SAM vs DRK (Max Dmg Output)

[Jotaru]

How many WS's can sam pull off in 30 sec's? 2 with sekka at start with 300 tp (2k dmg), 3 with SP (3k dmg), 1 (1k dmg) with barrage (1k dmg), icarus wing (1k dmg), and 1 more if you squeeze a meditate in there (1k dmg). If none of these miss and all ws's avg 1k, you have total of 9k damage? how does this rival a kclub drk?

Not to nitpick, as it probably doesn't make much difference, but, you'd get a bit more out of it... between the WS hits themselves and Meditate giving ~160 to properly geared SAM's (up to 200 if the ticks are properly timed), you're looking at potentially 3-4 WS's out of Med instead of one.

[kandiekane]

Mandau THF destroys @ colibri camp with very fast TP gain and high WS numbers so long as nobody moves the mob / the THF is able to WS.

My biggest problem in merit pts (especially at colibri camp) comes from me pulling so much hate from TPing the monster with my TP setup + march/min/haste . Now because the monster is facing me, I can't SA WS, and most melees in merit parties have WAA DON'T TA ON MEE WAAAAAAA syndrome so I can't do it on anyone but the bard who is standing still. With colibri it's a bigger problem as I get constantly feather tickled yatta yatta.

My fav setup on mandau thf is with a SAM, they build TP as fast as I do, even more, and can always open gekko, making the mob face them (if they're a good sam) and thus allowing me to mercy stroke / 2 shot the mob with Gekko>Mercy>Mirror darkness.

You're right, biggest problem is getting a thf friendly pt. I usually TA+WS melee's and collaborator right away and take hate back and save SA for opening WS or right after someone opens with a WS. Also SA+Hide every 5 min, usually enough to be able to use SA more often than not.

<3 pt'ing with competent sams that open with gekko!!!

[Lordwafik]

What I hate recently is samurais who merit overwhelm and complain to me, TO ME , about monsters changing directions. Gosh welcome to SA and TA bitches.

[kandiekane]

lmao, especially if you merit ambush. Sam is trying to get in front of the mob and thf is trying to stay behind it -_-

[Draken82]

Really? I've never seen this happen before, ever.

How many WS's can sam pull off in 30 sec's? 2 with sekka at start with 300 tp (2k dmg), 3 with SP (3k dmg), 1 (1k dmg) with barrage (1k dmg), icarus wing (1k dmg), and 1 more if you squeeze a meditate in there (1k dmg). If none of these miss and all ws's avg 1k, you have total of 9k damage? how does this rival a kclub drk?

You must know some gimp Sam/Rngs. >.>

Minimum Damage-26 Second DL (Sometimes I am stuck with 100 tp because we have so many drks. I will only factor 1 WS in for meditate.)
Never really have time if its under 26 seconds to use barrage.

Sidewinder x2 (Sekkan)- 2.2-2.4k x2
Meikyo Shisui (Sidewinder)-2.2-2.4 x3
Meditate- Sidewinder- 2.2-2.4 x1
I.Wing- Sidewinder- 2.2-2.4 x1
Total Damage- 15.4k Damage (2.2 x7) I used the lower number for the math.

Max Damage- 35-37 second DL (This is the time frame I need to get my full zerg off) Not factoring in the triple proc on barrage.

Sekkan- Sidewinder 2.2k x 2
Meikyo Shisui- Sidewinder 2.2k x3
Meditate during 2hr- Sidewinder 2.2k x2
I.Wing-SideWinder 2.2k x1
Barrage 1.2-1.4k
Sidewinder from Barrage- 2.2k x1

Total Damage- 21k ( I use the lowest number for sidewinder to be more accurate. Sidewinder ranges from 2.1-2.4k ish on Sam)

Summary: Min Damage- 15.4 Damage
Max Damage- 21k Damage (with no triple proc on barrage)


P.S. Barrage is four hits as sub job. With my setup I receive 20+tp from a ranged attack and would have 20 tp from the I.Wing WS. Making an additional WS optional.

[MillionDollarMan]

Apoc>ALL

[Draken82]

Mandau thf has highest dps weapon in the game (13.3 dps, more on birds due to piercing). With 15% haste and 80% acc, or closer to 85% with feint on every 2 min, and 95% behind the mob, they avg 2k WS's with xknife hitting at the speed of a kclub with marchx2 + haste. I don't think sam/war with a C+ ranged weapon rating with a soboro (5.33 dps) is going to come close at Bird Camp avg'ing only 1.2-1.4k ws's.

I average about 94-96% WS acc with Namas arrow. I understand how fast Mandau is but I would still get tp faster than a Mandau thf. I would really like to a parse with a thf averaging 2k for WSs. I would be very interested in partying with a Mandau to see how they stand against my setup. The 1.2k-1.4k Namas average is factoring in Wivres (<3 Defense down). Namas peaks out around 2.2k on birds but normally hits for 1.5-1.8k. The defense down normally kills my WS average but we have no choice but to chain them!

Hasso allows my Sam to sit at 31% haste (21% gear + 10% Hasso) I use sword strap to lower my delay to 437. My Sam is swinging at a 437 delay because of sword strap. A Sam with a 437 delay multi hit weapon with dual marches, haste, and hasso with a 6-hit at his/her disposal is a force in the reckoning.

[Veyron]

If there was a good Mandau on Garuda, I'd be happy to merit with Draken & them! Wafik, come on over! Can anyone give me a decent sized parse of a merit pt with a Mandau in it? Wafik?

[Ayn]

What I hate recently is samurais who merit overwhelm and complain to me, TO ME , about monsters changing directions. Gosh welcome to SA and TA bitches.

Seriously. It's why I'm glad I have WAR or SAM to merit on.

