MMM findings

[Suiram]

Would be rather sadistic if this were the case, but maybe instead of nerfing (or in addition to nerfing) marble reward, 098 prevents the accumulation of extra marbles resulting from extra treasure in V06? Would explain why you never saw variation before, but now you got 7 more marbles than the other guy with the same setup.

[Gergall]

Would be rather sadistic if this were the case, but maybe instead of nerfing (or in addition to nerfing) marble reward, 098 also prevents the accumulation of extra marbles resulting from extra treasure in V06? Would explain why you never saw variation before, but now you got 7 more marbles than the other guy with the same setup.

Interesting concept.

By the way, under normal circumstances, doesn't 094 cause a decrease in marbles earned? Or at the very least, it prevents one from using other marble-increasing runes (Amnesiac's Trial in this example) due to space constraints on the Tabula.

Higher rewards should be possible. My next test will be replacing 094 with some better stuff.

[Julian]

Not sure if this would be the right place to make such a post but I'd really like to get started on MMM, if anyone on Odin looking for another body? >.> I got a ton of useful jobs (pld, rdm, blm, smn, sam, thf, etc) Hit me up with a pm here or something

actually, maybe I could do some solo stuff? (bst 67) If anyone has some tips on getting started solo would be great, currently have 100 marbles accumulated and runes 5, 10, 17, 40, 41, 75, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104, 106, 109, and only the first voucher. I'm gonna spend some time reading through past pages when I have the time.

(My main eventual goal is a MMJ earring i guess <.<)

[Suiram]

Before the last version update, the accepted (I'd say) MMM "progression" went something like this:

1. Find some friends, start doing Lv1 farming runs until you can buy 100~104.
2. Set 100~104, 017 when it drops, and eventually 018, and farm marbles Lv1 every day for 2-4 weeks, until you've obtained 017 and a few magic runes, and saved up enough marbles to buy 094.
3. Do Lv1 farming with 094 set while you finish getting enough marbles to buy the other needed items for NM mazes (M02/03, V07, mob family runes, GW/TW/Mot/Stil, Might if you don't already have, maybe Force of will, etc.). Hopefully get a decent job rune drop in the process.
4. Spam V07s forever until everyone has the items they want or give up out of frustration.
5. At this point you hopefully got 108 to drop, otherwise resume Lv1 farming with L&F set until you get it.
6. Enter MMM "retirement" just using your mazes for 108 exp runs, or farming for marbles to get all runes if you're a completionist.

Now with the last update, stuff changed. 1~3 might not be the best way to farm marbles since it got nerfed (hopefully the renewed interest in V06 will yield marble farming runs comperable to the old Lv1 farming). But more appropriate to your situation, if you're only interested in getting NM drop (and that one NM drop in particular) you may not even need to build your own maze. Mazes for the more popular drops often get loaded onto Duplidoc so people can have multiple chances for drop, so you might be able to just leech off that.

[Gergall]

actually, maybe I could do some solo stuff? (bst 67) If anyone has some tips on getting started solo would be great, currently have 100 marbles accumulated and runes 5, 10, 17, 40, 41, 75, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104, 106, 109, and only the first voucher. I'm gonna spend some time reading through past pages when I have the time.

See a few posts up where I have a screenshot of 164 marbles in one run? That was solo. If you plan to do solo, you may want to do Voucher 6.
HOWEVER, Voucher 6 can be a bit difficult (far from impossible) without Rune 016: Stillness (makes the mobs in Voucher 6 nearly blind). You also want to resonate stillness, which requires Tabula M03.
Let me know if you want some more tips for Voucher 6. I highly recommend reraise of some sort, and antidotes.

As an alternate solo option, you can spend your 100 marbles on Rune 001: Aquan and do solo runs on Voucher 1. Voucher 1 with Aquan in place will have 100% charmable mobs for your BST. Just keep throwing mobs at each other and let them all die (don't heal or rest your pets at all). You will get less marbles than Voucher 6, but you will have a steady and reliable source of marbles. You can always buy Voucher 6 and the supporting runes later.

Good luck!

[Arcanesoul]

Not sure if this would be the right place to make such a post but I'd really like to get started on MMM, if anyone on Odin looking for another body? >.> I got a ton of useful jobs (pld, rdm, blm, smn, sam, thf, etc) Hit me up with a pm here or something

actually, maybe I could do some solo stuff? (bst 67) If anyone has some tips on getting started solo would be great, currently have 100 marbles accumulated and runes 5, 10, 17, 40, 41, 75, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104, 106, 109, and only the first voucher. I'm gonna spend some time reading through past pages when I have the time.

