Mythic weapons (New info page 5+)(Pointless bickering page 7+)(Proc Discussion 18+)(new info p23+)

[Jingseng]

I don't know wtf SE was thinking... so mythic is less powerful, and so geared towards the more 'casual' player yes? Not one who keeps doing Dynamis over and over? let's look at what is involved.

To get a Relic weapon, you need:
->Dynamis Access
1. Nation rank 6
2. Level 65 on any job

->Appropriate Relic Weapon (stage 1) - pretty much freelot in any dyna shell
~77 x 100coin + 1 x 10,000 (this includes the final refund)

->Attestation
1. ~33% chance of yours dropping from the NM
2. Need Dyna-Beauci access (all 4 cities)

->Necropsyche
1. ~50% drop rate
2. Need Dyna Xarca access (all 4 cities + beaucidine)

->Fragment
1. 100% drop rate! if you can kill it. And convince your LS/alliance to kill it.
2. Dyna-Xarca (but already accounted for)

Miscellaneous items
Random synthesis items and weapons; all can be bought from AH.

And there you go. Yes it does take quite a lot of time and money, but it's nothing that can't be accomplished by toughing it out with a competent Dyna LS, for 2 runs a week.

What does it take to get a mythic weapon?
-> AU access
1. Give SE money for expansion (but hey, you probably already did)
2. Do a silly quest.

-> Captain rank (this gets you the cutscene to even get started)
1. 50 assault clears (assuming you do not waste any tags, that is a minimum ~1.5 months of daily assault).
2. All rank progression quests
3. AU mission 1-44 (and CS missions after)

->Appropriate weapon
1. Do nyzul (with idiots is ok, since you aren't looking for clears. Yet.)
2. Get appropriate drop from NM
3. ZOMG this step can be optional! See next step.

->Get Runic Key
1. Clear nyzul 1-100. You will need non retarded people, probably in a static. You will also need either the right set of jobs, or people who have enough jobs that you can swap around setups if needed. Assuming you clear 5 floors every tag, this will take you 20 days of daily nyzul (no other assaults permitted).
2. Be allowed to select the final 5 floor run on a job appropriate to the weapon you want (sorry Pups)
3. Win, but that's accounted for in the 1-100 part. But also, have enough time to lot the weapon, etc.

Congratulations... now you get to flag the quest. Go turn in the weapon (unless you want to get the ws first; then go do 250 wspts. Easy)

->Kill Stuff
1. Kill Odin
a. Do einherjar. you need to get 1 key item from each of the three wings. You also need someone who has gotten all 9 of the feathers. This is also going to require at least 17 other people, but probably more.
b. This will take you two weeks and a total cost of 720k gil (divided however your ein group sees fit, for 4 lamps). However, it will take someone else five weeks and a total cost of 1.8mil.
2. Defeat the Beastmen leaders - Gurfurlur, Medusa, and Gulool Ja. Besieged does not count. You'll need some non retarded people (or for a hilarious train wreck, a pick up group from shouting) but really, if you got this far, you ought to know a few.
3. Defeat Salvage bosses. As above. Although there are plenty of JP shouts for pick-up salvage, if you are able to read this post there is a 98% chance they wont take you along. By the way, this takes assault point. I hope you have some saved up from the clear 50 assaults phase (because you sure didn't get any during the nyzul 1-100 phase)

-> QQ
1. turn in 100,000 ampoules of icky stuff. You probably don't have this many from the einherjar step. Go back and do a lot more einherjar.
2. 150,000 tokens from Nyzul. You probably don't have this, UNLESS you rode someone else's disc 1-100 (and had progress recorded) and never ever bought items for a boss fight (so you aren't a melee/dd job). then you are still short by ~129,000 tokens. Go back and do a lot more nyzul (I guess on the days you don't do einherjar).
3. Go clear all 50 assaults. Again. Even the annoyingly stupid ones, like feeding the stupid soldiers, or escorting the dumb dhalmel through the ice caves. Also, be sure you get to the runic of release first AND have enough time to trade your inventory-1 item... rather than someone else who just exits. Btw, this will another 2 months of daily assault wins.
4. Get 30k alexandrite. There's enough talk about this everywhere that you can figure out it's going to take a very very long time. Btw, you're going to need either a lot of gil to buy all the alexandrite, or a lot of assault points to do salvage runs (and beat the boss for coin purses).

