Sarah Palin, Republican Vice Presidential Candidate

[ZarakiKujata]

Hes not a LICENSED plumber, so hes not a plumber at all.

Is this a fucking joke? Yes, he doesn't have a license so he can't legally own the business he can't fucking buy in the first place because what fucking licensed plumber makes 250k a year in the first place? This follows also with your whole thing with your step-dad... he has a license to practice medicine because he passed his boards and is certified in your state. Joe the plumber has no license so no he is not a fucking plumber at all, much like how he doesnt pay taxes in the first place.

Debating an entire message boards of Dems isnt exactly my idea of a good time. But anyways, what entitles someone to my hard earned money? My step-dad (no, i dont live with my parents) is an ER surgeon saving peoples lives on a daily basis, and he gets paid very well for it. What entitles the burger flipper at McDonalds to his wealth?

Also LMAO at that video, at least we can all agree that was hilarious.

Really? because those who are intelligent, as most of the progressives and conservatives(trolls aside) who post in this thread are, like a healthy argument. Having an intelligent discussion with others is great fun. Semi offtopic but a lot of the intellectuals that drove the Reagan/Gingrich movements have said they enjoyed going to liberal colleges because it gave them opportunity to make their conservative arguments/belief more sound since they were constantly having to defend them, unlike their liberal peers. Nothing entitles the burger flipper to your step-dad's wealth, but that burger flipper is entitled to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness, all of which can not be accomplished without your dad having to pay some taxes. Honestly I dont get this whole conservative anathema to paying taxes. You need them to pay for public schools, police, military that keeps us safe etc. Shit even Grover Norquist understands you can't completely eliminate taxes.

[Bwelch]

It's almost as if people believe we have zero forms of socialism already in place in our current government.

Could you imagine having to haggle a fireman down to a reasonable rate to put out a fire in your house? Of course, in that non socialistic society we would have insurance to cover the costs and some sort of HMO to tell us which part of the fire should and shouldn't be put out.

Kind of an interesting way of looking at things, heh. Do you guys know of any good books that paint a picture of a complete anti socialistic society?

[Remyo]

Oh wow that's almost as rich as your dad coming from you. Also wasn't trolling but ok.

tad breezy

[0ni0n]

Could you imagine having to haggle a fireman down to a reasobable rate to put out a fire in your house? Of course, in that non socialistic society we would have insurance to cover the costs and some sort of HMO to tell us which part of the fire should and shouldn't be put out.

Kind of an interesting way of looking at things, heh. Do you guys know of any good books that paint of picture of a complete anti socialistic society?

like a society where people would leave the sick and poor for death? I would start looking at the Fiction section in a local bookstore.

[Suited Aces]

Why do all the conservatives on this board vehemently attribute poor with laziness and rich with hardwork?

Same reason why all the liberals believe that there are no poor people milking the system and waiting for government handouts and that every person that makes over $250k has no work ethic and is a CEO of a major corporation?

[0ni0n]

Same reason why all the liberals believe that there are no poor people milking the system and waiting for government handouts and that every person that makes over $250k has no work ethic and is a CEO of a major corporation?

I absolutely believe there are poor people who milk the system for their own personal gains. What I am trying to get across is that if the failed executives and corporations are getting enormous handouts, why shouldn't the poor get aids for things as basic as food and healthcare?

It's funny how you are for the rich and argue against socialism, while the rich themselves are enjoying socialistic handouts and would love to get some more.

[Penthesilea]

I absolutely believe there are poor people who milk the system for their own personal gains. What I am trying to get across is that if the failed executives and corporations are getting enormous handouts, why shouldn't the poor get aids for things as basic as food and healthcare?

I'd like to think that the poor who are milking the system aren't living like kings, so I can't really say that they're making personal gains.

[Aerin]

Debating an entire message boards of Dems isnt exactly my idea of a good time. But anyways, what entitles someone to my hard earned money? My step-dad (no, i dont live with my parents) is an ER surgeon saving peoples lives on a daily basis, and he gets paid very well for it. What entitles the burger flipper at McDonalds to his wealth?

Also LMAO at that video, at least we can all agree that was hilarious.

If you only look at situations like that then I can understand your position. But as you said it was an analogy, and a poor one at that.

Yes, some of the rich people out there do work really hard for their money such as doctors. However there's also people out there who don't work nearly as hard and get a ton more than even doctors do.

I don't think anyone here is trying to fight for the 18 year old burger flipper that is too lazy to continue with school. We're thinking about the people that have to work 2 or 3 jobs just to get by, and aren't lazy by any means.

Call me a liberal, but I actually care about people. Even ones I don't know.

