Salvage Strats Review/input from experts

[fishstix]

He yells at us if we dont pull fast enough D:

[Neosutra]

For the SSR strat, it looks solid, but I see in no way how you could possibly kill the 16 fomor, 4 imps and powderkeg in 15-20mins? Even with 8+ people I dont see it happening in under 25-30

Takes us a little over 15 minutes with 2 mnks, 1 war, and thf dding.

Fucking epicly awesome pulling and 2 brds = sex. Edit: 15 min to clear all mobs, another 2 for powder.

[tymora]

I don't like that 30 min limit...unnecessary stress!

There are times where no mnd or vit drops till the big room so it is all a big risk to rush for 4F to boss.

But perhaps the better question would be, what happens when you screw up somewhere? Can you guarantee 100% success on 4F - 6F and boss? What happens if insufficient HP drops for boss fight? 1 mistimed discord = the end of half the party no?

[Neosutra]

I don't like that 30 min limit...unnecessary stress!

There are times where no mnd or vit drops till the big room so it is all a big risk to rush for 4F to boss.

But perhaps the better question would be, what happens when you screw up somewhere? Can you guarantee 100% success on 4F - 6F and boss? What happens if insufficient HP drops for boss fight? 1 mistimed discord = the end of half the party no?

You can get stats and hp from the mamools on 4th floor. The only cells you are stressed to get before 4th floor are mp and armor.

[Valyana]

You might add a note that in Zhayolm 2F, the back left mob cluster in each room always has two cell droppers. This helps a lot if you don't use dat mods.

Slot NM name is Jakko.

For SSR, yes there are several ways a THF can stay alive, but it takes some experience to get away with some of these and knowledge of pathing and the gear train. Tis not something I want to toss on a thf his first SSR.

I think it's good to put both simple and optimal tactics in your page so that all the info is there when people are ready for it.

If you are unlucky not to have 1 and you have 2 additional flees for the THF (1 hermes + 1 boots or 2 x boots), said THF can avoid a death. (Doesn't need PD either)

This seems excessive; I'd think that 2 flees + PD would be enough. Flee to collect room and run south a bit, PD when they get close, then Flee north to deaggro and rejoin the rest of the group. Might be doable without the PD if you wait in the big room and run around when they get close so they don't get a chance to attack you. But I've never tried it myself, so what do I know?

Arrapago 5F: If you went North (Bhoot), the Rampart on the way to the portal to 6F pops a Goobbue which drops STR, which can be very helpful in clearing 6F fast enough to pop the QQTHes.

On 6F, I find that it works well to pull the North rampart early so that mages can stand there without magic aggro. My group has one of the tanks port up first and just grab the nearest gear and start killing it on top of the porter.

In SSR, we often pull the Chariot as well as the 4 Ramparts so we don't need to train the room again.

[pchan]

Silver Sea CC pull :

We use 3 pullers and one THF saccing. 2 melee/nin claim 2 ramparts each (every job can equip range :D), 3 rd puller claims the chariot and then bring them at start (preferably mvt speed + for chariot).


Silver sea 1F :

A rdm with magic at this point can keep 2 fomors with bind&gravity, leaving only 3 fomors after the saccer. Usually the one with gravity will deaggro right ontop of the camp, making it fast to target for melees.

[Neosutra]

Thanx for the help guys, Ill work on updating some of the strats with some insights.

I like the idea of getting str off the 6F rampart for arrapoga, that definately helps.

And I like the idea of "general idea" and "optimal idea", so there is a format that someone can read if they have never done the zone, and a more advanced approach that contains insight into doing it better.

[Hyan]

For flans in 2f Bhaflau, enough skillchain damage will remove the spikes. We had a warrior SC darkness with steel cyclone for 3500 damage, and few secs after spikes disappeared and we had to log out to clear regen, since it wouldn't put them back up. Wyvern breath for 1500+ however didn't remove spikes, so I'd imagine the damages gotta be pretty high for the spikes to be removed.

