Sorcerer's Ring

[stewie]

So, on wiki it says there was testing done on BG that said Back and Right Ring slots don't affect the latent. Is this true? And, could someone link me to the thread the data was posted on? I couldn't find it with search.

[drwaffles]

Right Ring most certainly can be used to trigger it - I use Vivian Ring for it and I can assure you it works just fine.

[stewie]

You use Vivian Ring for nukes? They're saying if you keep it on to stay in latent range.

[Pendulum]

Not referring to HP-down, it means a +HP item (like prism cape) when nuking doesn't affect your latent HP. Testing was done by Suiram.

I don't really go in to the calculations much myself, if i wear nuking gear and am yellow when I take Zenith Mitts off, it works

[stewie]

Alright, thank you.

[pchan]

Yes I can confirm it for the back slot. When nuking with Gleenmann's cape (HP+20) or Aslan (this one makes no sense though, but HP-20) the HP is unchanged. So the hp required is something like :

floor( 0.76*(base HP -/+ [ HP from gear excluding convert and those 2 specific slots..]))

Can still use aslan and Vivian/serket for HP reduction though.

[barber2006]

oh lawd yes.....can use some of those einherjar points I have lying around instead of plunking down big money on ixion cape. A good day

[Chadamius]

Guess a little more information on what he's looking for would help us.

I've been playing BLM with Sorc. Ring for awhile.

Here's a bit of info that may help. Or may not..

Some gear is +HP and some gear is -HP. These pieces will effect your total HP. And will also change your <hpp>. (Hit point percentage.) And could possibly take you out of your latent. Or put you into your latent.

Now.... Convert MP>HP gear is different. This gear doesn't behave the same as straight +HP or straight -hp when it comes to the latent.

When nuking in convert gear you can actually be over the ~75% and get latent to work.

When you type in <hpp>... It appears that you are over the latent. But infact the convert gear doesn't go fully against your max HP. So you may see 76-77% (When wearing Zmitts.) and still get the latent to work.

[Arthars]

1. go into your "HP down" gear
2. go into your nuke gear
3. remove all nuking HP > MP gear(eg zenith)
4. yellow HP?
5. if yes, profit!!! stick to step 2. gears to nuke and ignore step 6
6. if no, reduce more HP at step 1.

fuck the theory and calculations, it makes head explode. you just want the damn ring to work!

[Chadamius]

True that in most cases.

Only time it's nice to be @ latent and still have white HP is when around undead.

Like if you solo/duo NW Appolyon.

For some BLM's that don't care.. If it works it's good. That's fine.

But some take jobs to a different level. Nothing wrong with doing calculations.

[Narse]

I find it easiest to just test it outside Jeuno by using latent >> nuke gear. If it works, cast regen for a tic and then drop it and repeat and you'll get a 5 digit variant of what your latent is with your nuke gear, and from there you can even get more finely tuned by taking damage and such or using poison potions. For me, I know my latent kicks in at 647 HP when /RDM, and doesn't at 648, and my latent gear brings me to exactly 647 HP (without food up) and I don't have to worry about if it 'should' be working according to calculations and shit and this slot counting or not counting. I've tested it, and it works, and if my gear changes my HP later on down the road then I'll recheck it, only takes like 5min.

[Suiram]

The reason the calculations are important is because if you are near the cutoff, simply using "yellow" HP might be misleading, or might cause you to misjudge the amount of -HP you need to force.

Just to take an extreme example as illustration, let's suppose you nuke in gear that has no HP change except that for whatever reason you wear a Gigant Mantle, and that you have 980 max HP in that gear. Yellow HP is going to happen at 734 HP or lower, but because Gigant Mantle isn't used in the calculation for latent, you won't get the ring's effect because it doesn't trigger until 683 HP.

For people who are seriously averse to doing any calculations of any kind whatsoever, doing Narse's Jeuno Test method is best, and preferable even to the "yellow HP" thing. If you don't mind doing some subtracting and multiplying, my last post in the thread someone linked above I think I gave a pretty simple (I hope) step-by-step method for just doing the math on it to see what you need.

