WoW BOT creater fined £3.36M

[Krandor]

Fuck Blizzard.

In what way do they earn a "Fuck You" from this? Any MMO company bringing legal action against the terms of service being violated should be viewed as a good thing, especially considering the blind eye so many developers turn to the activities.

[Hitoshura]

Yeah that's Geoff Rowley one of my favorite skateboarders along with Andrew Reynolds.

No I am glad that guy got caught, any person who has made a killing off bots deserves this. I just genuinely hate Blizzard.

[Correction]

Yeah that's Geoff Rowley one of my favorite skateboarders along with Andrew Reynolds.

No I am glad that guy got caught, any person who has made a killing off bots deserves this. I just genuinely hate Blizzard.

Ah then you're just trolling. Grats.

[Hitoshura]

:[

[Ishido]

Fuck successful companies! I hate them!

[Darus Grey]

Why do you guys assume he lost all the money?

Chances are he already dispersed it to himself long ago, they sued a company, not a person.

Once it's been dispersed they can't go after those funds, he'll just file corporate bankrupcy. Form a new corporation...and be back in business tomorrow.

[Correction]

And then Blizzard will sue that company, he'll be found in contempt of a court order and then go straight to jail. Happy End!

[Eaglestrike]

Fuck successful companies with good customer service! I hate them!

Fixed for more accuracy.

My gripes with Blizzard are some minor class imbalances in one of their games that I play. There are so many bigger issues I have with other companies...lol

[chillin]

sorry but glider is the only reason i'm sitting on around 18k gold right now, fuck dailies.

[aurik]

Ludicrous damages for a ludicrous ruling.

[Ishido]

Why do you guys assume he lost all the money?

Chances are he already dispersed it to himself long ago, they sued a company, not a person.

Once it's been dispersed they can't go after those funds, he'll just file corporate bankrupcy. Form a new corporation...and be back in business tomorrow.

At issue will be whether MDY broke the US Digital Millennium Copyright Act and whether Mr Donnelly will have to pay the damages from his own pocket.

I'm not huge on law but... he might have to?

Also I'm curious about what you think the result should have been, Aurik.

[test123]

I wonder if any of FFXI 3rd party tools violate copyrights

[Plow]

Would you say 'fuck SE' if SE brought and won a lawsuit against the people who make speedhacks and teleport bots?

This is where I say, no, he's damn right, fuck Blizzard.

You see, Blizzard had a choice here. Certain companies (google) would've made the right choice, Blizzard absolutely did not.

The choice was between making this a real case for MMO property value, viable, legal protection from people cheating others who are paying real money for a service, and control (or risked loss of control) of services providing power leveling, in game gold etc.-- or stopping 1 guy that's making 1 bot that they want out of their game and not giving a shit about anything else.

They could've made the case about him actually violating the EULA (which this had absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with in any way shape or form), and creating systems purely for the purpose of "breaking" the game. It would've been a long, expensive fight, and one that they can't say for sure if they'd have won or not. It would have become the precedent for future legal fights over the same issue, and been directly used to either get rid if companies like IGE, or to put it into the players' hands what they do with their own characters and in-game money they've spent the time to accumulate/build/develop etc.


But no, they didn't give a shit about the EULA, they don't want to risk the possibility of players gaining full control and rights to their own characters, or anything of the sort.

They wanted this 1 bot that beats their warden out of the hands of the masses, found a loophole in it temporarily copying the running exe file in RAM, and went to sue him for enough to keep him from being able to continue producing it.


They threw away the best opportunity in the history of MMO for determining what rights we really have as players, what rights the game makers have to decide such matters in their own EULA, and how cheating and abusing the systems can be punished (or even determined), mostly because they were afraid of the possibility of peoples' characters actually becoming their own property.

Fuck Blizzard.

[Charla]

But why would the courts (or mainstream society, for that matter) care about any of it? Even if we as MMO players consider this to be a significant issue, the only reason for the rest of the world to take any sort of notice at all is because there's actually some money involved. Once it stops being about RL dollars, the question of our "rights" and so forth simply isn't worth pursuing in anyone's eyes but ours.

[Plow]

But why would the courts (or mainstream society, for that matter) care about any of it? Even if we as MMO players consider this to be a significant issue, the only reason for the rest of the world to take any sort of notice at all is because there's actually some money involved. Once it stops being about RL dollars, the question of our "rights" and so forth simply isn't worth pursuing in anyone's eyes but ours.

So the $150mil monthly in subscription fees we pay for WoW alone is not enough to catch anyone's attention?


edit, I wanna delve a little further

This is kind of what the problem really is. Your typical mmo gamer is not going to have the resources to go after the people that are cheating them. Nobody outside the industry can really even begin to grasp the effect it has on the services we pay for.

If the major companies, especially one like Blizzard, don't really give a shit about the players' rights (I'm sorry but people using glider does not negatively impact my gameplay, the only harm it causes to WoW is the potential for lost income in someone getting to 70 a month sooner, then quitting a month sooner costing them $15), then who's going to do something that really matters about it?

This is not about text-based muds that cost the organizer 20 bucks in electricity and bandwidth a month, this is a multi-billion dollar industry, and nobody seems to care at all about what goes on inside it. Blizzard had a chance to make a big deal about all of this on a major stage, instead they became basically a laughingstock in the industry for trying to look like hardasses by suing 1 guy that makes a meaningless bot on a loophole in copyright law that has nothing whatsoever to do with actual mmo gaming.

[Wintermute]

The Case still isn't over, story in OP says there's still issues to be dealt with in '09. Possible that EULA violations could be one of them.

[Plow]

The Case still isn't over, story in OP says there's still issues to be dealt with in '09. Possible that EULA violations could be one of them.

The case is due to go to court again in January 2009 when the remaining issues in the legal conflict look likely to be settled.

At issue will be whether MDY broke the US Digital Millennium Copyright Act and whether Mr Donnelly will have to pay the damages from his own pocket.

Been watching this case all along, everything except the copyright infringement was thrown out within a couple days once they found they had grounds to sue for copying the running exe in RAM.

[Wintermute]

Been watching this case all along, everything except the copyright infringement was thrown out within a couple days once they found they had grounds to sue for copying the running exe in RAM.

Really? Damn.

They must have a pretty tight case to forgo everything but Copyright Infringment.

I know most companies would use everything they could to try to take down people who viloate their T&C/EULAs.

[Plow]

Really? Damn.

They must have a pretty tight case to forgo everything but Copyright Infringment.

I know most companies would use everything they could to try to take down people who viloate their T&C/EULAs.

What's really sad about this, and what really irks me is that, well, what you just said is kind of the issue.


It basically looked like they were going to get laughed out of court for trying to make a case based on the EULA, or on him affecting other people paying for the service.

Rather than stand up and fight about that, they just found a loophole and sued to get rid of glider.


Basically EULA are a giant meaningless joke at this point.

[Blabj]

I still think its sad to sue someone beyond their means over a video game.

WoW really did ruin his life.