(My main eventual goal is a MMJ earring i guess <.<)

This is what I wrote for my linkshell based of the info from here and wiki.
Council of Wisdom : Forums : Call for Help : Moblin Maze Mongers -- Marble farming, and NM's Posts : Final Fantasy Online Guild Powered by GuildPortal™ Guild Hosting

As Gergall said V06 seems to be the best option for collecting runes solo, but people are still exploring it. Sprinters shoes or general movement speed items help too.

Soloing the maze is definitely possible on bst but make sure you have some good charm equipment. My own experience of doing these blu/bst (around your level and lower) was that it wasn't really worth it though. Bst camps are faster for exp, and Using V01 with the max marble setup will yield more marbles faster. If you can't get a linkshell friend to help (or have a second account) with a V01 run, then just shout and someone usually will answer quickly since there is hardly any work on their part and they get some marbles.


@ Gergall :
From what I recall, Insurance Contract (098 ) does have a penalty associated with it. When I put it on one of my NM mazes I recall getting an 8 or 9 marble penalty.
The difference in marbles from your maze and the one you copied from seems to be due to the Trial by Velocity rune (100), and this seems to be one of the better yielding marble runes, however I have to wonder if it's possible to fully make use of Trial by Velocity without the Shortcut rune which may have a penalty attached.

Still trying to successfully complete a blank V06 run, but I just haven't been able to do it yet.
So far the papetries seem to always be hidden right in the far tunnels. I'm going to try and dia a watcher or something from the bridge to warp me to jail and then start collecting from there, so I still have my disguises going back up (Eau de Moblin being the most important for passing the Terrormonger)

[Julian]

Thanks for the info :D I think I'll grab the aquan rune and go farm it up on bst

I like doing random events that most people don't usually bother with (Chocobo hot and cold, fishing (well this one is a little more common but still), etc) so my ultimate goal would be all runes or something, the earring is just something that I want to eventually work up to.

[ronin sparthos]

V06 noob, tried it once and died some painful deaths to the Ajattara mob.

What exactly is the goal and what is the up with the light at the start?

[Arcanesoul]

V06 noob, tried it once and died some painful deaths to the Ajattara mob.

What exactly is the goal and what is the up with the light at the start?

The aim of Voucher 06 is to collect the 3 Dynamis items, one from each papetrie scattered throughout the maze, essentially without being detected. The mobs in the maze are too hard to fight and bringing a level 1 person does nothing.

What is the light you're talking about at the start? If there is one on the ground that looks like the lycodium flower warp quest, then there will be a temp item in there like a pick axe or some random beastman item that can be turned in to the Goblin for more rewards in your Hoardbox.

To start out, I usually talk to the Goblin, and get 3 temp items, which are Sachet of Bugs (Chigoe costume, can still move, 30 secs), a Sachet of Wood (Forcer costume, cannot move, 30 secs), and Eau de Moblin.

The Sachet of Bugs will let you pass by the Flans and Dolls (and loose aggro from them if you're being chased by them). This won't fool the Ahrimans or Attajara though.

The Sachet of Wood I believe will let you hide from the Ahriman - watchers (but won't hide you if you're spotted by them first) . It won't let you lose aggro from Dolls or Flans either or hide you from the Attajara.

Eau de Moblin makes all the mobs calm or something for about 30 seconds so you can run by them, including the Attajara (Terrormonger) I believe.

Each item from the papetrie will weigh you down and remove any quickening effect.
You can carry as many temp items as you want I think, including the items from all 3 papetries, but you will be weighed down the entire way.

Forcers are located around the area which include more Sachet of Bugs and Sachet of Wood. You can also get more from the Goblin at the start when you hand the beastman temp items to him, by talking to him a second time. You can only get the Eau de Moblin once though and you will lose it on death.

Addition of runes:

Dragon rune appears to add another Attajara to the maze. Amorph adds more flans. Arcana adds more dolls. Demon adds more Ahriman.

Stillness seems to make the mobs aggro radius a lot smaller.

Shortcut from reading here, seems to bring the papetries closer to the front of the maze, although I'm not positive about this.

If you're spotted by any of the mobs, they will attempt to kill you except the Ahriman, which will use a special move and send you to a jail. It's fairly easy to get past the guard though and puts you at the furthest end of the maze from the start.