EDIT: Forgot to put flipper at the end of burger. I know everyone here would fight for the 18 year old burger.

[Suited Aces]

I absolutely believe there are poor people who milk the system for their own personal gains. What I am trying to get across is that if the failed executives and corporations are getting enormous handouts, why shouldn't the poor get aids for things as basic as food and healthcare?

And as a conservative, I absolutely believe that there are CEOs that make way too much and golden parachutes are ridiculous. My point was generalizations are stupid.

Also poor people do get aid for food and healthcare. Welfare, medicare, WIC and social security programs are already in place.

The difference in opinion is where the money should come from. You believe we should tax the rich to make up the cost increase for these programs and I (me personally) believe we should cut wasteful government spending to make up the increase.

[zoobernut]

Or we could find a balance between both.

[Beckwin]

yeah Onion and Penth pretty much nailed it. Of course there are welfare queens actually out there, somewhere, but despite claims of dubs and plasma tvs, they really aren't living like royalty. 1 golden parachute would cover thousands upon thousands of abusers, and even more people who genuinely make an effort.

And Terrestrial, I'm somewhat doubting your step-dad makes over 250k (although it's possible, idk).

[Dimmauk]

When Obama's tax plan goes into effect, I will quit my job, and ride the gravy train of Government hand-outs.

Working is for suckers.

[Beckwin]

And as a conservative, I absolutely believe that there are CEOs that make way too much and golden parachutes are ridiculous. My point was generalizations are stupid.

Also poor people do get aid for food and healthcare. Welfare, medicare, WIC and social security programs are already in place.

The difference in opinion is where the money should come from. You believe we should tax the rich to make up the cost increase for these programs and I (me personally) believe we should cut wasteful government spending to make up the increase.

Umm, I've seen you argue that those programs are the wasteful spending. If I'm mistake please clarify, but regardless there are certainly many conservatives here who take that position- it's bullshit. It's not quite as incredulous as harping on earmarks, but entitlement programs that aren't social security/medicare make up something like 10-15% of the budget.

[Tristam]

And as a conservative, I absolutely believe that there are CEOs that make way too much and golden parachutes are ridiculous. My point was generalizations are stupid.

Also poor people do get aid for food and healthcare. Welfare, medicare, WIC and social security programs are already in place.

The difference in opinion is where the money should come from. You believe we should tax the rich to make up the cost increase for these programs and I (me personally) believe we should cut wasteful government spending to make up the increase.

I think we ALL want to cut wasteful gov't spending, that seems like a no-brainer. However I think we're losing some perspective in that we're focusing on the poor when this tax-cut will have just as much an effect on the middle class. Much has been made about the credit crisis and how the economy has hurt the purchasing power of the middle class. And this isn't just people who need to pay off their credit card bills. This is for people on fixed incomes (like grad students), joe the plumbers, the recently unemployed, etc. Considering the economy runs on the flow of money, is it hard to imagine that this tax break for the middle class will eventually benefit the rich who are paying the price for now?

[0ni0n]

And as a conservative, I absolutely believe that there are CEOs that make way too much and golden parachutes are ridiculous. My point was generalizations are stupid.

Also poor people do get aid for food and healthcare. Welfare, medicare, WIC and social security programs are already in place.

The difference in opinion is where the money should come from. You believe we should tax the rich to make up the cost increase for these programs and I (me personally) believe we should cut wasteful government spending to make up the increase.

My argument was directed to Remyo, Terrestrail, and Swamp. I do agree they are a skewed representation of conservatives on the board, but until you spoke up, i didn't see anything pointing to the contrary.

I am for tax cuts for the poor and a moderate tax increase for the rich. I also support both reduction in wasteful government spending, if not outright elimination, and additional funds for underfunded programs include but not limited to healthcare, education, renewable energy, domestic infrastructure, and space exploration.

[Suited Aces]

Umm, I've seen you argue that those programs are the wasteful spending.

Me? I don't think so. I may argue that we need stricter regulations on who receives them (drug testing the recipients comes to mind), but I would not have argued that the programs themselves are wasteful.

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

Why do all the conservatives on this board vehemently attribute poor with laziness and rich with hardwork?

I don't think I've ever said anything remotely close to that.

[Penthesilea]

So if they're not lazy, how would you suggest them to improve their situation?

[Beckwin]

Me? I don't think so. I may argue that we need stricter regulations on who receives them (drug testing the recipients comes to mind), but I would not have argued that the programs themselves are wasteful.

Fair enough, although the whole drug thing is bollocks. Talk about wasteful government spending, lol. From marijuana related incarceration to local drug enforcement to adventures in/checks sent to South America...

[Beckwin]

cool pics

http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/5...nspeechuu6.jpg