Last day today?

[Melchiah]

The Church has historically been opposed to science, or any pursuit of knowledge not filtered through or restricted by the Church.

This fact alone is enough for me. Galileo was excommunicated from the Church and brought up on charges and subsequently forced to publicly say he was full of shit and then held under house arrest for the remainder of his life because he said the earth revolved around the sun.

Stem cell research is banned in the US because the majority here is hung up on some kind of silliness involving dictionary definitions and arithmetic of souls(arithmetic of an non-quantifiable subject wut wut?). This can be traced directly back to the church's influence on abortion. I'll not open that can of worms, but the connection is there and it cannot be argued.

Plainly said, the church and science are competitors for attention, funds, and ultimately, the direction of the human race. I will concede that there are many good works done in the name of the church, and I think it is awesome that those things are happening. However, I will also point out that there were never Holy Wars of Science where millions were slaughtered for thinking differently. That has always been the church's m.o..

So don't sit there and act like you know what I think about any given topic because of one statement I made. Religion as it is, and as it was is a crutch to the weak minded and weak hearted, a hobble to those who desire an unrestrained pursuit of knowledge, and it has no place in a world where we aren't scared of ghosts in the dark and monsters in the shadows.

To answer the faith remark above, atheism requires nothing but an open mind. Atheism simply says "Show me; until you have proof, shut your hole."

[Maguspk]

The Church has historically been opposed to science, or any pursuit of knowledge not filtered through or restricted by the Church.

This fact alone is enough for me. Galileo was excommunicated from the Church and brought up on charges and subsequently forced to publicly say he was full of shit and then held under house arrest for the remainder of his life because he said the earth revolved around the sun.

Stem cell research is banned in the US because the majority here is hung up on some kind of silliness involving dictionary definitions and arithmetic of souls(arithmetic of an non-quantifiable subject wut wut?). This can be traced directly back to the church's influence on abortion. I'll not open that can of worms, but the connection is there and it cannot be argued.

Plainly said, the church and science are competitors for attention, funds, and ultimately, the direction of the human race. I will concede that there are many good works done in the name of the church, and I think it is awesome that those things are happening. However, I will also point out that there were never Holy Wars of Science where millions were slaughtered for thinking differently. That has always been the church's m.o..

So don't sit there and act like you know what I think about any given topic because of one statement I made. Religion as it is, and as it was is a crutch to the weak minded and weak hearted, a hobble to those who desire an unrestrained pursuit of knowledge, and it has no place in a world where we aren't scared of ghosts in the dark and monsters in the shadows.

To answer the faith remark above, atheism requires nothing but an open mind. Atheism simply says "Show me; until you have proof, shut your hole."

Pro-life atheists don't exist, guys.

Yes only weak minds have faith in religion, that's why multiple philosophers and influential thinkers have and have had religious affiliations. God, saying shit like Religion is for the weak minded is such a terrible argument. What basis do you have for that, what proof can you offer that anyone who chooses to believe there is something after life is also a "weak mind". For that matter, what the fuck is a "weak mind"? Arguments like the one you presented above are what we'd call an argument 'ad hominem'. You're arguing against something just because of the people who fucking believe it; there is a line there, and choosing to base your argument based on the belief or the characteristics of the person is a big fat fallacy.

Also, to correct the false statement above. Agnosticism requires nothing but an open mind. Agnosticism simply says "Show me; until you have proof shut your hole."

[pohibaba]

Melchiah, please never leave the house. You make all atheists look like raving lunatics.

[Melchiah]

Pro-life atheists don't exist, guys.

This is a serious stretch from what I said.

Yes only weak minds have faith in religion, that's why multiple philosophers and influential thinkers have and have had religious affiliations. God, saying shit like Religion is for the weak minded is such a terrible argument. What basis do you have for that, what proof can you offer that anyone who chooses to believe there is something after life is also a "weak mind". For that matter, what the fuck is a "weak mind"? Arguments like the one you presented above are what we'd call an argument 'ad hominem'. You're arguing against something just because of the people who fucking believe it; there is a line there, and choosing to base your argument based on the belief or the characteristics of the person is a big fat fallacy.

The scientific mind is conditioned to question everything, especially anything posed in the form of "fact" and not "hypothesis". Of the world's major religions, not a one offers anything more than a vague reference to a person who is long since dead as validation or source material for their magical mystery tour fantasies. That's why I say it has no place in the modern world; we live in a world of evidence, scrutiny and experimentation. We don't need Zeus and his wrath to explain a thunderstorm anymore. I don't need the Bible to know that I shouldn't be an asshole to my neighbor. And I'm sorry, but if you have to have the story of Jesus retold to you every Sunday morning so that you won't be a dick to everyone else in the coming week, then yeah I'm tempted to believe you have a weak mind.

Don't get me wrong, my problem is not that others choose to believe in their religion of choice. My problem with religion on the larger scale, more specifically Christianity and Islam, is the way it holds the human race back. It's just disgusting.

Also, to correct the false statement above. Agnosticism requires nothing but an open mind. Agnosticism simply says "Show me; until you have proof shut your hole."

An honest mistake, but the point remains. "Because I said so" is only good for toddlers, not entire cultures of adults.

And pohibaba: Who the fuck are you?

[Demetrius*]

To answer the faith remark above, atheism requires nothing but an open mind. Atheism simply says "Show me; until you have proof, shut your hole."