Theres also more info further back

Ok, so I decided to try maze voucher 006 and jesus christ the maze and it's objective are extremely complex, serious this going take few week to figure out where to start lol...
Lets see first the moblin at start will give you 3 temps items, bug sachet will turn you into chigoe this lets you get past certain mobs, wood sachet this will change you into box you can't move but no mobs aggro when I tried, and 3rd that makes the enemies stop temporally. There are a lot of forcers, ???, mining points, chests[had items named after dynamis crafting stuff didn't manage to get back to npc], and rare locked chest said need living key, managed to get key near end of run but didn't get to chest, when maze pearl was used said 3 left, no idea what. There are a lot of mobs in it some seem to be True Sight, others don't. We used insurance contract and didn't lose any exp I don't if this is the case normally.

More info: Chigoe/bug thing lets you get by puddings but not other enemys it seems, the eyes sent you to "jail" which on different no map area and sends you to second map and turning items you get to NPC seems to be objective, but only some items count towards I know goblin dice does, it's pretty fun and different though and give the dynamis named items wootz ore seems possible. Also it's ruhotz Silvermines. Mob types were Doll[Maze keeper], Eyes[Watcher], Wyvern[Terrormonger], Goblib[Goblin Diggers], Puddings[Treasure Goobers I think], and Wierd Moblin Idol npc things that do status effects, knock backs or other things. This Thing is extremely complex.

VOUCHER 06 INFO

RUNES USED: 82, 98, 106, 107, 111, 113.


GOAL: Collect the specified number of items, and return them to the NPC located at teh start of the maze. The items can be found in blue treasure chests called "Papeterie" located throughout the maze. These items will be temp items corresponding to loot from Dynamis, such as Sparkling Stones, and Fresh Orc Liver.

ENEMIES: There are Gigas, Goblins, Flans, Wyverns, and Dolls in the maze. Mobs do not adjust to level 1 mule. Spell and item forms of Sneak and Invisible do NOT work. Dolls and the Gigas take little physical damage, and are immune to sleep, even Elemental Sealed. They have very high HP, similar to Dahaks in the assault missions "Evade and Escape." They check "Impossible to gauge" and do not depop. The Moblin NPC at the start will give you single, one time use items to get past them. Turn into a chigoe costume to get past Dolls and Flan. Mobs, even Wyverns, have normal movement speed. Dolls tend to move back and forth in predictable patterns. Wyverns seem to wander everywhere. Some mobs spawn in the same place every maze, others spawn randomly. Widescan works in the maze. A special note on floating eyes; once they land a blow on you, you will be warped to "Jail", even should Utsusemi block the attack. Goblins attacks have additional effect: Bind.

Upon death, temp items are taken out of inventory, and scattered as ???'s around the vicinity of where death occured, and can be re-obtained by examining the ???'s. This applies to items obtained from mining and from chests, however, "sneak and invisible" items are lost.

Located throughout the maze are Forcers. They have somewhat high defense and HP compared to forcers in Voucher 01, so bringing a weapon you have skill in is advised. Inside the forcers are temp items that help you to get passed mobs.

There are mining points inside the maze which have various temporary items, including copper, silver, zinc, and gold ores. You can turn these into the NPC at the start. However, you do not necessarally get their non-temporary item counterparts upon completion of the maze.

There are red and blue, non targetable Golin Totems. The red ones will glow red and issue a warning sign, after which will afflect you with an random detrimental status effect if you within its aoe, such as Gravity, Amnesia, Poison, and Terror. The blue totems can give a "Quickening" effect.

An "Irksome Chest" spawns at random locations within the maze. It can only be opened by a Thief with Living Keys. Possible contents currently unknown.

The maze has 3 known maps. 2 of the Maps are similar to Gusten Mine Maps, and a Jail area which has no map. A "Bind" effect will be in effect upon zoning to jail. This effect will wear on its own, or can be removed with the spell "erase." The jail Area has a Gigas you must sneak passed. Once beyond him, there is a "Well of Vigilance" which takes you to the "Ladder of Liberty" located at the north east corner of Map 2. The "Jail" also has a Moblin NPC who will open for you the "Well of Charity," which also leads to the "Ladder of Liberty. However, the Moblin will give ask you to give him one piece of loot you've acquired from mining. Items obtained from Papeteries will not be accepted. A Lamp of Compassion spawns in the maze. Activating the lamp causes the "Well of Humility" in the "Jail" to open. The "Well of Humility" also leads to the "Ladder of Liberty".