[MillionDollarMan]

Thanx for the help guys, Ill work on updating some of the strats with some insights.

I like the idea of getting str off the 6F rampart for arrapoga, that definately helps.

And I like the idea of "general idea" and "optimal idea", so there is a format that someone can read if they have never done the zone, and a more advanced approach that contains insight into doing it better.

You don't get like 6 str on first floor? We get max str all the time...

[chapstick]

You don't get like 6 str on first floor? We get max str all the time...

On first floor? Do you kill the Sabotender or what? Cuz I've only seen stats drop off the Skele's once on 1F, and it was 2x Velum.

[MillionDollarMan]

On first floor? Do you kill the Sabotender or what? Cuz I've only seen stats drop off the Skele's once on 1F, and it was 2x Velum.

We use to kill Sabotender but not really worth the time. If you get velum you are killing the skeletons with staffs.. skip all of them and just kill the ones with swords they drop pannus.. You should get 2-3 drops so all melee will have str first floor. The crazy thing about Sabotender he drops like 6-8 cells i think.. As soon as we get 2-3 magic cells on first floor i send a rdm + mnk to kill the opa lamias then kill ghost for rings while the melee go for hp, belt, str.

[chapstick]

We use to kill Sabotender but not really worth the time. If you get velum you are killing the skeletons with staffs.. skip all of them and just kill the ones with swords they drop pannus.. You should get 2-3 drops so all melee will have str first floor. The crazy thing about Sabotender he drops like 6-8 cells i think.. As soon as we get 2-3 magic cells on first floor i send a rdm + mnk to kill the opa lamias then kill ghost for rings while the melee go for hp, belt, str.

Interesting. We usually only kill skele's going between SW and SE (port up SE usually), so there's a mix of the different types i guess. You guys are either really lucky with the stat cells off them (besides hp), or there's a secret I don't know about to make them drop. Hmm..

Just curious, whats your setup that you go with to split up and go for the ghosts? RDM+MNK ghosts, dd+thf+whm+brd clear more skeles?

[MillionDollarMan]

Interesting. We usually only kill skele's going between SW and SE (port up SE usually), so there's a mix of the different types i guess. You guys are either really lucky with the stat cells off them (besides hp), or there's a secret I don't know about to make them drop. Hmm..

Just curious, whats your setup that you go with to split up and go for the ghosts? RDM+MNK ghosts, dd+thf+whm+brd clear more skeles?

MNK MNK THF RDM WHM BRD Sometimes SAM or WAR when they show up. RDM and MNk sneak and invis to the SW lamia mobs for opa and magic then go to ghost while main group kills NW and SE. Try to avoid the skeles that have staff because they drop INT and we are mainly after STR. If you start off with 2 opa this will take 25 mins if you start with one opa it wil take 30 mins. Either way you can kill all NMs + mega boss with no problem. Sometimes we get 7 opa on first floor and just go up on ghost side for rings.



If you can kill the boss and have 20 minutes left you might as well skip str because we only have 6-10 minutes left when boss is dead..

The first floor rampart SEEMS to pop after killing 10 lamia.. He always pops after we kill the 10th one. I know 10 sounds like alot but it takes about 20 mins if your mnk sneaks around killing them.

[fishstix]

In SSR, we often pull the Chariot as well as the 4 Ramparts so we don't need to train the room again.

I wrote in the frog glitch thread how I could lullaby the 6F rampart in ZR, if it works in other zone's chariots, this could be a really good option. Although gravity and bind should work also.

[tymora]

On my last ZR post, yah, my bad for forgetting about 4F stats.

Anyway, on AR and SSR, I tend to follow the solid level 1 rule. In other words, I go for as much cells as possible on the early floors. What would be the difference between getting something like STR on F1 and F6? If you get STR on F1, you can use it for 5-7 floors. If you get STR on F6, you use it for 2. See the benefit here?

On MillionDollarMan's choice to do selective pulling on bones, I think it wastes time. They are soft and I think it is more trouble and time consuming to sneak, avoid and pull. Don't underestimate the use of INT too. While not anywhere as useful as STR, INT can reduce magic damage and raise effectiveness of certain enfeebles.

