An Open Letter to Square-Enix

[Lahina]

Do you even know what inflation is? Look at what is going on around you now. Look at the recession/inflation we are experiencing in the US now. What does the government do? They hand out bailouts and tax refund to stimulate the economy. If they did what SE did and take out 1/6th of people's income then the economy will crash.

Um....

You know where the money for those bailouts comes from, right?

Right?

Spoiler: show

They >already< take more than 1/6 of our money

That said, there's a lot of bullshit gilsinks SE never took out of the game. FFS, why should I still pay Jeuno 2005 prices for a porta-chicken? Or for fething mage scrolls?

Yeah, I make money farming. I have Moghancement: Money at ~90 elemental strength, and I rape beastman casters for scrolls and gil while waiting on gildropping NMS. It may not be spectacular, but I made just shy of 300k on Friday and Saturday, in about 4 hours of gameplay. And an NM that normally drops over 6k, taken down instead with my Mug, Gilfinder, and MH: $ makes close to 12k on average, ignoring drops.

[Zeb]

ITT: Everyone posts off topic about how SE did this to nerf RMT.

Stop QQing retards. SE did not do this to nerf RMT, they did this to stem the large flow of gil coming into the economy, which was causing a price inflation. Everyone who over farmed those drops are responsible, not just the RMT that farmed them. SE knows how much gil is coming into the game and wants to keep it in a range they want, when people over farm, they're going to adjust NPC prices.

I upgraded 3 full salvage sets by farming demons over one year.. lets say 40 mil+ by regular farming. thats not an efficient way of making money indeed.

[Charismatic]

What fucking inflation is this?
Prices have been dropping since the STF came into existance.

[Valkrish]

@Roaringhedgehog or whatever your name was: Did you make that sig during recess? Being under the age of 12 is honestly the only reason I'd accept for that atrocious post.

Oh shit its battlecat, the bleaschman!

[ringthree]

Farming is for gimps and suckers, also the day they changed the item i camped day in day out from a 30 mil elite piece for any THF to have to a 100k piece of shit any lazy asshole could easily get I stopped giving a fuck about what SE did. Stop QQing pal.

Sadly, I think that your avatar is a real picture and not a joke...

[Hyan]

What fucking inflation is this?
Prices have been dropping since the STF came into existance.

It's actually quite stable right now. FoV and probably MMM will bring money to the economy too, so I guess they countered it with this change... must be CoP team decision tho since it was so well received!

[Ophannus]

enm 50 solo. i'm 1/10 on Toreador which is 3m

[Guitarman]

And this is just for starters. Consider this Darwinism in action. The smart adapt and thrive. The dumb and weak are weeded out. If youc an't make money, you're dumb and weak. I know you don't want to hear it, but....

This is true...in real life.

This is a game, though. In here, the smart adapt, the dumb/lazy just use a credit card. Yelling about it, kicking and screaming swearing its not true won't do a thing to change that fact.

Now personally, i still have quite a few places i can farm for money. 2 of my spots were taken away in this patch, but i still have others. What concerns me personally, is the fact that so much is being taken away, yet there is no effort to make replacement methods of making income. Those that first learned about bugard skins, or beast bloods will find new ways to make money. They'll become the new hotspots, until that too is nerfed. It won't be long before your secret little spot is discovered and taken away too.

There needs to be a new way of making a modest living. I'm not saying make everything so easy that gil is worthless, but just something to offset all the so called "anti RMT measures" SE is implimenting.

[Riki]

SE apperantly nerfed those farming methods because they think that too much Gil is added to the economy that way. The only point really worth discussing here is if that decision is reasonable or not.
Many Gil making methods posted here only circulate Gil, but don't create new Gil. Still, many people play this game with the mindset that selling loot to NPCs should make some profit (because it does so in every other RPG).

[Kenji]

This is true...in real life.

This is a game, though. In here, the smart adapt, the dumb/lazy just use a credit card. Yelling about it, kicking and screaming swearing its not true won't do a thing to change that fact.

You have a point. Until the playerbase actively works against people who buy gil, there will always be that problem. But that's too much work for most.

But those that buy gil, lose in real life. They are less efficient at life, since someone else can aquire the same as them, with less real life money. In short, using a credit card to get more gil, is basically admitting, "I suck at the game. I know, this game is easy, but because I'm a worthless failure who can't even do easy things, I'll just risk my account being stolen or banned, or damaging my reputation, and let some corporation sucker me out of my money."

There needs to be a new way of making a modest living. I'm not saying make everything so easy that gil is worthless, but just something to offset all the so called "anti RMT measures" SE is implimenting.