[Fcube]

I average about 94-96% WS acc with Namas arrow. I understand how fast Mandau is but I would still get tp faster than a Mandau thf. I would really like to a parse with a thf averaging 2k for WSs. I would be very interested in partying with a Mandau to see how they stand against my setup. The 1.2k-1.4k Namas average is factoring in Wivres (<3 Defense down). Namas peaks out around 2.2k on birds but normally hits for 1.5-1.8k. The defense down normally kills my WS average but we have no choice but to chain them!

Hasso allows my Sam to sit at 31% haste (21% gear + 10% Hasso) I use sword strap to lower my delay to 437. My Sam is swinging at a 437 delay because of sword strap. A Sam with a 437 delay multi hit weapon with dual marches, haste, and hasso with a 6-hit at his/her disposal is a force in the reckoning.

When the PT is good, I only use Hasso too because things die really fast and with the help of rabbit pie, the risk of getting 1 shotted is low. I think you need to parse with a good Sam/drg Amano holder because I think that is hard to beat with all the right songs.

[Arthars]

play skill >>> all

you can have the best gear but being a retard gets you nowhere

apoc and amano is equal in all situations. And this comes to playskill in merit(YES THERES SKILL INVOLVE IN MERIT IM NOT KIDDING) and HNMs.

When you wanna compare both jobs, you have to totally ignore the job's restriction. eg. you shouldnt even compare max dmg output if your saying drk not able to use SE in X and Y situation

when you wanna compare, you compare both job's "all-out" capabilities. Its pointless to compare a 100% fulltime w/o problem medidate VS a drk which have SE restricted because of POSSIBLE MP sink. Apoc drk have no problem spamming SE fyi. and if you cant do that, dont wield an apoc........... my SE cycle goes: Spike > SE > meditate > cut things up > Catastrophe to get back 90ish% HP(IF I DONT MISS) > cut a few more > SE wears > Catastrophe. Remember to toss in third eye in between incase of "oshit" scenarios

Dont gimme bullshit like SAM is not MP sink with medidate and spamming WSs. Both DRK/SAM and SAM/WAR have third eye and apoc can get HP back decently. I dont expect any apoc drk to have complains about SE in any post because we obviously know our capabilities in spamming SE whenever its up. Most SE complainers are mainly those w/o apoc im sure.

so back to comparison, both relics sam and drk equally good in any situation when they have a freedom of JAs. However if your doing a Hagun SAM VS Deathscythe/algol DRK coomparison........i think SAM is a winner marginally (2.8m Hagun >>>>>>>>>>> 10k deathscythe obviously)

lol @ ridill war tho..that shit is so old now, i outparse every top end geared ridill war i merit with by an average of 50k damage over 2.5 hrs(i still have 6 parse record in PC because its nice to see). Learn your GAxe/sam playskill and king's justice naooooooooo
time to move on, ridill is for farming THFs

[Draken82]

When the PT is good, I only use Hasso too because things die really fast and with the help of rabbit pie, the risk of getting 1 shotted is low. I think you need to parse with a good Sam/drg Amano holder because I think that is hard to beat with all the right songs.

Jackyl is considered one the best geared/skilled Sams on Garuda (imo). You are correct if the sam/drg can use hasso 24/7 they will be one of the best DDs but become a mp sink were as the drks have DS and cata to protect them. I agree with Arthar's comment about how a player's skill level influences how the relic performs. Changing to mobs faster than someone and WSing at 1% with a single WS also screw up parses.

Another reason why my setup is nice because the mages rarely have to cure me and I get to eat red curry at birds! Oh how I love Namas!

[Fcube]

Yeah I am talking about all out situations, no regards of mp issues or mp sink. However, I am still in favour of sam. I have tested both and drk do come out short for me. However, my test are not conclusive. I will need to parse probably a lot more and make comparison and more tweaks.

[Arthars]

sorry if my comments are mainly on relic sam vs relic drk.

for non relics, im pretty sure hagun > drk marginally or decently

hagun is a semi-relic!

[Draken82]

I will try to merit with LS mates this weekend to give you some new results. Dankster (Apoc), Jackyl (Amano), and Me ( Yoich) will be the party setup but different setups will yield different results, so I might stick with the traditional setup (x2 brds).

[Fcube]

sorry if my comments are mainly on relic sam vs relic drk.

for non relics, im pretty sure hagun > drk marginally or decently

hagun is a semi-relic!

Oh, I am all along talking about relic sam vs relic drk too ;x

[Fcube]

I will try to merit with LS mates this weekend to give you some new results. Dankster (Apoc), Jackyl (Amano), and Me ( Yoich) will be the party setup but different setups will yield different results, so I might stick with the traditional setup (x2 brds).

Does the sam use full usu or maximium haste setup with /drg? I think in situations where there is march X2, 26% max equipment haste makes a difference.

[Arthars]

so I might stick with the traditional setup (x2 brds).

we dont get that many bard on ifrit ; ; but i dont mind COR and BRD tho XD

edit: nvm...COR with DRK in PT kinda bias the DRK's damage more, resulting in unfair results

[Aux]

I will try to merit with LS mates this weekend to give you some new results. Dankster (Apoc), Jackyl (Amano), and Me ( Yoich) will be the party setup but different setups will yield different results, so I might stick with the traditional setup (x2 brds).

Go for the Shrine of Ru'Avitau merits!
No Feather Tickle, No Food stolen, No mob stolen, No THF mob, just good old Decorative Weapons with nothing cept whirl spam and smite of rage. Course XP/hour is gonna suck, its probably one of the more evened out parsing arenas that I can think of.

I agree with Arthars on non-relic situations, a well-geared Hagun SAM kind of outshines a well-geared DRK.

[Ruiner]

I'm curious, Draken, what gear setup do you typically use for Namas Arrow?