MMM findings

[Wolfknight]

technically COULD to this at any level. Has imps (tons per set), floating eyes, and tauri. As to whether they Mortal Ray or not... don't know yet, but MMM Colibri don't reflect, so who's to say what Tauri do or don't do. I haven't seen anything added to demons rune...yet.

I am 95% sure it is impossible for the tauri to use mortal ray, but I had heard demon rune had gargoyle, and/or Ruszor added to it with last update, do you have any info on that?

[Jb1210a]

I'm really interested in the demon mazes now, gives a nice break from birds over and over and over... you get the picture. I've not done the PL outside party yet, seems like it would be a good idea to use it before you get Penta Thrust or Slugwinder.

[Panthera]

I am 95% sure it is impossible for the tauri to use mortal ray, but I had heard demon rune had gargoyle, and/or Ruszor added to it with last update, do you have any info on that?

i certainly hope not.

if they did add ruszors, it would be in aquans. these guys are horrible to exp on... conal Terrorize? no thanks, not to mention all their other nasty tp moves AND buffs.

Gargoyles would be in demons maze, yeah. They also have terrible aoe damaging tp moves. It takes a whm/sch to be able to deal with it in a mana-efficient way. i've yet to see them in demons, i don't think they put them in there, but not a large enough sample size yet to definitively say they aren't.

I've partied on both of these in xarcabard s. it's something to kill for fun, not for exp.

[Panthera]

Tried standard exp maze, but this time using Beast as the mob type. Had one 74 in, which lowered mob's levels by one, other than that, all 75s, war, monk, thf, drg, bard and rdm.

Small type mobs were Monkeys and Rabbits, Large Types included sheep and Dhalmels. We didn't try it enough times to see anything else show up.

Mobs didn't have terribly high evasion or defense, however, AOE Damage TP moves such as Whirl Claw and Spinning Claw strip party shadows or inflict damage, causing members to spend time casting shadows instead of doing damage, or costing the Red Mage precious MP. A White Mage/sch might be able to handle it in a mana-efficient way.

The real problem with using Beast as the target is that there's no way to exploit a weakness to weapon types as one would have with Birds or even Bones. It took nearly the entire time to clear the maze, where with birds (pre-hipogryphs...) you're looking at a 15-20 minute clear time. Chaining the entire maze is not feasable without a mob's vulnerability to piercing, as long runs between sets necessitates quick kills to compensate for time spent running between sets, resulting in less exp per maze.

Long story short, Beast types, while certainly doable, is more for a break from grinding away on avians and doing something new and challenging, and less for earning merits efficiently.

[Jado818]

I recently started doing Maze Voucher 06 "Appropriation Team" and have been having trouble finishing it.

Only rune I put on is the insurance contract because I usually die 10~20 times each go. Damn terrotaur always sees me >:U

Ive been trying to do this solo and closest ive come to finishing is timing out in front of the goblin with the third chest's treasure.

Anybody have any advice on how it might be soloed and what the potential reward from this maze is... (i.e. should i even bother trying to do this one or farm another for points)

[Arcanesoul]

I recently started doing Maze Voucher 06 "Appropriation Team" and have been having trouble finishing it.

Only rune I put on is the insurance contract because I usually die 10~20 times each go. Damn terrotaur always sees me >:U

Ive been trying to do this solo and closest ive come to finishing is timing out in front of the goblin with the third chest's treasure.

Anybody have any advice on how it might be soloed and what the potential reward from this maze is... (i.e. should i even bother trying to do this one or farm another for points)

Halfway down the post is what I do to solo it.

http://www.bluegartr.com/forum/showp...postcount=2066

It also tells you the runes to use. Put stillness on at the very least. Base marble count is 40 for the maze. Stillness will take off 3. Amesiac's Trial will bring it back to 40. This has the potential to go over 70 for really hard likely non-soloable mazes, but marble counts in ~65 range are soloable fine.

With regards to the Terrormonger, best bet is if you have some job with widescan so you can track it. If you don't have a widescan job, only option is to keep your eyes open especially before climbing the stairs or roaming the back tunnel on the other side of the jail. It has a set roaming area around the maze, but I don't know if it follows a set route.

The other thing that looks worrying is the 10-20 deaths. Keep insurance contract on, but this is dramatically cutting your marble output (by at least a half). Use your items more and try and exploit the field of vision the mobs have (stillness should cut this down). You shouldn't be dying that much unless you're lagging in there.

