Fan Fest 2008 Live Coverage

[Reapz]

personally i did not enjoy MMM that much. it seems too much like assault and not so much customized dungeons its intended to be like. Who knows maybe im wrong and being shallow, only the update will know :D

I loved assaults so that is fine by me!

[Malacite]

Effort - Reward ratios in this game... sometimes are just so obviously disjointed.

And this is why so many people play WoW over FFXI.


Hopefully someday soon SE will get through their fucking heads that they all too often cross the line. I've been playing since release and still enjoy the game for the most part but fuck, more often than not it feels like a second job rather than a game. Blizzard knows how to make games fun and accessible to people, where as ever since FF7 SE lost it.

[urat]

Maybe game breaking weapons are the only thing game breaking HNMs are weak too >_>;

[Thistle]

Personally, I wouldn't mind "impossible" HNMs in the game... if they were free-roaming. The problem with AV and PW is that you need to put a shitload of effort into just popping them, in order to get raped and waste a weekend.

I think it's reasonable to have things that are impossible to kill, though agreed that anything popped should not be impossible. Hard as hell? Fine. Popped and impossible? Not so fair.

[Kenji]

Allakazam is that-a-way.

While it's debatable who the center of ffxi is, what's certain is that your posting shit like this in the 'advanced' forum of BG.

Second: the way games work is challenge -> reward. If no-one can get to the reward phase, that segment of the game has failed. At the moment, Absolute virtue is 'everyone dies' at the end of a series of fights. Some reward.

It's a joke to think people will spend what are now useful mythic components just to eat dirt at P.W's feet. The whole appeal of ZNMS was getting some reasonable and fun fights with some decent gear. The appeal of super bosses is supposed to be that they test the skill of the players facing them, in theory for amazing rewards. The appeal of the 'best' gear is that as you work to expand and improve your LS, you can look down the road to bigger and better things.

Well, guess what? The end of the road in FFXI isn't even a circle of the same mobs for the same gear. It's a brick wall. Noone has overcome AV without using poor programing or gear that's ten times the time investment of the previous boss's minimum. (Ie, good strategy on JoL will let you win vs kraken clubs.) We've had YEARS now to try, it's not a matter of skill. Noone's going to get that much better at FFXI.

You know, one of the major complaints of the end-game community, was that AV didn't pop all the time, so it was very hard to test things. SE changed that awhile ago. So where are you l33t end-gamers now? Is it still easier to whine, instead of test things out now?

Challenge -> reward, so perhaps you better get crackin' on that challenge, eh?

Oh, nvm. You just wanted to complain.

[GaelWanderling]

personally i did not enjoy MMM that much. it seems too much like assault and not so much customized dungeons its intended to be like. Who knows maybe im wrong and being shallow, only the update will know :D

Least assaults had some level of OK rewards... this apparently is all good looking gear graphics wise with no use.. meh more town gear, i guess the ability so skill up they mentioned might make it worthwhile.

[Weeks]

I don't think you can call PW unkillable anymore. At least not in the way that AV is unkillable. There was a very good attempt that a bunch of people got to witness and I think it can be beaten at this point. It may be hard as fuck but it seems doable compared to AV.

Admirable as the effort was, they didn't even reach the point where he seemingly becomes unkillable. Just because you deal with 90 minutes of annoyance before PW gets to his ass-raping form doesn't mean significant progress is being made towards killing him.

[urat]

Almost every major HNM so far up to AV has had some major weakness/trick/secret.

The only difference between AV/PW and others is that it takes like, 20x as long to fight them compared to others.

Ixion, as AV was compared to, pops all voer the past, like, daily. The item required to fight him is dropped commonly off of pixies in the past.

AV's pop set requires hunting down and killing multiple HNMs, popping the HNM.

Ditto for PW. So for every time we as a community kill, say, ixion, learn about him, learn patterns, so on, it takes ten of thsoe to take on AV once.

I believe, like every other mega boss in every other FF, their is some trick/secret to take it down.

I'm a little confused as to why th mega boss isn't a weapon though, would be ncie to fight a weapon MK 11, but we got ultima/omega at least.

As you all have most likely noticed by now, se LOVES, ADORES patterns. From Cid, to the Weapons, to magic names, to everlittle minigame, to the names of summons, to the elemental days, it's everywhere you look.

There's a secret, somewhere, somehow, but it's really well hidden, and becasue we as a community rearely get to fight Av, and msot of the fights last 30 secs, we don't get much to test them.

That and the fact we constantly keep trying the same 5 theories and dont attempt new thigns... well.

I'm predicting another year. 1 year and we'll finally catch on.

