Israeli Air Strike

[Zilong]

Then why the fuck do they even exist?

Just disband the whole damn thing, use that building and whatever else US is accommodating for commercial purpose and odds are it'd have more beneficial effect to the state of the world than just a bullshit tea party of people pretending that they actually matters.

[Kuya]

I find it most humorous to see Americans bitch about the UN having no teeth as if sovereign nations, including the US, would honestly put themselves in a position of inferiority to a foreign body. Yes, the strongest country in the world, and its people are complaining that the UN has no teeth.

edit: Do you honestly think the US government would allow a UN with teeth to get in its way? Or any first world nation for that matter?

[Deftscythe]

The UN could propose some embargoes and other sanctions; it would just have to pass the security counc... oh, right.

[Elvis]

The UN is only as 'good' as the world powers allow it to be. The relationship between the UN and the various member-States has to be built on reciprocity but that will *never* ever happen.

The US, China and Russia are all fighting for resource supremacy. Britain is just tagging along.

This is how the world works. How can we expect our government to make "moral" decisions on the affairs of other countries, let alone our client States?

Just think back to the Indonesian occupation of East Timor. I think that ended in 2000? It had gone on for at least 20 years (it may be less).

Anyways, we didn't stop them did we? We supported them. This is right through the Clinton years.

And then there's the obvious case of our support for White South Africa (Afrikaans[sp]?). Oh and our support for the barely de-Nazified West Germany after WW2.

Plenty of other examples. Individuals have morals and ethics.

It's when people converge into these 'groups'/institutions that those morals fall to the wayside. It's run like any business.

All of this stuff is very interesting if not fucking depressing.

There are people reporting that the civilian death count may be closer to 50% now since the UN has excluded all deaths of male Palestinians.

Oh and here's a BBC report on the IDF Youtube Channel.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7809371.stm

Israel made a YouTube channel to basically document their "surgical precision." The BBC ran a story on one such video. The Israeli account of the video in question is that it was a Hamas supply truck. It turned out to be :

It turned out, however, that a 55-year-old Gaza resident named Ahmed Sanur, or Samur, claimed that the truck was his and that he and members of his family and his workers were moving oxygen cylinders from his workshop.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/image..._sanur_226.jpg

This workshop had been damaged when a building next door was bombed by the Israelis and he was afraid of looters, he said.

The Israeli human rights group B'Tselem put Mr Sanur's account on its website, together with a photograph of burned out oxygen cylinders.

Mr Sanur said that eight people, one of them his son, had been killed. He subsequently told the Israeli newspaper Haaretz: "These were not Hamas, they were our children... They were not Grad missiles.".

The Israeli response was that the "materiel" was being taken from a site that had stored weapons. The video remains on You Tube.

But the incident shows how an apparently definitive piece of video can turn into something much more doubtful.

[Elvis]

NSFW:

LiveLeak.com - RAW (Graphic): Scene After IDF Attack In Gaza 1/1/09

[Vajra]

NSFW:

LiveLeak.com - RAW (Graphic): Scene After IDF Attack In Gaza 1/1/09

HOLY SHIT OMFG...makes me angry, and im not even from there omg............................................... ...............................

[Kuya]

NSFW:

LiveLeak.com - RAW (Graphic): Scene After IDF Attack In Gaza 1/1/09

They killed so many kids...

[Meat]

What did you think happened during war? Anyway looks like they're calling up reserves, go me

[Deftscythe]

You say that like war were a hurricane or something. As if Israel and the Palestinians were having a picnic, looked up into a cloudy sky and said "oh damn, war is here, better start bombing."

[Elvis]

This is not a war it's a massacre. Weren't Israeli spokespeople saying that Hamas was their Al Qaeda (they are crooks but they are not Al Qaeda)? This is just another example of Imperialism and Neo-Colonialism.

It's no secret by now that Egypt was refusing Gazans entry when they were seeking refuge there due to the blockade. Or that Egyptian officials were telling Hamas security that there would be no air-strike and then boom there is. It was a big surprise.