[Arthars]

gigant is +80 HP

that bring your max HP to 1080(obviously) if your HP is 1000

so your latent need to cater for 75% of 1080 for it to work

so that makes it 810/1080 for your ring to work

and if you remove your gigant and cast at 810/1000, your latent will not work

as of now, its not about the calculations. for ring to work you need 75% of max HP. this is fact

things you need to know is not the calculation. its about +HP -HP items VS HP Convert to MP items

summary:
+hp or -hp items affacts your maximum HP. 1000 + 80 = 1080 max HP. 1000-20 = 980 max HP

HP convert to MP items DOES NOT AFFACT YOUR MAX HP. 1000 max HP with serket ring(50 HP > MP) = 950 HP(max HP still 1000). 1000 max HP with cassie earring(50MP > HP) = 1050 HP(max HP still 1000)

so for your ring to work, you must have 75% HP of your max HP when your spell LANDS.

assuming you have 1000 max HP:
1. nuking @810/1080 will trigger latent with gigant equipped
but if you remove your gigant mid way casting, becoming 810/1000, it WILL NOT trigger latent

2. Nuking @ 750/1000 will trigger latent
but if you equip a zenith mitten, making you 750/950, it WILL trigger latent

holy fuck why am i going into math.

Its not about ring doesnt work with back/ringpenis slots

but its about you understanding 75% of max HP using -HP, +HP and HP convert MP items

and also dont go into perfect 75% because when you SJ WHM, shit will happen and your ring will be so-called "Broken"

[pchan]

assuming you have 1000 max HP:
1. nuking @810/1080 will trigger latent with gigant equipped
but if you remove your gigant mid way casting, becoming 810/1000, it WILL NOT trigger latent

Nope and that's exactly what people are saying in this thread. With or without gigant mantle equipped, the critical HP for sorcerer is 759.

[Kimkytaru]

Ok Suiram if you read this can you tell me if it's suppose to work or not the way I use it ?

I'm using for nuking :

HQ Staff, Phantom
AF hat, Elemental torque/Uggalepih, Moldavite, Novio
Igqira, Zenith (50 HP to MP), Sorcerer, Omega
Gleeman's (-20 MP +20 HP), Penitent (-20 HP), Mahatma, AF boots (shhh ok I know)

So yeah My HP with that setup is 722
Now when I use my Yellow HP stuff it goes down to 539 which if I understood things right are more than 75% of 722 (which is 541.5)

But seeing what you wrote it would mean that I should base my calculation on something else, something like this : 722 -20 +50 +20 which would be 772 * 0.75% = 579

Would be cool to know if I understood the things right or not XD

[Massimo]

Ok Suiram if you read this can you tell me if it's suppose to work or not the way I use it ?

I'm using for nuking :

HQ Staff, Phantom
AF hat, Elemental torque/Uggalepih, Moldavite, Novio
Igqira, Zenith (50 HP to MP), Sorcerer, Omega
Gleeman's (-20 MP +20 HP), Penitent (-20 HP), Mahatma, AF boots (shhh ok I know)

So yeah My HP with that setup is 722
Now when I use my Yellow HP stuff it goes down to 539 which if I understood things right are more than 75% of 722 (which is 541.5)

But seeing what you wrote it would mean that I should base my calculation on something else, something like this : 722 -20 +50 +20 which would be 772 * 0.75% = 579

Would be cool to know if I understood the things right or not XD

Looks like you'll need a maximum of 564 HP, unless my calculations are incorrect. This should also put you in white HP, to avoid undead aggro etc.

Take your 722 HP, add 50 (Zenith) and take away 20 (Gleeman's). This leaves you with 752 as your *real* max HP.

752 * 0.75% = 564


Edit: Actually, should be able to trigger the ring at 570(571?) HP.

[Kimkytaru]

so penitent rope that substract 20 HP all the time dont count ?

[Massimo]

so penitent rope that substract 20 HP all the time dont count ?

It's only the back piece that's left out, not the waist.

[Kimkytaru]

ok thx I'll try with your number then and I'll see ^^

[Pendulum]

Only time it's nice to be @ latent and still have white HP is when around undead.

Or around any other mage that just WILL NOT LISTEN, even after you've politely said so 3 times after being cured. My latent HP puts me at 79%, don't want to think how often I'd have cure 4s (for about 220HP) thrown at me if I nuked with yellow HP. Have no problem repeatedly switching to latent HP for a PLD though.

Only thing I'd like to improve my HP-down macro is zenith head/legs so i can get rid of stupid stuff like gold hairpin and fasting ring