Pickaxes purchased from NPCs outside the MMM maze will NOT work. Temporary Pickaxes can be obtained from ???'s scattered around the maze. Obtaining items from mining will weigh you down and create a cumulative gravity effect. Turning the items into the Moblin NPC at the start will remove rid of the gravity effect. Activating "Chocobo Jig" will have no effect when weighed down, nor will the Quickening effect from blue Goblin Totems.

REWARDS: Rune 46, a Grimmonite, and Carrot Paste. This was with only 1 Temp. Silver Ore turned in.


OTHER NOTES: Rune 98 (insurance contract) strongly recommended to fully prevent EXP loss. Several charges of Reraise in spell or item form recommended, as mobs are extremely difficult to defeat. It is possible to solo this maze. Delay mining until after all "Papeteries" have been found and returned to the Goblin NPC at the start. Attempting to find the "Papeteries" while mining might prove difficult due to the gravity effect of temp. loot items. The maze described above was done with several runes in place to make it easier; various NPCs and things found in the maze might or might not be inherently present.

This is what i have discovered thus far.

EDIT: In the interest of keeping information consolidated, i'd like to edit this post for corrections and for when additional information is found.

EDIT: Eyes attacks that land on the character *will* do damage. Added blue statue, widescan, and Chocobo Jig, and Goblin NPC/Well of Charity and Humility info.

[Gergall]

Still trying to successfully complete a blank V06 run, but I just haven't been able to do it yet.
So far the papetries seem to always be hidden right in the far tunnels. I'm going to try and dia a watcher or something from the bridge to warp me to jail and then start collecting from there, so I still have my disguises going back up (Eau de Moblin being the most important for passing the Terrormonger)

You're just having bad luck, keep at it. I think one difficulty I overlooked is that you are trying to do this without Stillness. That definitely toughens things up!

I am fairly confident that when you get jailed, you drop all your temp items at the spot where you were caught. Therefore, you can't use jail as a shortcut if you want to keep what you are carrying.

[Arcanesoul]

You're just having bad luck, keep at it. I think one difficulty I overlooked is that you are trying to do this without Stillness. That definitely toughens things up!

I am fairly confident that when you get jailed, you drop all your temp items at the spot where you were caught. Therefore, you can't use jail as a shortcut if you want to keep what you are carrying.

That's what I thought initially too, but I when I went to break some boxes, I found I still had the temp items. You only seem to drop them on death. I'll check again if I don't get to do Tanihwa tonight again.

[Phraust]

Sorry, Stupid question, If everyone in your group is level 1 and you fight the "Drop NMs" is the NM locked at 80 or say, level 5 or something? If this was previously asked, I'm sorry BG's search fucking blows.

[Gergall]

Shortcut from reading here, seems to bring the papetries closer to the front of the maze, although I'm not positive about this.

Nope, no affect on Papeterie locations.

Shortcut causes one "Rusty Well" and one "Rickety Ladder" to appear somewhere in the maze. There are probably about 8 possible spawn locations for them, and they always seem to be at dead ends.

As soon as you find one, you can click on it to instantly transport to the other. You can do this back and forth an unlimited number of times and you can carry items through it.

Shortcut is lame when both the ladder and the well spawn on the first map. However, it is really convenient when one is on first map and one is on the second map.

Random tips:

1) I like to sub RNG, widescan the Terrormonger, and track it for the entire duration of the run. I always know what direction the terrormonger is in, and can pinpoint its exact location on the map extremely quickly.

Edit: I like to tell myself that RNG trait "Alertness" is helping in some way.

2) The goblin digger can be fooled by the Satchet of Wood (should cause it to deaggro), but you can also just use a prism powder as the goblin is the only mob in the maze that is not true sight. The good thing about using invisible is that you can keep moving; satchet of wood costume makes you stand still.

Edit: THF main can probably use Hide on the goblin if you aren't doing Amnesiac's Trial

[Gergall]

Sorry, Stupid question, If everyone in your group is level 1 and you fight the "Drop NMs" is the NM locked at 80 or say, level 5 or something? If this was previously asked, I'm sorry BG's search fucking blows.

For voucher 7, the mob level is determined by the highest level member in your party. I'm not sure what the base level difference is when you don't use Might or Supreme Might. Maybe the NM will be 5, or maybe will be closer to 10.

I don't think it will work well, but feel free to try and let us know. Level 1 players have no hate tools, no shadows, etc. 75 is probably the easiest level to fight the NMs at because of JS merits, lvl 75 gear, and so on.

