Political crisis in Canada

[Thoronas]

Won't matter now. They have a month to fight a political opinion war in the media and they don't have the money to compete with the Conservatives. Anyone who isn't already supporting the Liberals and NDP will probably start to buy into the bullshit Conservatives are spewing on air.

[Arnwulf]

Sounds like this guy watched Revenge of the Sith one too many times.

[Correction]

for the average Frenchman, Doichlander, Nipponese, or Canadian who gets to be in Obama's cabinet won't affect their day to day lives beyond talking about the news.

I would think there's a tremendous international interest in who is in the Obama cabinet, since a major campaign promise is to end a war which is globally unpopular, and it's his cabinet that is going to shape that strategy. Is it somehow overexposed in the media across the borders?

[Elesirdur]

Oh yeah I know about the War in Iraq and all and Obama and his cabinet will have to has that one out, but I was comparing more individually political issues - ie. the rest of the world doesn't really care if a Southerner or someone from the Pacific Northwest gets made Secretary for the Interior, but they will care what Obama chooses to do about the war (which is an extrordinary circumstance imo)

And damnit, I was realy surprised that Jean approved the request to porogue parliament. I suppose it was the "safer" of the two choices, but the issue will just come to a head again in January - or even at the Speech from the Throne if NDP carousing is to be believed. Bigger repot at the CBC linked below:

GG agrees to suspend Parliament until January

[tyven]

what does this mean for my ski trips to canada in feb and april?

[Shinryusan]

It means you'd better stock up on firearms and billy clubs, since by then you'll probably have gangs of armed vigilantes roaming the plains, looking for ripe young women and twinkies to sate their fiendish hunger. Also, toques. Bring lots of toques.

[Elvis]

RACE WAR

[OzzofAsura]

What surprises me is that besides BG, I haven't heard anything about this on the local or national news in the states.

The potential Obama position picks are apparently more important. /eyeroll


Edit: Finally saw it mentioned on Google News.

"We" tend not to care about anything that happens outside of here... which I think, is bullshit. Any time I've seen Canadian news, they mention what's going on here as well, in detail nonetheless. The only time I see anything from Canada on the news is when a truck jumps a guardrail and explodes or someone decapitates someone else on a bus. It is very imbalanced and ridiculously arrogant and self-centered of us, but what else is new?

On a side note, I think Quebec abuses the shit out of it's place in Canada. I think they would be on whichever side rocks the boat hardest, so maybe they could start some sort of "revolution" and be that much closer to having that chunk of country to themselves. I think "Quebec" in general will only drag down the rest of the country as they definitely do not have common goals. If you want so badly to be your own French country, guess what? There is one already... it's called... Anyways, that's just the way I see it.

[Elesirdur]

On a side note, I think Quebec abuses the shit out of it's place in Canada. I think they would be on whichever side rocks the boat hardest, so maybe they could start some sort of "revolution" and be that much closer to having that chunk of country to themselves. I think "Quebec" in general will only drag down the rest of the country as they definitely do not have common goals. If you want so badly to be your own French country, guess what? There is one already... it's called... Anyways, that's just the way I see it.

Haha congratulations, you're well on your way to being a card-carrying Quebec-hating Western Canadian. j/k j/k

I honestly stopped caring too much about Quebec these days. The soveregintist movement is at a nearly all-time low and the financial implications of becoming a sovereign nation are so devastating (especially right now) that it would be utter ruin for the style of life most Quebeckers are accustomed to. If they want to use their Federal program monies to run Quebec as their own private feif that's fine by me. The only thing that gets me is their ability to stop potentially any and all consitutional reforms or amendments because they never actually signed on to the Canada Act, 1982.

[Annihilator]

yeah im the one who said the GG has to be a woman, it was my understanding from the latest picks from the Queen

Then again there hasnt always been a queen, and she hasnt always worked like she does


and I disagree that the Bloc quebecois only supports the side that "rocks the boat the hardest", since they have supplied the votes to keep the conservatives in power numerous times on touchy issues that the liberals and NDP dissagreed on, yet didnt want to vote against since they didnt want an election. The bloc gives them both a way to save face by letting them vote against policies they dont approve without needing to go in an election they dont want


I still think that Harper is making a horrible move by blaming the coalition on the separatists. It only makes all of his supporters go in a form of anti-Quebec riot, much like some of the McCain supporters who were promoting the "anti-black" movement to counter Obama.

The Liberals and NDP are forming this coalition, the Bloc is merely supporting it because it always goes in the better interest of those it represents, and right now those interests are better represented by the coalition group.

The risk now is that all those against the coalition become Quebec haters, and start fueling the very separatist movement that they seem to hate so much. The separatist ideology is extremely low at the moment, but seeing Quebec be treated like this might change that, especially now that Quebec is having a provincial election just next week. Really bad timing...

I thought the Prime minister of Canada was supposed to represent all of canada, not side with part of it to gang up against another part whenever it fits his needs. He just seems like the guy who will hold on to power by every possible mean, and if it means propaganda, avoiding a confidence vote, and preventing the Chamber from working against the economical crisis to keep it, then he wont mind, which is extremely selfish, and unfit of the representative of the people

[Olo401]

The CBC website has a online poll running about Harper's move.. last time I looked it was running 3-1 against prorogue. At this rate if he keeps this nonsense up, Dion can just sit in the shadows and do nothing but watch the Tories' popularity collapse in the eastern provinces.