Congratulations!.... now you can move on to two other quests, the details of which aren't clear yet (but one of which speculatively involves a fight similar to the fragment fight for relic weapons [considered the hardest part of relic, next to getting all the coins]). Just getting through HALF of mythic is already more time and effort than finishing Relic. And Relic is supposed to be the more powerful of the two.

Edit: I would simply note that relic weapon requirements (stage progression) scale up in difficulty as you progress; thus far, mythic does as well... but details are only known for half the overall "quest". Additionally, it's roughly estimated that relic takes 2 years to complete (admittedly, if you had a verylarge reserve of gil and were constantly buying up currency, you could cut that time down substantially). Based on what people are saying, and how long it takes to get Tokens and Ichor alone, it looks as though to progress this far will take at minimum two years, if not quite a bit longer (and again, for only two out of 4 quest-steps total). One could conceivably cut down on the alexandrite step with a large enough gil reserve and constant buying (assuming that LSes are selling their alexandrite publicly... which they don't 'need' to, unlike dynamis), but by and large the people who are the furthest along now are those who were lucky enough to have a nyzul static and have disc selected for 1-100 and who have been doing einherjar (for some reason).

If SE thought relic was too easy to obtain and that too many had completed relics, they've certainly made that clear with Mythic requirements. While the last quest step might involve a large number of cutscenes and "wait a day" steps, I would not be surprised if the third quest involved special drops from the ToAU HNMs & all seals from ZNM & some sort of crazy final fight a la dynamis fragments/weapons... And then a fee of 144 Imperial Wootz Ingots.

[Fryte]

Spoiler: show

I don't know wtf SE was thinking... so mythic is less powerful, and so geared towards the more 'casual' player yes? Not one who keeps doing Dynamis over and over? let's look at what is involved.

To get a Relic weapon, you need:
->Dynamis Access
1. Nation rank 6
2. Level 65 on any job

->Appropriate Relic Weapon (stage 1) - pretty much freelot in any dyna shell
~77 x 100coin + 1 x 10,000 (this includes the final refund)

->Attestation
1. ~33% chance of yours dropping from the NM
2. Need Dyna-Beauci access (all 4 cities)

->Necropsyche
1. ~50% drop rate
2. Need Dyna Xarca access (all 4 cities + beaucidine)

->Fragment
1. 100% drop rate! if you can kill it. And convince your LS/alliance to kill it.
2. Dyna-Xarca (but already accounted for)

Miscellaneous items
Random synthesis items and weapons; all can be bought from AH.

And there you go. Yes it does take quite a lot of time and money, but it's nothing that can't be accomplished by toughing it out with a competent Dyna LS, for 2 runs a week.

What does it take to get a mythic weapon?
-> AU access
1. Give SE money for expansion (but hey, you probably already did)
2. Do a silly quest.

-> Captain rank (this gets you the cutscene to even get started)
1. 50 assault clears (assuming you do not waste any tags, that is a minimum ~1.5 months of daily assault).
2. All rank progression quests
3. AU mission 1-44 (and CS missions after)

->Appropriate weapon
1. Do nyzul (with idiots is ok, since you aren't looking for clears. Yet.)
2. Get appropriate drop from NM
3. ZOMG this step can be optional! See next step.

