get the fuck out

People who don't have insurance will end up in ER anyway and cost way more for the taxpayers than if they have access to preventive healthcare from the get-go.

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

Demos, answer me yes or no: do we require that hospitals provide care to anyone that comes into an ER?

now tell me that by definition, healthcare is not currently a right.

If health care is a right, then someone should be responsible for providing me with a megaphone when I exercise my right to free speech.

[kuronosan]

If health care is a right, then someone should be responsible for providing me with a megaphone when I exercise my right to free speech.

Swamp you're just chock full of bad analogies. Think about what you said for a second.

[Elvis]

You eat pieces of shit for breakfast?

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

Swamp you're just chock full of bad analogies. Think about what you said for a second.

I did, and in the sense that health care is a right, you're forcing an obligation onto someone else. In the free speech scenario I'm doing the same thing.

[Demosthenes11]

Deficiencies in the ER is a completely separate issue

I should never be paying for someone to go to the doctor for a stomach ache.
I should never be paying for tests someone may not even need.

[0ni0n]

I did, and in the sense that health care is a right, you're forcing an obligation onto someone else. In the free speech scenario I'm doing the same thing.

Under obama's proposal where health care is a right, you will still have to pay for it. It's a right in the sense that you will have access to it if you so choose to and that insurance companies will not be able to exclude you because of your pre-existing conditions. Thanks for playing.

[Blarg]

Not having health care is like playing a reverse lottery every second of the day. Sure you may not 'win' but when you do it can destroy you.

[Senoska]

Text Poll: 622639 A-McCain B-Obama

[ByeByeTasai]

People who don't have insurance will end up in ER anyway and cost way more for the taxpayers than if they have access to preventive healthcare from the get-go.

I call BS. I work in Healthcare... The government turns down approx. 90% of the insurance claims, and the hospitals are left eating the bill. This is why medications and supplies are at a 400% or more mark up. Universal Healthcare, if run like medicare/medicaide, will not cost the American People any more then it already does. Bottom line is all claims are reviewed and if not needed, denied. It will ease complaints, make it easier for the people who actually need it get it, and it will create a little more work force. McCain's plan to give everyone a 5k tax credit will be mostly a waste of American dollars because the majority of it is gonna be wasted on stupid shit.

[Beckwin]

I hope you get a catastrophic illness or injury that you can't afford to treat.

and I hope to hell you realize that routine preventative care is cost-efficient in the long run, not to mention beneficial to health.

edit: directed at Demo11 of course

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

Under obama's proposal where health care is a right, you will still have to pay for it. It's a right in the sense that you will have access to it if you so choose to and that insurance companies will not be able to exclude you because of your pre-existing conditions. Thanks for playing.

So everyone's premiums will go up, nice. And is it not provided by the government under Obama?

[kuronosan]

I did, and in the sense that health care is a right, you're forcing an obligation onto someone else. In the free speech scenario I'm doing the same thing.

No, by saying that Health Care is a right, you are saying that every human being has the right to be taken care of by its country, just as every country has the right to be taken care of by its citizens. You are talking about the responsibility of that right. Health care is just as much a right as speech and self-defense. How we flex the responsibility is what we have to figure out.

Deficiencies in the ER is a completely separate issue

I should never be paying for someone to go to the doctor for a stomach ache.
I should never be paying for tests someone may not even need.

You don't know if they're stomach aches, and you don't know if they don't need the test. The reason people do not go to the ER for these is simply because an ER visit for "just a stomach ache" costs a phenomenal amount of money. I went to the ER for "Cardiac Issues" which turned out to be Acid Reflux. I had to get X-Rays, I had to get blood tests (twice), and they put me on an EKG machine (as well as medication). Despite the fact that this cost me about $1000 I am glad I had the tests done, as unnecessary as they were, because at least I found out that I was okay.

I study medicine myself, and it's always better to be safe than sorry... especially using your shitty logic.

[0ni0n]

Deficiencies in the ER is a completely separate issue

I should never be paying for someone to go to the doctor for a stomach ache.
I should never be paying for tests someone may not even need.

You do know what a HMO gatekeeper or referral is right? There will still be out-of-pocket expense or co-pays to prevent this very unnecessary over-utilization of healthcare from taking place.

[Maxxthepenguin]

Deficiencies in the ER is a completely separate issue

I should never be paying for someone to go to the doctor for a stomach ache.
I should never be paying for tests someone may not even need.

Wait, isn't the point of a test to find out whether you do need it?

[Beckwin]

I call BS. I work in Healthcare... The government turns down approx. 90% of the insurance claims, and the hospitals are left eating the bill. This is why medications and supplies are at a 400% or more mark up. Universal Healthcare, if run like medicare/medicaide, will not cost the American People any more then it already does. Bottom line is all claims are reviewed and if not needed, denied. It will ease complaints, make it easier for the people who actually need it get it, and it will create a little more work force. McCain's plan to give everyone a 5k tax credit will be mostly a waste of American dollars because the majority of it is gonna be wasted on stupid shit.

the point is that the government providing insurance would help hospitals because they wouldn't have to eat the bill for the uninsured. getting everyone insured helps hospitals operate, and could help with ER congestion by virtue of greater preventative care/walk-in clinic treatment.