You, like many others, missed the point. This wasn't a strictly RMT measure. It was an anti-gil measure. SE, like most MMO companies, keeps track of money coming in and going out. They make adjustments if too much is coming in.

Personally, I'm glad. I have quite a bit of money on hand. Deflation will make my money more valuable, as prices fall.

[Hoshiku]

I agree that there are other ways to make money. My only concern is that they've nerfed one of the best ways that gil was being replenished. Dynamis, Limbus, Einherjar, chocobos, airships, ferrys, outpost warps, and AH/City taxes take a lot of gil out of the economy on a weekly basis. You have to wonder if SE really looked at gil out vs. gil in when they made this decision, I suspect they did not. If you want a tip on how to make money, my suggestion to you is don't spend what you have now. I bet this update causes another steep drop to available gil.

[rmtbot9000]

Okay, need to get back on track. People want the sources of income they have come to rely on changed back. There was really no reason to take it away, and why the player base is fighting with itself over more typical SE bullshit is beyond me. If you can make money doing what you do, thats grand. But lets be honest here, these camps are well known and fed alot of mouths so to speak. Now that they are near worthless to put time and effort into there is going to be a huge amount of people looking to satisfy they're needs. When they come to your camp or take up your craft and flood the market with whats hot, how long will the shit last before SE patches everything that isn't HQ crafting or HNM items? We need more ways that the average player can use to make decent gil without having to dedicate alot of time to it specifically.

[Cream Soda]

enm 50 solo. i'm 1/10 on Toreador which is 3m

I'm 1/nearly 60 on this. Been doing once a week since october 2007, only seen 1 ring. Tbh, I've probably spent more in meds if you add u every time I've done this than I got from that ring.

[Zathous]

Um . . okay? Have you ever crafted? Who here has leveled crafting without gil? Start at 0 gil with no gil at all? Even with crafting, you need to go out and farm money. Taking these methods of making gil will just hurt the economy, not help it.

Do you even know what inflation is? Look at what is going on around you now. Look at the recession/inflation we are experiencing in the US now. What does the government do? They hand out bailouts and tax refund to stimulate the economy. If they did what SE did and take out 1/6th of people's income then the economy will crash.

98 Alchemy... its called farming mats? you know how rockafeller made it big? or any monopoly in US history? they controlled the materials from start to end... they owned the mines the refineries and had high influence over the distributors. Use their model as your own. Go mine and level smithing. pure profit if you take your time.

And what the US is doing right now is equatable of putting 15M in the pocket of of every crafter expecting them to use it to craft and circulate so that they can make gil under the impression that they can phase it back out, in the case of the game, they would have to raise bird prices, limbus, dyna and ein back up.

im on the left politically and think the gov't should bail out the people in order to stimulate the economy because were bound to buy shit thats struggling (automakers, housing, etc.)... not help the catering business by throwing a multimillion dollar party and giving yourself a $10M bonus. read the papers, the real world is just as messed up as FFXI. (equatable to square giving crafting kingpins 100M and expecting them to not buy themselves a relic)

[+Vivik+]

People need to just go back to the golden oldies of repeatable quests, like tiger fangs, or the new addition of ladybug wings, or even low level fishing/mining/logging. Theres still ifrits cauldron, or newton movalpolas, or logging places for bloodwood logs.

This doesn't kill gilmaking methods. This kills lazy people gilmaking methods

what are you smoking, might want to put it down!!

"lazy people gilmaking methods" is the way a large part of the population makes gil to begin with. When you have 3-4h/d to play... of which many are eaten buy events.. lazy gilmaking methods are the only way to make any gil what so ever..

I do believe in putting an end to RMT, but dung it in a manner that makes normal players unable to make a few "k" quick here and there's nothing more then plain stupid.

This will eat allot of flames but i think SE should make thing easier so even if you play low hours you would not be left out.. instead they are dung the opposite.. SE should think up of more content for people to remain interested in ffxi... not spread 5grams of butter over 5 loafs of bread!!

[Octavious]

ITT: people can bitch and moan all the want but it won't matter because you're just a dollar sign to SE. If you want to get your point across, play another game. I'm pissed they fucked farming over, but I still play the game so QQ'ing is pretty inefficient. I can't see myself buying anymore content from SE unless they physically outdo something old or add some ridiculously awesome instanced content. During Quarters at OSU i used to farm Beast Blood when I had free time since I couldn't play much. Over a week or so i'd net some money, craft, garden whatever and increase my profits. Now I'm stuck to overpricing Sushi. There's always alternatives to farming, but fact is SE keeps reducing 'em. Just bitch, think it over, stop bitching and play, chrissst.

