Absolute Virtue ~ 9/8/08

[Lebzile]

Congrats to you guys also. I definitely agree about it being awesome when multiple LS's work together where applicable if they see it to be the best solution.

So true, but seeing this means Cerberus will be the last of all the servers to take AV down.

[Kaeko]

I agree to this. Much of the main reason why KC zerg works is because of form changes that take time. However, im pretty sure it isn't just AV that 'glitches', other Aerns have some form changing BS as well but you're never killing them so fast that they'd undergo 2 form-changes almost immediately. The form changes buys people time... which helps..

At the same time, I think evidence from the zerg and people trying to take over from other's zerg attempts lend credence to Belkin's tiered behaviour-AI theory. Obviously from having zerged AV down to like 30% in 30s, AV would have been pushed to his 'pissed mode' and even after they wipe, the next LS who pulls him would be starting in 'pissed mode'...
Another zerg from that point might be possible if people can use their side parties to figure out how to bring him to a lower tier (now i'm kinda guessing this is where 2hrs come in).. and then proceed from there, but without the help of form-changes.

If it matters, we went for AV almost IMMEDIATELY after JoL died... maybe about 60 seconds after for 2 of them, 2 minutes-ish for the other win. I think Belkin mentioned the idea of AV being 'easier' and getting progressively harder as it's out.

Also if anyone cares:

BBQ: Sash, Bellona, Mars, Minerva, Aureole, Raphael
LB: GKT, Raphael, Mars, Bellona
TK: Sash, Bellona, Mars, Minerva, Raphael

About 6 hours total including downtime and gathering. The LS name we used was Awsomeland (yes that's how it was spelled).

[Spira]

i think that matters.. because it means you're starting at 100% HP and the initial tame behaviour.. if we're following thru with the theory.. meaning you have slightly more time between initially engaging him and him reaching apeshit mode

[[Vax]]

I'm wondering about the GK drop rate... during LB's kill did AV ever go white before the zerg?

I know you said almost immediately, but there is still time for it to un-claim.

[Kaeko]

I'm wondering about the GK drop rate... during LB's kill did AV ever go white before the zerg?

Always went yellow/white. We let the JoL alliance wipe and AV reset. After it resets then the gank occurs maybe about 15 seconds after reset.

On BBQ's kill the gank alliance wasn't quite ready so we had to sac twice, but otherwise same deal.

[willriker]

to say that the 3 LS cooperative, on Odin Server, known as AWSOMELAND went after AV immidiately after it popped is untrue. We waited until AV completely lost agro/killed as many from the JoL alliance that needed to be killed befor ethe Zerg alliance went in to kill AV.

we did not go for AV immidiately after it spawned.

[Kaeko]

to say that the 3 LS cooperative, on Odin Server, known as AWSOMELAND went after AV immidiately after it popped is untrue. We waited until AV completely lost agro/killed as many from the JoL alliance that needed to be killed befor ethe Zerg alliance went in to kill AV.

we did not go for AV immidiately after it spawned.

Yea it was maybe AV pop >> wait about 60ish seconds for deaths (not everyone in the ally dies... I remember BBQ's kill only Ryagi died (1 person...)) >> wait 15-20 seconds for gank alliance to prep > go

Just to clarify.

[Meat]

Nah, Asura will be for sure. And boy will there be drama with dorps.

why would you say that? I don't think any of the asuran born shells have much of a problem teaming up,

[TB]

I'm not sure how fast ours were, I'll have to check the video. AV was clearly just freezing up and not doing anything, especially near the last 50% HP for us though.

It's not completely freezing up. It does freeze a few seconds when swichting forms, but afterwards it still tries to kill you. On fight 3 for example it Used AOE Stun, Aeroga4 and Jaevlin Throw all after going into bracelets form. So it's not locking itself completely for a long time.

[MIGhunter]

You know what really sucks about this is now ppl will stop trying to figure out the secret. It is now all about the zerg instead of how to actually kill it.