->Get Runic Key
1. Clear nyzul 1-100. You will need non retarded people, probably in a static. You will also need either the right set of jobs, or people who have enough jobs that you can swap around setups if needed. Assuming you clear 5 floors every tag, this will take you 20 days of daily nyzul (no other assaults permitted).
2. Be allowed to select the final 5 floor run on a job appropriate to the weapon you want (sorry Pups)
3. Win, but that's accounted for in the 1-100 part. But also, have enough time to lot the weapon, etc.

Congratulations... now you get to flag the quest. Go turn in the weapon (unless you want to get the ws first; then go do 250 wspts. Easy)

->Kill Stuff
1. Kill Odin
a. Do einherjar. you need to get 1 key item from each of the three wings. You also need someone who has gotten all 9 of the feathers. This is also going to require at least 17 other people, but probably more.
b. This will take you two weeks and a total cost of 720k gil (divided however your ein group sees fit, for 4 lamps). However, it will take someone else five weeks and a total cost of 1.8mil.
2. Defeat the Beastmen leaders - Gurfurlur, Medusa, and Gulool Ja. Besieged does not count. You'll need some non retarded people (or for a hilarious train wreck, a pick up group from shouting) but really, if you got this far, you ought to know a few.
3. Defeat Salvage bosses. As above. Although there are plenty of JP shouts for pick-up salvage, if you are able to read this post there is a 98% chance they wont take you along. By the way, this takes assault point. I hope you have some saved up from the clear 50 assaults phase (because you sure didn't get any during the nyzul 1-100 phase)

-> QQ
1. turn in 100,000 ampoules of icky stuff. You probably don't have this many from the einherjar step. Go back and do a lot more einherjar.
2. 150,000 tokens from Nyzul. You probably don't have this, UNLESS you rode someone else's disc 1-100 (and had progress recorded) and never ever bought items for a boss fight (so you aren't a melee/dd job). then you are still short by ~129,000 tokens. Go back and do a lot more nyzul (I guess on the days you don't do einherjar).
3. Go clear all 50 assaults. Again. Even the annoyingly stupid ones, like feeding the stupid soldiers, or escorting the dumb dhalmel through the ice caves. Also, be sure you get to the runic of release first AND have enough time to trade your inventory-1 item... rather than someone else who just exits. Btw, this will another 2 months of daily assault wins.
4. Get 30k alexandrite. There's enough talk about this everywhere that you can figure out it's going to take a very very long time. Btw, you're going to need either a lot of gil to buy all the alexandrite, or a lot of assault points to do salvage runs (and beat the boss for coin purses).

Congratulations!.... now you can move on to two other quests, the details of which aren't clear yet (but one of which speculatively involves a fight similar to the fragment fight for relic weapons [considered the hardest part of relic, next to getting all the coins]). Just getting through HALF of mythic is already more time and effort than finishing Relic. And Relic is supposed to be the more powerful of the two.

It doesn't seem like a lot to do on paper, but when you sit down and think about everything you need to do, wowzers.

[Jhun]

Offtopic maybe but can you store Alexandrites without even upgrading or starting the quest for your weapon?

[Loziel]

Yes but you will need a couple of mule accounts

[Silenka]

This is so depressing.
I don't think -4 avatar perp is worth all that >.>

[Amok]

Although there are plenty of JP shouts for pick-up salvage, if you are able to read this post there is a 98% chance they wont take you along.

lol

[Jingseng]

Spoiler: show

It doesn't seem like a lot to do on paper, but when you sit down and think about everything you need to do, wowzers.

I agree; when the released the info, I started to think about which I wanted to pursue, if indeed either. If you think about it only in terms of transactional requirements (tasks) then mythic might seem easier. Dynamis has that carryover daunting effect.

But if think about it in depth, mythic requires so much more than relic, it's a bit ridiculous.

For relic, join a half way decent dyna shell and tough it out for a while. Or join one for a few runs to get some RelicAF, coins, and experience... and then go make your own shell with some friends. Invite some people to exploit, and get coins.