I'm afraid that's not how atheism works >_> If you want to keep more of an open mind, try agnosticism.
Atheism is more about saying you don't believe based on proof, not because of lack of proof in whichever theism. There's many contradictions in religion that lead people to logical conclusions in that these are false beliefs. If you're trying to say you don't believe simply because there's no proof to the contrary, then you lack knowledge in both theism and atheism and don't have true justification for whichever stance you take.
Just because Christianity may be wrong for example, doesn't automatically make atheists right. You can both be wrong. maybe there's 25 half-elephant half-penguin gods that rule each solar system.

[HAcoreRD]

The Church has historically been opposed to science, or any pursuit of knowledge not filtered through or restricted by the Church.

This fact alone is enough for me. Galileo was excommunicated from the Church and brought up on charges and subsequently forced to publicly say he was full of shit and then held under house arrest for the remainder of his life because he said the earth revolved around the sun.

Stem cell research is banned in the US because the majority here is hung up on some kind of silliness involving dictionary definitions and arithmetic of souls(arithmetic of an non-quantifiable subject wut wut?). This can be traced directly back to the church's influence on abortion. I'll not open that can of worms, but the connection is there and it cannot be argued.

Plainly said, the church and science are competitors for attention, funds, and ultimately, the direction of the human race. I will concede that there are many good works done in the name of the church, and I think it is awesome that those things are happening. However, I will also point out that there were never Holy Wars of Science where millions were slaughtered for thinking differently. That has always been the church's m.o..

So don't sit there and act like you know what I think about any given topic because of one statement I made. Religion as it is, and as it was is a crutch to the weak minded and weak hearted, a hobble to those who desire an unrestrained pursuit of knowledge, and it has no place in a world where we aren't scared of ghosts in the dark and monsters in the shadows.

To answer the faith remark above, atheism requires nothing but an open mind. Atheism simply says "Show me; until you have proof, shut your hole."

I agree with everything said here, minus the last sentence.

Atheist say "god doesn't exist." agnostic require proof for both.

But true. Hence why America is always "Religious America" to me. Where you can get taxed up the cunt unless your 'marry' under a church of god.

[Melchiah]

Fine, if we are going to play the name game, but you are two posts late, nomenclature etc.

Also, say you don't believe in a God and you are automatically labeled atheist regardless of the basis of that statement.

To say you believe there is no god based on proof is a fallacious argument in the first place, because you can't disprove Yahweh unless you change the premises of Yahweh, which you can't, therefore you can't.

I never said I had seen proof there was no god. All I said was that organized religion, as it is today and has been in the past, is obsolete.

[Kuya]

I remember when science didn't answer to morality...

...

[Maguspk]

I remember when science didn't answer to morality...

...

Ya Mary Shelley had the right idea. Fuck morality, just do shit.

[Kuya]

You missed the point by about a few galaxies.

[Maguspk]

You missed the point by about a few galaxies.

[Demetrius*]

Fine, if we are going to play the name game, but you are two posts late, nomenclature etc.

Also, say you don't believe in a God and you are automatically labeled atheist regardless of the basis of that statement.

To say you believe there is no god based on proof is a fallacious argument in the first place, because you can't disprove Yahweh unless you change the premises of Yahweh, which you can't, therefore you can't.

I never said I had seen proof there was no god. All I said was that organized religion, as it is today and has been in the past, is obsolete.

Is this for real? Do you really need to hear the paradoxes on this? you're giving me a pretty easy target.

[Melchiah]

Ya Mary Shelley had the right idea. Fuck morality, just do shit.

If you think religion and morality are bedfellows you are way beyond the thunderdome of reality my friend.

[Kuya]

If you think religion and morality are bedfellows you are way beyond the thunderdome of reality my friend.

lololololololololololololol

[Maguspk]

If you think religion and morality are bedfellows you are way beyond the thunderdome of reality my friend.

I fail to see where I ever mentioned religion in that post. It's about morality.

[Kuya]

First of all, if you're just saying that you don't need religion for morality to exist, than you're right, science makes a pretty useful justification for morality as well.

[Melchiah]

Is this for real? Do you really need to hear the paradoxes on this? you're giving me a pretty easy target.

If you find a paradox it's only due to poor wording on my part. But since I can't readily see one, knock yourself out. I'll gladly rephrase if I haven't been clear.

[Max™]

Oh good, I missed those last few posts, and hoped that someone would remind them that Atheism is not Agnosticism.

Agnostic is the only purely logical option: you're admitting that you don't or can't know, and as such cannot in good conscience make a decision on that subject.

Atheism is not logical: you're ignoring that you don't or can't know, and are choosing to make a decision based on what you feel or believe.

Example!

I'm agnostic about the Higgs Boson, while I don't feel it is necessary, and don't think we will find one, I have to admit that there is a possibility the standard model is correct.

I'm atheistic about Hawking Radiation, I don't believe black holes radiate, even though I cannot possibly know for sure since no one has SEEN a black hole to determine if they do or not.

[Maguspk]

First of all, if you're just saying that you don't need religion for morality to exist, than you're right, science makes a pretty useful justification for morality as well.

I was just pointing out how foolish it is to think you can ever have something free from morality because it's pervasive in all the decisions we make. I definitely don't think you need religion to have morality, morality is just something we develop as a social creature with cognitive processes and it's dependent on our society as a whole not just religion, science, or any one particular field. A multitude of factors influence what we see as "right and wrong" and even without religion we'd still have "right and wrong" and there'd still be questions of "morality" over things concerning science.

[Melchiah]

I was just pointing out how foolish it is to think you can ever have something free from morality because it's pervasive in all the decisions we make. I definitely don't think you need religion to have morality, morality is just something we develop as a social creature with cognitive processes.

I will agree with this, up to a point. Society determines morality, right and wrong are what we decide is right and wrong.

Furthermore, I have to admit that most of the 10 commandments(New Testament Law) are a good way to behave.