[EdgeMoragan]

You know what really sucks about this is now ppl will stop trying to figure out the secret. It is now all about the zerg instead of how to actually kill it.

SE's fault and I think most of us are beyond even caring about their obsession with making us figure out elemental-and-2hr calculus to beat a mob we've wanted for 2-3 years.

[Lebzile]

You know what really sucks about this is now ppl will stop trying to figure out the secret. It is now all about the zerg instead of how to actually kill it.

You know what really sucks? When people keep on crying about people using zerg tactics to take down a mob that has been studied tediously for 3 years since it's release and constantly dying to it.

How about you not QQ and congratulate them.

[Demonic]

Yay for low drop rate GKT. :<

[pendragoon]

Congrats everyone!

lol, it's easy to understand why people are QQ'ing... It's like eatting a giant piece of chocolate cake infront of 80 fat kids. It is amazing, but there are many that have no option to kill.

We're just as far today as we were 5 days ago or 2 months or a year ago from actually knowing how to kill AV correctly/consistantly. Very few LS have 5+ kraken drk sitting around. Without a "real" strategy, only 5+ kraken drk LS stand any decent chance.

I watched one of the best LS on Gilgamesh fail to him.... not cause they lacked skill or coordination... cause they lacked kraken clubs.

Everyone has seen a kraken zerg can/will win. We're locking ourselves into this train of thought, that it requires a zerg. At this point, this thread holds no purpose but to claim your kills. Kraken zerg wont really give anyone any information about AV's weaknesses or his responses to elements/ws/whatever.

"We're fighting AV, news coming!"
"We killed him in 4 seconds, he didn't even move"
"He dropped x number of the drops everyone already knows he can drop"
Wow... thanks for the helpful information... lol

[Tonyanjaii]

Like I said, probably if you hold it for longer than 225 seconds (Which isn't really that long considering it takes most people a minute or two to get their shit together in the scramble) without any damage, he'll get pissed off too. Doing nothing at all also triggers said 2HR's. But I haven't seen any AV attempts recently open with any sort of Chainspell or Manafont. Have you guys? (Seriously tell me if you have)

We killed JOL earlier this week, he opened up with Chainspell Aeroga IV and Tornado's immediately upon engaging. We were unable to survive this... and this happened in within 10-15 seconds of engaging it.

[magniusofhades]

Down in Caitsith DaFunk LS. DRK burn. Same drops as everyone, no GKT.

[ringthree]

We killed JOL earlier this week, he opened up with Chainspell Aeroga IV and Tornado's immediately upon engaging. We were unable to survive this... and this happened in within 10-15 seconds of engaging it.

Perhaps open with spell of the day to see if it calms it a bit, or at least to deal with it's regen, before zerging it?

[Valkrish]

no more speculation plz :\

they found a way that works, lets roll with that for the moment and see what happens.

[Tubbers]

JP ls attempted to zerg it about 10 mins ago on Ragnarok, 9% So if anyone was wondering if they were trying it this way also, they are.

[Zosi]

If you can zerg it and it works, why not? Nothing wrong with that.

It's like beating a hard game on the easiest difficulty setting. The fact that you beat it and the people playing on normal or hard are still trying doesn't necessarily mean that you're better than they are, you just had lower goals. There's no shame in that, but it's ridiculous to attack the people who want to "beat it on normal" like some people in this thread have done.

Not trying to put down the achievements of the zergers at all, but I think that when the first HP figures started coming in, we all knew that it'd be zerged, it was just a matter of time and getting LSs with enough zerg DRKs to try it. We still don't know how to kill it "traditionally", or even if it's possible, but if an LS discovers a method, their kill will be a milestone in FFXI an order of magnitude more important and notable than applying fairly well known zerg tactics to a heavily weakened AV. That's what a lot of people are after, not just sashes and rings.

If there really is no way to kill it other than a dozen zerg DRKs, I think that we can all agree that that's an incredible failure on SE's part. Less failure than when it was completely unkillable, but still completely unacceptable.