[Arcanesoul]

Nope, no affect on Papeterie locations.

Shortcut causes one "Rusty Well" and one "Rickety Ladder" to appear somewhere in the maze. There are probably about 8 possible spawn locations for them, and they always seem to be at dead ends.

As soon as you find one, you can click on it to instantly transport to the other. You can do this back and forth an unlimited number of times and you can carry items through it.

Shortcut is lame when both the ladder and the well spawn on the first map. However, it is really convenient when one is on first map and one is on the second map.

Random tips:

1) I like to sub RNG, widescan the Terrormonger, and track it for the entire duration of the run. I always know what direction the terrormonger is in, and can pinpoint its exact location on the map extremely quickly.

Edit: I like to tell myself that RNG trait "Alertness" is helping in some way.

2) The goblin digger can be fooled by the Satchet of Wood (should cause it to deaggro), but you can also just use a prism powder as the goblin is the only mob in the maze that is not true sight. The good thing about using invisible is that you can keep moving; satchet of wood costume makes you stand still.

Edit: THF main can probably use Hide on the goblin if you aren't doing Amnesiac's Trial

Ah, thanks. Nice tips.

Ok. Finally managed to duo Voucher 06 with no runes on with a friend. We finished with a minute to spare, and got 200 exp I think (umm. might have been 400...), and 40 marbles (this is definite). No screenshot since I play fullscreen, with no windower or anything. I didn't have any C.C points, and we got a moblin armour in the hoardbox, since I think I only handed in a beastcoin as an extra temp item. We both died at twice each in the maze.

I also tried to get the watcher to come get me from the bridge, but dia'ing the watcher does nothing but make it freeze for a second. I don't think the dot from dia even takes effect on anything in the maze. My friend did get caught by one though when searching for the final papetrie. I only remembered to ask him about losing the temp items when we got out of the maze, but he thinks he still had them, although he's not 100% sure.

So yeah, looks like a lot of the runes we're adding are taking marbles away. Voucher 06 with no runes is 40 marbles.

[Gergall]

Great work! Unless there's a hard cap on max marbles, I hope to have some really impressive numbers in the near future ^^

Suggestion: Add in as much 100-104 as you can, take out 094. Stillness is probably a penalty, but it makes things MUCH easier so I think it's worth it.

That's what I'll be trying soon.

[Gergall]

Voucher 6 with 016 (res), 100, 101, 103, 104
3 extra treasures returned: beastcoin, slime juice, zinc ore
Time remaining at finish: 7 minutes

Marbles: 46

With CC points that would come out to 46+138 = 184

Edit: Does anyone know what Rune 112: Obscured Entrance does?

[Julian]

I just tried out my first BST solo on aquan rune. Timed out with 2 mobs left, like 1 more minute and I would have won, was really my fault for going in under prepared. I had a really bad mischarm at the beginning (3x in a row..) which lead to a link (my fault, didn't realize crabs in there linked) and eventual death, I reraised and started fighting again right away, but no luck :/ Lost quite a bit of valuable melee-with-pet time there.

Next time, I'll be bringing some juice, and gonna sub rdm for dispel, and see how that goes.

Question: Should I bother with waiting to accumulate CC for these kinds of runs?

[Gergall]

Question: Should I bother with waiting to accumulate CC for these kinds of runs?

The CC crate is worth half the main crate multipled by the number of CC points.

For argument's sake lets say that the run you are doing is worth 10 marbles.

If you were to do this run every day, you would obviously average 10 marbles per day.

If you were to wait 48 hours (3 CC points), you would get 10 + 10*0.5*3 = 25. That would be 25 every 2 days = 12.5 per day (improvement, woot).

If you were to wait 72 hours (6 CC points), you would get 10 + 10*0.5*6 = 40. That would be 40 every 3 days = 13.3 per day (more improvement, woot).

So for max marbles, you do want to wait 72 hours between runs. However, even as a marble whore myself, I occasionally go with 0 CC points because I want to have some fun, or I run with 5 CCs because waiting a few more hours doesn't fit my schedule.

One other thing to consider - you are still getting the hang of this. I actually suggest you do a few more runs as soon as you can (0 CCs) to get used to it, then you can build up CC points for faster marbles. One thing my math above doesn't show is that if you build up 6 CCs and then fail the mission, you're going to get pissed off!

[Suiram]

If you go with more than one person, the best (although not practical for everyone) schedule would be going every two days, an hour before JP midnight and then again after. That way you still use your maze every day, but half your runs have 2 C.C. points as well.