By and large, that's it. You do need a fairly large number of people, but if the argument is, "everyone is working towards relic" then all those people are in it for the long haul as well... so once you have them, you have them.

For mythic, quite a few people put forth the view that it allows more people to proceed on the upgrade at the same time. I tend to disagree. To begin with, generally a dynashell has multiple people upgrading at once (rather than 100% focused on one relic at a time). For mythic, the idea is that multiple players can get, for example, NM titles at the same time, or Einher and Nyzul points.

That's true... Those things aren't mutually exclusive of other players, unlike currency... OR alexandrites. Whoops.

Also, Nyzul takes 6 people. Salvage takes 6-18. Einherjar takes 20-36. Assaults take 3-6. Beast HNMs take *roll 5d6 and remove the highest and lowest rolls*, as well as very minor besieged issues.

So... different amounts of people at every single stage. That isn't particularly conducive to progressing. Keep in mind those stages are repeated. People are going to get left behind very very easily. Like, CoP easily. =P ("Hey, good job guys! Let's static the rest of the missions!" "Ok!" *next day* "hey, uh, you didn't send me a msg for the next mission" "Oh, uh yeah we were all on early so we just went ahead and cleared it. Good luck.")

Nyzul can be done PUG, but a static is generally better. Same with assaults. I've never seen a single NA PUG shout for salvage on my server (doesn't mean there aren't any, but likely pretty rare if there are any), so that generally takes a static or else an LS. Einherjar takes an LS (either the same or different from Salvage). Beast HNMs... maybe you could do as PUG, but probably you need an LS (or you could pay an LS).

Gee, I hope you have ONE LS that likes to do all these activities (or is really focused on getting mythic weapons for multiple members).

Nyzul - Assault tags, "daily" event.
Assault - Assault tags, "daily" event.
Salvage - Assault points, "daily" event (provided you have enough points... or Assault tags for points)
(btw, since I don't bother to do salvage, I forgot to add the requirements previously... but they are accounted for in all other steps, essentially)

Einherjar - 180k gil (total), "3 day" event

Keep in mind that nyzul and assault are mutually exclusive (each tag you spend on one is a tag that cannot be spent on the other); you can of course alternate doing Nyzul and Assault (in fact, you will need to, due to salvage requirements), but the limiting resource is Assault Tags.

That's a lot of events per week. I hope you weren't also planning on doing Dynamis, or Limbus, or znm (and farming zeni), or farming for gil, or getting merits or skilling a craft. Don't forget to use up those campaign ops. Some people have significantly less time to play than others... that's just how it is. And some people are only able to play during times when language and race are unfortunately a barrier (welcome to reality, population: Everyone EXCEPT SE) to doing events, etc. You'll certainly be able to do a few other things in addition to Salvage x7, Assault x7, and Einherjar x2 per week. But not much.

In Addition to Sundi-knows-Wut for the final 2 quest steps.

Compare that to: Dynamis x2 per week.

Sorry to be a killjoy. The people who have the most progress right now and give us the best hope for seeing a mythic are the people who have been regularly doing Nyzul and Einherjar already for a year or so. And are active in (or lead) a competent LS (hnm or otherwise) which do the necessary activities.

Compare that to: join a dyna shell. Do some farming (or piss everyone off with casino shouts in whitegate).

Upshot of all this is:
1. Mythic requirements are a bit absurd
2. For people entering on the ground floor (no LSes), Relic is easier to get

[Suiram]

The problem with the idea of Naja giving you back a substantial amount of alexandrites is that they only stack to 99. I know there are a few quests with more than one item as a reward, but even if they were to give you back 3k alexandrites, that's 31 inventory spots. I don't see that happening, much as I'd like to believe it would.

