California Proposition 8 Case Re-Opening Online Petition

[Julian]

Because separate but equal does not work.

[zoobernut]

And it's been said already that if anti gay marriage people did not have such tunnel vision they would realize "separate but equal" is not really equal.

Also isn't it silly that when you boil it down it is just a semantics argument. People are not against the idea of "gay marriage" they are against using the word marriage.

I am all for changing it but then if they do that take away the word marriage from anywhere having to do with the government and anything legal. Marriage would not be recognized by the law anymore at all for anyone.

[Tristam]

It’s been said already but I really think that if gays didn’t have such tunnel vision and called their union something other than marriage it would have been passed already.

The thing is there are civil unions and marriages, that is what the government calls them, they are real contracts. And civil unions are not the same as marriages which has been pointed out numerous times.

Prop 8 isn't about homosexuals trying to re-define marriage, it's about religions trying to define marriage according to their belief system, that's it.

[0ni0n]

It's no problem for the homosexuals, it's a problem for the religious when they cry that their word is being used by someone else.

Seriously. The religious have no problems with gays receiving the same governmental benefits as heterosexual married couples do, but they won't allow a civic union to be called "marriage". What gives?

[Charismatic]

SANCTITY OF MARRIAGE, BITCHES.
First they want our buttholes, now they want to ruin a sacred cermony... when will it end?

[Seraph]

Ok so you would say that marriage only belongs to religiously affiliated people and everyone else including heterosexual couples would be "unioned"?

Yes, that is correct. We are talking about political equality and govermnent definitions, not religious belief. Like I said, the poor early definition of 'marriage' and 'civil union' causes all the confusion and problems to this day. When a couple says they are married, do you know if they are talking about a religious commitment, or a civil one? You don't, and thats the problem.

Edit: Let me clarify. EVERYONE gets the cake (civil union) and some people also choose to get frosting (marriage). Frosting doesnt matter. All that matters is that you agreed to get cake. By desiring frosting, you need cake first.

[Penthesilea]

Ok so you would say that marriage only belongs to religiously affiliated people and everyone else including heterosexual couples would be "unioned"?

Me? No I think everyone should apply for a Civil Union License, regardless of if you're having a ceremony or not, and definitely regardless of the fact that you're homo, hetero, or bisexual. There would no longer be Marriage Licenses, your ceremony is yours to take care of at your respective place of worship (if you decide that's your prerogative).

[Seraph]

Because separate but equal does not work.

There is no seperate but equal here. Everyone would get the same 'civil union' status. Being 'married' in a church would hold the same status, for example, as being baptized.

You are confusing politics and religion again. Noone has the right to be involoved with religious groups. As you put it, religious are already 'seperate but equal' under goverment definition. This would not change that.

[zoobernut]

And my point is that it is non of your business what they mean. What do you care if I am non-religious and I am married?

Why is it a problem to you if I call myself married? The word does not belong to you or anyone in particular. Marriage in the eyes of the government is completely independent of marriage in the eyes of you or any church. If you want to think in your head that you don't recognize the "marriages" that are legal but not ordained by a church then that is your business.

[0ni0n]

SANCTITY OF MARRIAGE, BITCHES.
First they want our buttholes, now they want to ruin a sacred cermony... when will it end?

Are you coming out of the closet or what? Don't flatter yourself, no gay guy wants your butthole. Again, it couldn't be stressed enough that being gay is genetic, not an acquired condition or life style.

[Charismatic]

Being gay isn't genetic fool... the gene would be weeded out if it was considering that gays generally aren't having babies.

[Penthesilea]

Being gay isn't genetic fool... the gene would be weeded out if it was considering that gays generally aren't having babies.

lol... serious?

[Aella]

SANCTITY OF MARRIAGE, BITCHES.
First they want our buttholes, now they want to ruin a sacred cermony... when will it end?

hi thar mr.troll, how goes it?

It’s been said already but I really think that if gays didn’t have such tunnel vision and called their union something other than marriage it would have been passed already.

This really made me lol. Seriously, props to you sir.
Now, why don't you get rid of your tunnel vision, and realize that marriage has more than one meaning now. And no, it is not a religious one.

[Kerberoz]

I don't see how this can be considered constitutional in any way...

Marriage is not just a religious concept. It gives both partners legal benefits. You cannot deny those benefits to a couple just because of their sexual preference... everyone is entitled to equal treatment under the law.

As for calling it something else... are Christians really that insecure/delusional? Call it "civil union" on the document and they'll still call it "marriage" everywhere else. Gonna pass a law making it illegal to refer to a "civil union" as a "marriage"?

It's the old Christian cherry-picking again. Follow the parts of the bible you like, and ignore the parts about prostituting your daughters, because those are just allegory.

[Aella]

lol... serious?

He's trolling... it's painfully obvious.

[Saithorx]

What is the reason that married people get benefits? Why don't single people get them? how is this fair? I want the same benefits for being single or that is dividing people from people... this is very unconstitutional.

Sorry, been trying to google what exactly people are getting out of being recognized as married that others don't.

[MarkM.]

Being gay isn't genetic fool... the gene would be weeded out if it was considering that gays generally aren't having babies.

Man this is win, i'll be using this now, Charis wins.

[Tyche]

Me? No I think everyone should apply for a Civil Union License, regardless of if you're having a ceremony or not, and definitely regardless of the fact that you're homo, hetero, or bisexual. There would no longer be Marriage Licenses, your ceremony is yours to take care of at your respective place of worship (if you decide that's your prerogative).

The shitstorm that would ensue from eliminating a marriage license (even if a CU license is the exact same thing) would be infinately larger what's going on now.

[Aella]

What is the reason that married people get benefits? Why don't single people get them? how is this fair? I want the same benefits for being single or that is dividing people from people... this is very unconstitutional.

Sorry, been trying to google what exactly people are getting out of being recognized as married that others don't.

I did an entire paper on the differences last year in college. Got pretty high marks too.
I would go on a tangent, but there's really no need.

[Seraph]

And my point is that it is non of your business what they mean. What do you care if I am non-religious and I am married?

Why is it a problem to you if I call myself married? The word does not belong to you or anyone in particular. Marriage in the eyes of the government is completely independent of marriage in the eyes of you or any church. If you want to think in your head that you don't recognize the "marriages" that are legal but not ordained by a church then that is your business.

My point is you are getting upset about the word. I'd say that at this point, you definately have a civil marriage (would be renamed 'civil union') and possible a religious marriage (renamed 'marriage'). I don't know you, so I can;t be sure.

My entire point is that the word "marriage" is used to describe two different things (religious and civil marriages), and this confuses people, which you have perfectly shown.

I totally recognize civil marriages as being legetimate. My issue, is that people seem to think that being married in a religious sense is the same as being married in a political sense, and this is very not correct.