The question is though what is your purpose? Are you just farming marbles or are you after runes from the lost & found group in the hoardbox (I know you said you didn't have the rune on)? If you're are not looking for a rune from the lost & found group, then I would suggest doing Voucher 05 instead. V05 has a lower max marble output than V06, but given you're using insurance contract, you're taking a heavy hit to marbles anyway. Base number of marbles for V05 is 25.

Gergall posted a good tactic for soloing V05, which I've used happily when I've done it.
http://www.bluegartr.com/forum/showp...postcount=1846

How to setup V05 here:
http://www.bluegartr.com/forum/showp...postcount=1844
Indi posted this setup which give 43 marbles (M01,V05,017,018,100,101,102,103,104)

This is probably your best bet for earning marbles. If you're collecting marbles to setup an NM maze or exp maze, just look on duplidoc for the maze if that is your end goal.
If you're collecting runes from the hoard box, I'd suggest setting up an exp type maze (like the bird mazes mentioned earlier in the thread) and potentially the NM mazes for the lost and found set too (can do this in exp ones as well).

[Gergall]

Keep insurance contract on, but this is dramatically cutting your marble output (by at least a half).

Yeah I believe it's confirmed that insurance contract causes the marbles to be cut in half.

Even so, it sounds like this guy should continue to use insurance contract for now (like you said) until he stops dying so much.

Use runes that make V06 easier. 113 ("Shortcut") can help.

[vagus]

An exp maze is basically this...

Rune 17: Supreme might
Rune 18: Might
Rune 108: Conditioning Contract
any rune Rune 1-11: To specify a mob type

Optional Runes (but encouraged)

Rune 102: Trial by Numbers (for a third set of mobs; pre- merit parties, i think people tend to go with just two sets of mobs an forego this rune? but three sets are standard for merit parties)

Rune 14: Tiny Warrior (this does not guarantee all mobs will be the small type, on rare occasion, 2/3 sets can be large type, even with tiny warrior)

It's tough to say what "Motion" and "Stillness" actually do for this, if anything. Or what the various "element" runes do and WHY you'd want to put those in there....

Thank you, this is the information i was looking for. JP seem to love to do MMM for xp, we need to do more investigating. How easy is it to copy a MMM set for other people?

[LinktheDeme]

Thank you, this is the information i was looking for. JP seem to love to do MMM for xp, we need to do more investigating. How easy is it to copy a MMM set for other people?

costs 500 gil. Perfect set if you are on odin server is Palpal's I think his name is? Moi's is good too but has only supreme might rather than both supreme might and might.

You'll only do well though if you have at least two people with piercing pre-75 merit pt set up. The reason JPs do it a lot because with a well geared pt you can get 5-6k/20 mins (including mob exp) with moi's with Palpal's it is like 7-8k/25mins.

You can do ok without piercing set up, but I wouldn't understand why you would get people without it seeing how anyone can really use a polearm and monks and pups have no excuse anymore with the . (not to mention Roc's resist slashing and blunt equally) Also don't bother with a tank but a brd or cor is needed.

[ronin sparthos]

Pre-75, do people equip Trial by Numbers? Ive also heard of some people doing V02 also for EXP... how does that work out?

Also, can you go in with 5 - drop the 6th as a PL and level sync the party?

[LinktheDeme]

Pre-75, do people equip Trial by Numbers? Ive also heard of some people doing V02 also for EXP... how does that work out?

Also, can you go in with 5 - drop the 6th as a PL and level sync the party?

the way i've seen and done it people always use trial by numbers for exp be it pre 75 and post 75.

And I believe you can PL from the outside if desired but the sync target has to go up first I'm not sure if the mage has to be synced first.

The Runes used for EXP that I see are

Maze Rune 102 - Trial By Numbers (Attuned in the top left corner on fire)
Maze Rune 108 -Conditioning Contract (Attuned on the top right on lightning)
Maze Rune 014 - Tiny Warrior (Attuned on the Bottom left on wind)
Maze Rune 017 - Supreme Might (Randomly placed)
Maze Rune 003 - Bird (Attuned on the light on the bottom right)
Maze Rune 018 - Might (randomly Placed)

The only variation I've seen of this is no Maze Rune 018 and instead it was a different one (the one that gives a rune upon completion)

The variation is most likely if you do not have a well enough geared party (normally lacking piercing) to be able to clear might and supreme might at the same time is what I assume.

[ClarkSammich]

Pre-75, do people equip Trial by Numbers? Ive also heard of some people doing V02 also for EXP... how does that work out?