[Jingseng]

The problem with the idea of Naja giving you back a substantial amount of alexandrites is that they only stack to 99. I know there are a few quests with more than one item as a reward, but even if they were to give you back 3k alexandrites, that's 31 inventory spots. I don't see that happening, much as I'd like to believe it would.

yeah considering ancient currency turns into 100 bills and 10,000 bills, i'm surprised they haven't considered something similar. They could even take the lazy and nonsensical route. Like GREEN alexandrite and POLKA DOTTED alexandrite =)

But more likely clustered (i suppose that makes more sense? Maybe if we glue all the alexandrite together... you know... that makes a cluster...)

[Suiram]

Maybe she gives you back several "shiny" linen pouches, and "Don't spend it all in one place!" is her way of saying "Don't use these all at once as they each have 5000 alexandrites in them." lol

[TT]

Do pouches stack? Stack of 99 or even 50 Linen pouches would be a nice refund but I highly doubt that.
edit: beaten D:

[Almalexia]

Pouches don't stack. Not cotton pouches, anyway. I use linens too eagerly to notice the "1".

[Kukuk]

Does anyone know if you can turn in assault logs as you complete an area, or do you have to wait till you finish all 5 areas/50 assaults?

[Kukuk]

NVMD you can .

[MillionDollarMan]

Maybe it's just me but mythics look easier to obtain.

[Arthars]

i bet your lord stan can make 3 more relic before he buy enough alex now

[MaachaQ]

That's a lot of events per week. I hope you weren't also planning on doing Dynamis, or Limbus, or znm (and farming zeni), or farming for gil, or getting merits or skilling a craft. Don't forget to use up those campaign ops. Some people have significantly less time to play than others... that's just how it is. And some people are only able to play during times when language and race are unfortunately a barrier (welcome to reality, population: Everyone EXCEPT SE) to doing events, etc. You'll certainly be able to do a few other things in addition to Salvage x7, Assault x7, and Einherjar x2 per week. But not much.

I'm doing all of these right now, and I'm beginning to get burnt out. Only thing I haven't been able to do recently is the Zeni, since nobody in LS has been interested in it lately. I have to do Sky, Sea, Dynamis, Limbus, Assault, Nyzul, Salvage, Einherjar, and farming for gil for my husband's Mandau (we buy all our shell's hourglasses, plus some bazaar coins when we have enough gil). I really don't know how I would squeeze anything else in without seriously hurting my RL... SE really has unrealistic expectations when they give us all these things. We really can't just do 1 thing until we finish then move on to the next, unless we want to alienate all our friends by jumping to a new shell once we get the junk we want and quitting.

Upshot of all this is:
1. Mythic requirements are a bit absurd
2. For people entering on the ground floor (no LSes), Relic is easier to get

you forgot about Captain rank before even getting the Runic Key ^^;

[LD]

The way things are with the WS quest, odds are most people will get a runic key before they get captain rank.

[rithridan]

I'm doing all of these right now, and I'm beginning to get burnt out. Only thing I haven't been able to do recently is the Zeni, since nobody in LS has been interested in it lately. I have to do Sky, Sea, Dynamis, Limbus, Assault, Nyzul, Salvage, Einherjar, and farming for gil for my husband's Mandau (we buy all our shell's hourglasses, plus some bazaar coins when we have enough gil). I really don't know how I would squeeze anything else in without seriously hurting my RL... SE really has unrealistic expectations when they give us all these things. We really can't just do 1 thing until we finish then move on to the next, unless we want to alienate all our friends by jumping to a new shell once we get the junk we want and quitting.

And to top it all off unless you are seriously lucky you are stuck doing the same damn event for months or even years at a time before you finished it for yourself and all your friends and can finally give it a rest. Not to mention the so-called 'friends' who will leave you hanging halfway through making progression that much slower because you are walking on one leg trying to do events with a less then optimal, sometimes even crappy, amount (or type) of people. Amazing how some people can have near flawless attendance when they are up for an item only to (almost) dissapear when they get said item.

[Ramses]

Maybe it's just me but mythics look easier to obtain.

You're right. It is just you.