This bullshit comes right after Gaza had been blockaded for all this time. It was already a humanitarian crisis. Now it's worse.

So what was the point of all of this? Doesn't the MSM here tell us that it's the Palestinians who are terrorists and don't want peace? Complete bullshit.

Who broke the truce? Israel, by bombing the tunnels.

The Qassam rockets have killed how many people in 8 years? 15-20. I'm sure the 4th most powerful military in the world could have handled this without such heavy civilian deaths.

Even the IDF admits the rocket threat was overestimated:
IDF admits to overestimating Gaza rocket severity, but warns worst may be yet to come - Haaretz - Israel News

So fucking stupid how they say the 'worst is yet to come'. No shit the worst is yet to come, when you kill peoples families and friends. What do you expect?

The point was to induce another ethnic cleansing and to keep the Palestinians marginalized and radicalized. If Israel stomps out any chance of a political Islam then it will justify the continued violence. Which in-turn is to make life so unbearable for the Native population that they simply pack up and leave.

[Kuya]

What did you think happened during war? Anyway looks like they're calling up reserves, go me

Yet, when the US does this, at the very least they keep their attacks as precise as possible. It's almost as if the Israeli army doesn't care about the civilians it's killing.

[Elvis]

1000 Lebanese civilians died in the 2006 Israel-Lebanon War. I'm kind of surprised with the world-wide outrage over this latest catastrophuck. Maybe it's change we can believe in!? Jk.

[Churchill]

What did you think happened during war? Anyway looks like they're calling up reserves, go me

I hope you die.

[archibaldcrane]

A girl I used to work with is from Israel, and she's living there now. She's extremely worried she's about to get drafted, and there's a very good chance she will be. (All Israelis are required to have a year of military service, and apparently are all eligible to be drafted if necessary afterwards.)

[Elvis]

She should do this:

YouTube - Israeli Conscientious Objectors, Shministim, Send letter www.december18th.org

One of the girls is the daughter of ex-Chief of Mossad or something.

[Kuya]

Does the US military have a policy of attacking their targets even if there are numerous civilians nearby? It was my understanding that the US avoided doing so as often as possible. You know, that the US doesn't condone killing innocent people just to get at their targets, at least not if they can help it.

[archibaldcrane]

Considering she already did her year of obligation like 7 years ago, I doubt she'd have much of a leg to stand on to all of a sudden claim conscientious objector.

Also, I don't really know much about how she feels about the whole situation, I haven't talked to her in a long time - just heard about the draft threat through a friend.

The thing that kind of pisses me off, is that these are Israeli territories. Meaning, unless I'm wrong, that their safety is...the responsibility of Israel, right?

If this Hamas target happened to be in Israel proper, embedded in Israeli citizens, there's no way they'd use the same type of civilian-killing method of attack.

[donnie]

so they bombed a mosque allegedly having weapons stacked inside, why would they wait for prayer time where many people are inside to bomb at that precise 5min ,,,,

meh, it doesnt change anything anyways. They were killing Palestinian teenagers who were throwing stones back in the day. so nothing can actually top that now lol

[Kuya]

If this Hamas target happened to be in Israel proper, embedded in Israeli citizens, there's no way they'd use the same type of civilian-killing method of attack.

I don't know of any nation that could justify using force when it is known civilians are nearby, especially when said civilians are your civilians. Imagine the shitstorm; a government wiping out countless numbers of its civilians just to get at a couple of terrorists. Of course, the logic for the Israeli military must be that: better 100 Palestinians to a single Israeli, even if the 100 Palestinians were just civilians. Naturally, even the US military understands that such wanton disregard for human life would not go well, but for some reason, the Israeli government feels it can bare the scrutiny more than the US thinks it can.

[Meat]

Yet, when the US does this, at the very least they keep their attacks as precise as possible. It's almost as if the Israeli army doesn't care about the civilians it's killing.

Not true at all, we drop flyers, sound bombs and go as far as calling homes when an attack in impending