Mythic vs. Relic, a "Should I upgrade" Thread.

[Fwahm]

Even with the best conditions of double march and spell haste, with standard haste gear, you would only be getting about an 18% increase in attack speed. The Liberator would have much higher DoT, and the weapon skill to active it's aftermath is much better than Catastrophie for damage, which you would use more often in return.

[ninjafox]

Maybe Augment's Berserk gives a stupid critical hit rate increase or something...

they made jumps autocrit dammit...

SE would win the world with this

[Seshat]

Yeah no knocking the SMN weapon though for people who don't play much it's def. impossible to upgrade, lol. That, plus that headband and all other Perp - gear will not only give you a free Garuda, but would allow you to gain MP with her out much like Carby. x_X

[Chen]

nirvana > claustrum as izzy said, for smn

as for whm.. if divine seal is always active, i'd get it over the relic club, but if you gotta ws, i'd take the whm relic club for the shinyness

[Wolfknight]

No comment on SAM weapon, unless the enhancement can make the 3rd eye on till the next 3rd Eye is up again 90% of the time, it won't be that much helpful

I was thinking and for sam weapon If Kogarasumaru dramatically increased counter rate to say 50~75%[or higher if SE crazy since SE did make jumps forced crits] it would probably destroy every other gkt easily in tanking stuff, in term of damage due to counter procs, though if this is the case I get a feeling monks would be very very mad. So two other decent Options I could see happening which could be simply greatly improve the TE proc rate thus making it excellent for tanking like you mentioned, or maybe SE will let TE magically eat Spells and WSes that use to wipe or ignore TE that would be great too though if something besides this I can't see it being that great at all.

[Amele]

I was thinking and for sam weapon If Kogarasumaru dramatically increased counter rate to say 50~75%[or higher if SE crazy since SE did make jumps forced crits] it would probably destroy every other gkt easily in tanking stuff, in term of damage due to counter procs, though if this is the case I get a feeling monks would be very very mad. So two other decent Options I could see happening which could be simply greatly improve the TE proc rate thus making it excellent for tanking like you mentioned, or maybe SE will let TE magically eat Spells and WSes that use to wipe or ignore TE that would be great too though if something besides this I can't see it being that great at all.

letting TE absorb spells would be absurd.

and awesome.

[Max™]

Making it always have a minimum of 3 eyes, or letting you get the Seigan effect with Hasso up, either one would be pretty sweet.

[Wolfknight]

Making it always have a minimum of 3 eyes, or letting you get the Seigan effect with Hasso up, either one would be pretty sweet.

yea that would be really good but it seems unlike I would think SE would have used "Enhance Hasso" or "Enhance Seigan" for that.

[Tan]

I could go with letting you Anticipate AoE attacks, or giving you TP when you Counter <3

[Max™]

yea that would be really good but it seems unlike I would think SE would have used "Enhance Hasso" or "Enhance Seigan" for that.

Well, making TE work like Seigan is up (:30 recast, 1+n eyes, random decreasing counter possibility), would be an Enhance Hasso sort of, but technically it would be a buff to TE only.

[frodnonnag]

Yeah no knocking the SMN weapon though for people who don't play much it's def. impossible to upgrade, lol. That, plus that headband and all other Perp - gear will not only give you a free Garuda, but would allow you to gain MP with her out much like Carby. x_X

incorrect, it would put garuda and fenrir at -1 perp with perfect gear(penance robe, nash gloves, af+1 feet, ring, karura hachigane) you would need to trigger sanction, sigil, poisontaster's cape, or relic body or head. the only way to get free solo refreshing on either avatar, is to trigger two of the listed items.

[jimbobsonofgod]

Gamma Earring -1 perp cost in Salvage/Nyzul Isle/Assault
Nashira gages - 1 perp cost
Smn horn - weather -3 perp cost
Smn body - day -3 perp cost
Karura Hachigane -2 perp cost (Garuda)
Evoker gages -2 perp cost (Leviathan inside Besieged)
Conjurer's Ring -1 perp cost (>75% HP)
Evoker's Ring -1 perp cost
Evoker Pighaches +1 -1 perp cost
Carbuncle mitts -50~(rounded) perp cost carbuncle)
Austere robe - 1 perp cost
Penanace robe - 2 perp cost
(insert the Vcloak/Vcloak+1/yinyang/ixion/Dalma/Marduk here for +1 refresh)

Astral Signa -2 perp cost
Dragon Staff -1 perp cost
NQ elemental staves -2 perp cost
HQ elemental staves -3 perp cost
Bahamut's staff -3 perp cost
Nirvana -4 perp cost

Aside from the situational pieces instead of spending millions gil and years of effort to get a Nirvana to avoid situational shit. just carry and assload of yagudo drinks if free avatars is your goal.
Yagudo drink -3 perp cost and less effort to get then any of the above go!

[Vail]

BLM weapon and SCH weapon are both weaker than HQ staves prior to aftermath. Someone might have to bite the bullet to find out the ES upgrade on the BLM one though. SCH one blows.

my guess is it'll keep Elemental Seal up for the full minute duration, regardless of how many spells you cast.

[Therin]

If SAM relic gives you permanent Seigan proc-rate whenever you use Third Eye (meaning multiple shadows, so that you only receive lower recast from using Seigan) it'll be fucking broken.

As for Conqueror, maybe the Berserk Augmentation is Double Attack +10%. /grin

[Max™]

Perhaps Augments Berserk will cause you to ignore level correction.

*faps thinking about that*

[Therin]

Fucking. . They really need to get rid of Savagery's effect (even though it's kind of neat, it's fairly shitty in actuality) and replace it with Double Attack +X% during Warcry. That'd be amazing.