[guartz]

Let's just hope this doesn't turn to violence.

[tyven]

is there even a remote chance of that?

[Shalyn]

I'm not even going to start on the Quebec argument, but I'd like to say that seeing the mannnny downsides of their separation on both sides isn't fitting a stereotype, just as I'm sure those who *are* separatists wouldn't like to be merely known as English-Canadian-Hating-Frogwhores :D

Anyway, I LIVE in Canada and haven't even heard anything about this, strangely enough. Although, in the past, I have been a Liberal supporter, they really lost my confidence these past years. The Lib. Rep. doesn't even come to my area to talk to the people who live here or hand out fliers, but the Conservatives do? That just doesn't make any sense. I absolutely did not vote PC though, voted NDP in hopes of spreading the seating in HoC without giving to the two 'major' parties.

This is really interesting, and wow, not that I'm surprised but our GG is a tool. A least, though, this is happening during a time when the gov. would have a lot of holidays anyway. Still, I hate Harper, and I hope something good comes of this... just not another election. Leave it up to the apathetic majority of non-voters in Canada and you just get the same thing over and over, apparently. That and wow, what a way to help our economy.. by spending millions on ANOTHER election.

[Blarg]

I barely know what's going on with this either so my opinion may be more opinion based than fact based. I think this coalition is retarded, it seems like a big fuck you to the people of canada because it is coming so soon after an election where the people decided that they DON'T want liberals/ndp/bloc etc in power. That appears to be irrelevant to those people who seem to feel that our votes mean next to nothing.

Sure more of Canada, those that voted, did not want the conservatives in (hence the minority government) but that does not mean that the majority of Canada wants to see Dion in charge. The people that voted liberal probably did not vote that way thinking that if the liberals won then ndp and bloc ideas would have to be given more consideration than they normally would.

It's like telling people who voted for Obama that america would rather have every person who ran against him coalesce together and form 1 president out of 5-6/whatever people because each of their votes combined was higher than the number of votes received for Obama. (Doesn't really work since I think Obama got the majority of all votes)

[guartz]

is there even a remote chance of that?

Well...no, I doubt it.

But let's just say, hypothetically, that 3 months into the white house, president Obama says we need to cut spending, so I'm shutting down some things and forget about the economic stimulus package.

And then let's say that the green party unites with republicans and through some obscure rule they are gonna kick out president obama and make McCain president.


Wouldn't you think to yourself, "god, I hope this doesn't become violent"?

[Charla]

Well...no, I doubt it.

But let's just say, hypothetically, that 3 months into the white house, president Obama says we need to cut spending, so I'm shutting down some things and forget about the economic stimulus package.

And then let's say that the green party unites with republicans and through some obscure rule they are gonna kick out president obama and make McCain president.


Wouldn't you think to yourself, "god, I hope this doesn't become violent"?

No, mostly I'd think "lawlz, what do you think this is? A parliament?"

Ontopic though, I'll just copy my last post from that other thread that got jacked by Canadian news:

The thing is, (although I admit all I really know about the situation is what I read in a few articles this week) Harper lately seems to be completely ignoring the opposition and governing by fiat, with the whole, "Screw you guys, I'll come up with some economic stimulus when I feel like it eh!" (Sorry. It's still funny once in a while). "Oh, but don't worry, you can still help out by giving up all your funding."

At that point, what's the effective difference between a majority government and a plurality government? And for that matter, isn't the possibility that a minority government could piss off the opposition parties enough for them to form a coalition part of what's supposed to "keep it in check" in the first place? If a coalition turns out to be impossible (because the G.G says so or because the people decide it's not democratic enough), then doesn't that take away a lot of the power that opposition parties are supposed to have?

[Gwynplaine]

I was under the impression that Canada's banks did not undertake the same kind of practices as the U.S. and so they're being less directly effected by it. So is this just a politicians attempt to elbow in on an opportunity or what? That is how it sounds to me. They hype a problem, do a "thing" (any "thing", stimulus, etc.), then wait until problem solves itself and claim credit for helping the people regain normality.

It just sounds like they are pissed off the election didn't turn out like they wanted. And so they will be god damned if they don't grab at their opportunity to get credited for "doing something" to fix the economy. Enjoy your democracy in all its nakedness.

[Charla]

There's more to a recession than banks though. Canada's economy probably wasn't so bad for the last year (while we were going through the whole housing/banking crash) because of the difference you mentioned, but when that all turned into a worldwide economic problem, it suddenly became everyone's problem.

edit: oh snap, CNN delivers.
Canadian leader suspends Parliament

[Annihilator]

canada's banks are indeed not in the same kind of situation as the US's

however, Canada is a big exporting country, and most of its exports are headed south to US consumers

so if the US faces a recession, people lose jobs, buy less stuff, which means less sales for canadian markets, which turns into companies closing down, jobs lost, and we end up in the same kind of recession sooner or later

thats why the government should invest in fields that would not be touched by this economic slowdown, like infrastructure and research on alternate energies and the likes, so that once the crisis has passed, theres still jobs around, and behold! the canadian economy is more diverse and has something else to offer

im not sure thats what the coalition has planned, but im sure thats not what Harper intends on doing