On the choice of hitting the 1F rampart, this is an "option" that is opened up by extra farming on 1F for cells. To effectively kill that Sabotender without risk, you will need the tank to have magic and SJ (yes the first SJ). It hits hard and mp will run out quick if meat tanking. And after 20 no drop runs, I think the chance of TH4 off the rampart will look attractive. The lack of uncurse can be offset by using Holy Waters, which isn't too bad. As for paralyna, if you need it, you will probably need a better RDM or BRD. Dispel the mob on pull and recast.

It is entirely possible for bones not to drop strength. My group often gets 2 though and we usually have 3-4 people who can use so we do the rampart anyway. We usually spend upwards to 40 min on 1F depending on the actual drops. Even then, we can usually wipe out the later floors extremely quickly (all the NMs from 2F to 6F in 30 min or so) to reach the boss with ~15-20 min to spare. We do skip the rampart if we get at least 2 str and 1 hands.

-----------------------
On 1F SSR, there are 3 possible effective ways of pulling the room of 6 fomors. I will rank them in terms of ease of use. Method 3 can be combined with (1) or (2) but (1) and (2) are mutually exclusive.

1. 1 MNK straight tank all 6 but focus kill 1 by 1. Requires team to be mostly unlocked, 2 healers. Phalanx preferred but not required (RDM Phalanx 2 or SCH). Your MNK doesn't need to be a super MNK either. Clearing all the side rooms usually allows this option.

2. Whole party camp at SW corner of room. (Originally from Suiram) Have someone pull the fomors up north while party pulls out of the train to kill 1 by 1 or 2 by 2 depending on party strength.

3. Have a puller pull the fomors while party is clearing the side rooms. The fomors will spread out and lose hate 1 by 1. Use the distance to split up the group and pull to the main group. Requires the group to have an early range or extra magic to do so. By the time the group is done with side rooms, the main room will have been thinned down and 1 or 2a can be used with greater ease.

On GG3, my group now has no issues with laser cannon one-shotting mages since we almost always have gotten HP for everyone. Note that for all triple gears laser cannon is 360 AOE when 3 parts up, frontal 90 cone when 2 parts up and single target when 1 part up. Restoral will recover 1 part. So best melee positioning is actually 2 frontal melee at 90 degress to each other, with backs up against wall (to counter the push-back move). 3rd melee (usually THF) should stand behind the mob - Shoot your THF if he stands anywhere else.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Perhaps you can also have some advice on cell distribution in various zones. It is a key and essential part of salvage and new groups often falter on this.

[pchan]

On first floor? Do you kill the Sabotender or what? Cuz I've only seen stats drop off the Skele's once on 1F, and it was 2x Velum.

If you clear all first wing (as in all) the third wing drops a lot of stats.

[tymora]

ZR madames are immune to ALL spells of the same element of the day you enter on - So never enter ZR on lightningsday (immune to stun) - Well at least this is important when they fix their charm glitch.

----------
By the way, how about general route options and choices for various zones? Cell priority might change depending on route depending on your setup.

[MillionDollarMan]

We don't "sneak" past bones we just pull the str ones and run to the next room without aggro. We still usually end up with 4 int anyway we just skip some mobs that are not in the way. Sometimes we just kill them all.

You don't need to kill the whole NW wing we just kill the 9 qutub there and it SEEMS like that + the 4 qutub on the way to bones make stat cells + hp drop like crazy.

[chapstick]

If you clear all first wing (as in all) the third wing drops a lot of stats.

Hmm I didn't know this. Thanks!

[Koyangi]

easily do-able in 20 mins
15 seems tight tho

Sometimes it's just very hard to pull and also not get links in Powderkegs room, and I have pulled there alot, to get 15-20 mins with 6-8 people means you were very lucky no imps were in your way or something, way more times than not, theres 1-2 that I have to wait for them to move before doing a pull which would bring 3+ mobs.