[ronin sparthos]

You know, one of the major complaints of the end-game community, was that AV didn't pop all the time, so it was very hard to test things. SE changed that awhile ago. So where are you l33t end-gamers now? Is it still easier to whine, instead of test things out now?

Challenge -> reward, so perhaps you better get crackin' on that challenge, eh?

Oh, nvm. You just wanted to complain.

Whats the point? The "fuck yeah!" feeling of solving SEs rubiks cube HNM is gone because the drops are no longer special (courtesy of krakenrushing) and most players (endgamers and casuals) are convinced that the HNM cannot be defeated by any normal means.

The effort just does not match the rewards anymore. Perhaps at one time a group might have been motivated by the E-Fame across the FFXI world at being the AV slayers but nowadays the HNM is just not worth it for anyone. NA, EU and JP alike.

Perhaps if SE throws down the gauntlet in some kind of event with cash prizes or a trip to SE headquarters with exclusive prizes that AV might die but in its current state the NM is nothing but a massive failure at challenging the playerbase.

Now Vrtra in her prime? That was an actual challenge way back when.

[Virtuous Saint]

Whats the point? The "fuck yeah!" feeling of solving SEs rubiks cube HNM is gone because the drops are no longer special (courtesy of krakenrushing) and most players (endgamers and casuals) are convinced that the HNM cannot be defeated by any normal means.

The effort just does not match the rewards anymore. Perhaps at one time a group might have been motivated by the E-Fame across the FFXI world at being the AV slayers but nowadays the HNM is just not worth it for anyone. NA, EU and JP alike.

Perhaps if SE throws down the gauntlet in some kind of event with cash prizes or a trip to SE headquarters with exclusive prizes that AV might die but in its current state the NM is nothing but a massive failure at challenging the playerbase.

Now Vrtra in her prime? That was an actual challenge way back when.

How is it not worth it anymore hahahahaha, you could literally get a relic per AV kill. hmm ya I guess you are right, oh and ya i'm sure no one would praise the people who killed AV through locking, and taking down as expected by the dev team.. no.

[urat]

How is it not worth it anymore hahahahaha, you could literally get a relic per AV kill.

Wtf is he talking about? You'd actually sell an AV weapon? >_>

ya I guess you are right, oh and ya i'm sure no one would bless the people who killed AV through locking

Yeah, but the 99.9% chance of failure just isn't worth it.

[Corrderio]

After reading all 13 pages all I got to say is.... NA Fanfest Q&A and Inreviews made me want to claw my eyes out at the stupidity....

Also WTF @ SE's logic/answers. (That WHM one was just over the line for stupidity for me)

[Weeks]

You know, one of the major complaints of the end-game community, was that AV didn't pop all the time, so it was very hard to test things. SE changed that awhile ago. So where are you l33t end-gamers now? Is it still easier to whine, instead of test things out now?

Revisionist history bullshit. The major complaint of the endgame community was that AV could wipe an entire alliance at will, and even if you got lucky enough to make progress he'd just undo it either via Benediction or an insta-wipe. Very few people claimed to be willing to invest absurd amounts of time choking sea with their dead to study AV, and that number dropped to zero after they once again fucked up enough to allow the rewards to leak into the community.

[Charismatic]

Wtf is he talking about? You'd actually sell an AV weapon? >_>

Yes.

[urat]

Yes.

To buy a relic weapon?

...

>_>; You don't seem to udnerstand what it would mean to walk aroudn wearing a piece of AV gear... do you?

there's about 100 people per server with relic weapons. How many with AV weapons?

That's borderline priceless, but it seems to be about 250 million...

[Guppy]

Is anyone else's blog in Latin?

The Latin text is a placeholder -- most likely you have scripts blocked.

[Charismatic]

I'm not even going to bother..

[Vail]

To buy a relic weapon?

...

>_>; You don't seem to udnerstand what it would mean to walk aroudn wearing a piece of AV gear... do you?

there's about 100 people per server with relic weapons. How many with AV weapons?

That's borderline priceless, but it seems to be about 250 million...

and there is only 17 remaining Laural Crowns on all servers of an original 20, no one really gives a shit about those now a days. I use it to warp from partys alot, and maybe: maybe once out of 20 parties someone will notice/say something about it.

edit: most of the time when you even see or read about an AV drop appearing anywhere, most people talk about how many times that item has been sold or if it was stolen.

[Hosom]

As far as stats go, AV items are hardly worth the trouble.

[Seraphus]

Personally, I wouldn't mind "impossible" HNMs in the game... if they were free-roaming. The problem with AV and PW is that you need to put a shitload of effort into just popping them, in order to get raped and waste a weekend.

Kinda like how for the longest time people thought Vrtra was unkillable?

No effort to pop him, because back than he was always up!