[Kenji]

I agree that there are other ways to make money. My only concern is that they've nerfed one of the best ways that gil was being replenished. Dynamis, Limbus, Einherjar, chocobos, airships, ferrys, outpost warps, and AH/City taxes take a lot of gil out of the economy on a weekly basis. You have to wonder if SE really looked at gil out vs. gil in when they made this decision, I suspect they did not. If you want a tip on how to make money, my suggestion to you is don't spend what you have now. I bet this update causes another steep drop to available gil.

Where is your data to support your hypothesis?

Or are you just fear-mongering because you can't make money now?

Edit: To clarify, what makes you think SE hasn't already looked at all gil leaving the economy, and their *real* data suggests everything will be fine? Or that if does seem a bit too much, make another adjustment down the line?

I swear, people need to run around like chicken little more.

[chiyio]

SE's putting a stop to people simply NPCing their goods and trying to get a proper player driven economy back on track. So what? If your only means to make gil is the same method that is popularized by RMT using scripted bots, then the problem is on your end, not theirs.

[Phraust]

Read through this thread for the most part, I skimmed chunks here and there, but I fail to see anyone hit the logic of this.

To those who say Just Craft your money or say: Just ENM/BCNM/ISNM/HELM/Garden

>>> Who's going to buy that stuff when they have no source of income? If you think this doesn't affect you because you have items to sell, you're wrong.

To those who say Just farm something else or say: Just quest for the money. or say: My farming spots are still safe.

>>> SE's just going to nerf those too. Your farming spots are going to get more crowded. You think you're safe in yours because you haven't seen anyone there? Well a huge chunk of easy money has evaporated, it's a massive doubel whammy. You cut the farming spots in half you get 2x as many people in new farming spots, your farming spots. If you think questing isn't going to be hit, think again, SE's already nailed a couple of the money quests.

To those who say: If peopel have no money things will get cheaper.

>>> This is true, however there needs to be a balance, if items are dropping in price as rapidly as they are, it means more money is leaving the game than is coming in. And its not because x.billion gil is removed when RMT are busted. Take that number and devide it accross servers, then calculate how much money leaves per day to limbus, dynamis, AH fees, Teleports, airships, ships, NPC's, crafting guilds, Crafting breaks, arrows, bolts, ninjitsu, food, accidental drops, people quitting, etc..

ON any one of those scenarios you run into the same thing, Your ENM/BCNM/HELM/ISNM/Gardening/Alternate Farming/etc.. Is going to get watered down now. If you're relying on AH to sell shit you think is your secret, you're about to have people jump in and undercut you.

Less money coming in + More competitioin from people trying to circulate money rather than make it + more competition at camps + More money going out = Everyone is affected.

On the flip side:

To the folks saying: This hurts legitimate players mre than RMT.

>>> You have to remember this isn't just your server. My server is pretty unpopulated, and RMT are very damn rare here. (It's heaven) and when I Demon Hunted, there was only one thief there, and all they did was fight Orcs, and only Orcs. The Demons were always free about 80% of the time. It'd be hard to have proper perspective if I was only thinking of my server, but there are a lot of servers out there that are absolutely overrun. To where these "fixes" hurt the RMT as a whole a lot more than the player base.

Also note that SE is always trying to give us Rare/Ex alternatives. DO you need that Hauberk? Or can you get by with Askar? How much did most of the gear you're wearing cost really? Most of my jobs are mostly Rare/Ex gear now, and that's not counting Cursed gear since I condider that bought. My demand on the AH is very low, I only need consumables really, and I am sure a lot of you are in the same boat. However things with fixed costs liek spells and events are going to get really painful really soon if this continues...

[Hoshiku]

I don't think they have looked at gil out vs gil in because of past experiences with SE. The only notable pieces of equipment I remember the prices of before the first time SE took gil out of the economy were nobles tunic, kirin's osode, and eurytos bow. They were 9 million gil, 20 million gil, and 20 million gil. After the initial gil deletion nobles dropped to 2 million, KO and ebow sold for about 4 mil each. Todays price on these items is 180k, 2-3 million, and 2.4 million. There are a lot of factors that change price so I don't even know that you can say taking gil out caused this (increase in item, decrease in popularity of job, newer better equipment, crafting bots for things like sushi and tools). I just know that a majority of my friends spend some time in the meadows or castle z on a weekly basis restoring the gil they spend on instanced stuff and supplies. I doubt that my friends will stop making gil, but they might change the method of how (for instance they might sell imperial coins, allied note items, or retrace/teleport) because a recycled gil farming opportunity might make more gil for them at this point. I say save your gil til you see how the economy sorts out because if a lot of gil was generated from NPCing trash from castle z and lufaise meadows then your gil might go a lot farther now.