Also, can you go in with 5 - drop the 6th as a PL and level sync the party?

I've done tons of pre-75 MMM exp, all with Trial by Numbers. Never used V02, though.

Trial by Numbers is mandatory, I would think. I usually get 4,500-5,200 from the box at the end, depending on the sets of mobs you get, so I assume only 2 sets of mobs would lower that by a good amount, and it's not hard to clear all 3 sets within 15-20min unless your party is terrible.

Also as for the PL thing, yeah you can do that, but it's not really needed. In fact, I would almost prefer to have my mage(s) in PT for esuna, (accession) erase, etc.

edit: I've always seen Trial by Velocity set on exp mazes, a few people I usually go with were saying they think it increases EXP from the box depending on how quickly you clear the maze, does anyone have experience with this?

[Viq]

Velocity does nothing to add exp, only marbles.

I don't suggest V02 pre-75.

[LinktheDeme]

I've done tons of pre-75 MMM exp, all with Trial by Numbers. Never used V02, though.

Trial by Numbers is mandatory, I would think. I usually get 4,500-5,200 from the box at the end, depending on the sets of mobs you get, so I assume only 2 sets of mobs would lower that by a good amount, and it's not hard to clear all 3 sets within 15-20min unless your party is terrible.

Also as for the PL thing, yeah you can do that, but it's not really needed. In fact, I would almost prefer to have my mage(s) in PT for esuna, (accession) erase, etc.

edit: I've always seen Trial by Velocity set on exp mazes, a few people I usually go with were saying they think it increases EXP from the box depending on how quickly you clear the maze, does anyone have experience with this?

That's the one I was talking about I thought it only gives a Rune? When I used it we got 4000-4700 on average (cleared each in about 20 minutes) peaked higher numbers when we had all small monsters other ones we had large monsters and I just denoted it to that fact.

[Bakthi]

Here's what I've used. I didn't design this myself; I think I got most of my ideas from Suiram, but I don't remember now.

Pre-75:
V01 with Aquan, Bird, Tiny Warrior, Might, Trial by Numbers, Conditioning Contract

Merits:
V02 with Bird, Demon, Tiny Warrior (resonating), Supreme Might, Might, Trial by Numbers, Conditioning Contract.

Notes:

- The only reason Tiny Warrior isn't resonated for pre-75 is that I have V01 set up on M01 and V02 set up on M02. This is just so I can leave them both set...although now that I have Maat's Cap, I guess I could scrap my exp maze >.>

- I like Aquan + Bird for pre-75. All you get out of Aquans is crabs and pugils (although I haven't done it since the update). Also, it was tough enough without SM in the 40s.

- The few times I did pre-75 exp, I went in with 5 and a 75 RDM. The order is go in > RDM drops from party > Level Sync > buff > enter maze. We did fine with a party of...RDM PLD SAM ??? ???; no BRD or COR. I don't even remember now. I know I had a PUP in there one time. We never failed to clear all the mobs, though it was kind of close a few times. Not having light-based sleep sucked for when 3-4 bats were clustered.

- I agree that V01 is better for pre-75. V02 really makes it easier to keep up a chain, and has 4 sets of mobs with Trial by Numbers, but could easily cause a lower level party to be overwhelmed.

- I don't like going into MMM merits without a BRD+COR, but then again, that's how I like to merit anyway. I prefer to merit on COR, and wouldn't merit at all without a BRD (unless I'm on BLM, but that's a whole different story).

[midguardian]

I've done some MMM pre-75 exp mazes lately. Mostly in the 30-50 level range. I've always used Trial by Numbers (Rune 102) for the extra group of mobs. Plenty of times we've had to unsync in order to clear the final mobs in time to complete the maze. If we didn't have a couple of higher levels synced down, we wouldn't have gotten the final chest. So I would say unless you have a very good party setup or a higher level person or two synced down in your party, it might be wise to go without Trial by Numbers. When you miss out on the final chest, even by one mob, you lose 80% of your exp from that maze.

[Viq]

If you're unsynching to finish in time, then you're doing it wrong. Using just SM instead of both SM+M will let you keep 102 while sacrificing minimal exp.

[ronin sparthos]

So V02 basically sends the monsters at you? How many waves total for a win?

[Viq]

4 waves w/ 102, 3 without

[midguardian]

If you're unsynching to finish in time, then you're doing it wrong. Using just SM instead of both SM+M will let you keep 102 while sacrificing minimal exp.

This is with only SM. I've never done an exp maze with both difficulty runes.