[Kairos]

I think i will only comment on the jobs I have since a couple of them were dismissed in the original post. Since I am a master of all pets, i will analyze based on how well they benefit both the player AND the pet.


Smn:

Nirvana is a great weapon that far outclasses any other staff you can get for smn. The -4 avatar perpetuation is nice, but the big deal on this weapon is the +20 MAB for avatars. Avatars have no native MAB trait, so the magic damage they do just tends to be really low even if not resisted. For merit pacts, mine tend to do 1028 with tp capped (just a few hits since i have 5/5 merited pacts). MAB on the staff would not only do a lot to boost the merit and magical pact damage, but would also boost the magic damage of spirit's spells, which tend to hit for 600-900 depending on the spell cast. Even cheap, weak pacts like somnolenece/netherblast/thunderspark/meteor would suddenly become very good efficient magic damage pacts.

The aftermath effect i'm not too concerned with except for solo, but of course you could gain 300 tp on nearby mobs when camping something and use bliss weaponskill when you start fighting. The acc and attack twice is nice because career summoners tend to solo quite a bit, and constantly having fast tp gain would allow you to spirit taker and always keep up mp no matter how many times you spam ward/rage pacts.

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Drg:

Ryunohige could be a really awesome weapon depending on the jump augmenting effect. I suspect that the augment might add another factor in jump damage calculation that makes the damage soar, or it could even add more tp per jump (10-15 more or so?). In the vid on ffxiwiki, when the dragoon used jump he one shotted the puk, so it appears to be a pretty big boost to jumps which is great because a drg is using at least a jump a minute. This weapon's job enhancing effect would be in constant use.

For the aftermath effect, its great for the drg, but I can't see it being a big deal for the wyvern until SE does the update where they plan to increase the amount of actions a wyvern can execute in battle. Wyverns are offensively the weakest of all pets in the game, so the aftermath is much more to benefit the player than the pet.

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Pup:

The kenkonken does the best job any weapon can possibly do for boosting everything a pup needs, as well as removing hinderances to the job. There is no real info on how big the martial arts enhancement is, but looking at the effects one other weapons its probably 60 or 40 delay reduction, bringing you back to bare fisted delay speed. No one can say for sure though because the premiere site people didn't do a good job of bringing back really helpful information on the specifics of mythic weapon effects.

Suppresses overload effect on this weapon is the big seller for pup. If it completely removes the chance of overloading on maneuvers, a pup with this weapon can keep the automaton maxxed on a single maneuver without ever having the fear of overloading. Things that could only be achieved for 1 minute once every 10 minutes or so can be maintained full time whenever needed.

Fire: +35% attack +.75 fTP to auto weaponskills + 20 enmity +20 store tp + negate enemy defense caused by level differences

Ice: +35MAB + 8 seconds faster casting timer + 60% to spell damage + large magic acc.

Wind: +35 eva +20% ranged acc. + 12 sec arrow timer +25% haste +4 blink shadows

Earth: +35% def +40% dmg reduction +phyical automaton invincibility +25% slow and 400dmng on shield bashes.

Thunder: 40% double attack rate + 35 acc + 25% crit rate +negate enemy eva based on level differences

Water: +65MDB -40 enmity +40MAB +60% memorized magical dmg resistance (condenser becomes useless as overload is no longer a possibility)

Light: +6hp/tick regen +prompt cures as early as 90% + total of 3 negative effects erased from puppet or master at once +30% boost in all attachments.

Dark: +6mp/tick refresh +50 conserveMP +45% of mp auto restored +higher mana convert trigger.

The aftermath effect can be taken full advantage of by any frame/head combination by both the puppet and master unless you are in nuking mode in the back lines, in which case you're most likely not meleeing anyway. This is the weapon i'm working on upgrading since it has a huge amount of different benefits that can be gained from it because of the way the attachment/maneuver system works. Instead of once every 10 minutes, I would be able to ALWAYS max out multiple attachments at once. Always having max MAB, max MP recovery, max DA rate, max haste for the puppet will be extremely nice to have in any situation. In addition with 3 water/earth maneuvers, your puppet can mitigate any attack down to 40%, or even become invincible to physical attacks with earth maneuvers being spammed. Out of all my jobs, this one wins for sheer utility. Nirvana is great, but it doesn't boost every possible angle of the job like this weapon does. The weaponskill for kenkonken looks awesome as well.

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Bst:

The Aymur is one of those things you can't really be sure of as far as how it effects the pet. Pet attack boost does more for beastmaster's and puppetmaster's pets than it does for wyverns and avatars/spirits. Beastemaster's pets already hit hard compared to the other 3 pets (swing for swing wise). Enhances sic is the tricky part, because we don't know how Sic is enhanced. This weapon could possibly make it so that using sic adds a meditate effect to the pet, or maybe even makes the pet use its tp as soon as it gains 100%.

As for the aftermath effect its of course great for the meleeing bst and insanity for the pets which already have double attack natively, especially if the enhance pet attack on the aymur is as strong as the effects on other mythic weapons.

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Ugh, its crappy. Its basically just full time klimaform with a MAB and -enmity bonus added to it. Its not completely terrible, but its not good for a mythic weapon.

[Fwahm]

Kairos, Enhances jump makes them Auto-critical.

[Dantrag]

Therin, you can't be 100% sure until they're actually out.

[Kairos]

Kairos, Enhances jump makes them Auto-critical.

I know from watching the video of it being tested on the site summit that's what it seems to do, but the amount of information they give about the effect is really limited. I also don't trust those who were at the site summit to know that much about testing the weapons or the effects of the weapons. Sadly we can only know what they reported to us about these weapons. For me, making them auto-crit is not enough for me to consider upgrading this weapon as my choice. It would have to be something like forces DA or TripleAttack on jumps and boosts tp gained from jump. The video the summit people posted is too low res for me to glean any of that information from it.