Street Fighter IV

[Ramor]

i'm loving viper, but i can't beat a guile to save my fucking life

edit: i think i'm going to have to do nothing but play viper from now on if i ever hope to be good with her, i'll maybe make juri my secondary (or tertiary, dictator's just so god damn cool even though i seem to suck with him lately), octo tomorrow we'll get a few games in maybe? once i get my xbawks totally workan and all

[Deejay]

Listen, I already established you don't know what you're talking about. No matter how long you make your post, it boils down to "Don't get hit, LOL INSTANT WIN"

Well geewiz numbnuts, no fucking shit, I guess no one tried that before.

and you bitching about seth's life bar not being high enough for your scrub ass is straight knowledge bro

"Real players know how to stack the odds and don't rely on 50/50"...or whatever stupid shit you said, I'm trying my best to repress it lest it infect me... is so far beyond wrong I can't even fathom it...you're actually trying to tell me that most mixup games don't boil down to 50/50? and at the end of the day you're essentially relying on that to win?

What the fuck mixup games are you talking about? Name a scenario in this game that is always a 50/50 guess. If you cannot, then your whole argument is flawed because matches never boil down to a 50/50 "mix up". learn to properly zone and option select and you'll rarely be in a situation where you're at an uneven risk.

Protip: If you're blindly guessing to win a match, then you're doing it wrong. Idiot.

What the fuck are they using then? MAGIC? They must be, to be able to do these magic mixups that you claim "stack the odds in their favor"...but only if you know what's up.

Theres plenty of ways to make your opponent guess while having all of the percentages stacked in your favor. I mean shit, theres a fucking sticky'd guide for safe jumping / option selects on the first page of the seth section of the srk boars. god damn

but i guess that's all considered MAGIC!?!11 to an whining moron like you

seriously... every sf4 tier list made to date has seth somewhere in the top 10 and you're here bitching about how he's broken? give me a fucking break and qq moar retard

[Darus Grey]

lol dude, just stop talking already. No one is buying it. You lost all credibility when you starting talking about the OS sticky on srk... had you actually read it you'd realize what a moron you are(it works against only a few members of the cast, everyone else can spam reversal it...lol).

Seriously you're fucking stupid, stop pretending like you know shit cause people who actually do can see right through you.

edit:

Oh, and if you didn't know, they raised Seth's health in SSF4 because of the touch of death issue. Why? cause he was BROKEN...hows it feel to be wrong? Though really, I'm not enjoying this back and forth at all, way too easy, so I'll end this "argument" here. lulz.

[octopus]

There are some things that I don't agree with in Deejay's statement above, but he's more right than wrong here. There are ways you can force your opponent to make a 50/50 choice, and if they guess wrong they'll eat a big combo. And on offense what he's saying is that you don't go for the risky move all the time, to stack the odds in your favor. Train your opponent towards one way, and then your odds will improve.

[Hitoshura]

Someone crying about Seth being broken... is this really happening somewhere other than SRK?

[Darus Grey]

There are some things that I don't agree with in Deejay's statement above, but he's more right than wrong here. There are ways you can force your opponent to make a 50/50 choice, and if they guess wrong they'll eat a big combo. And on offense what he's saying is that you don't go for the risky move all the time, to stack the odds in your favor. Train your opponent towards one way, and then your odds will improve.

Right about what? I never disagreed with any of that, what I'm making fun of him for is his notion that "If you play it right" those 50/50s are somehow more than that, no, they're still 50/50... as if there was a magic playing style that changed that simple reality of most mixup games.

Or that "you don't get hit if you're playing right"...seriously dude deserves the DUH of the year award, "don't get hit! instant win!". Again, the reality is that even the best players get hit, often(see above...), and when you play a character that can be TOD'D by the majority of the cast off of *one* wrong guess... it's broken. Don't see how that is exactly controversial.

It's precisely the reason Ryu is the best character in the game, because he has a pretty even distribution of chances to get in vs the number of times he can let in.

[Ramor]

ryu is the best character because he has a shoryuken and tiger destruction

wait, no

[Weltall]

Sagat can turn around a match like no other....that ability makes him > Ryu, but Ryu is easily #2.

[Deejay]

ryu is the best character because he has a shoryuken and tiger destruction

wait, no

^

darus you've made it clear to everyone that you don't know what the fuck. i'm not the only one who's called bullshit on half the shit you've said over the last 2 pages.

so do us all favor and stop posting like a snobby jackass and this will all blow over bro. and besides, weltall does it better anyway

[Cephius]

As someone who played Zangief exclusively and could get perfected by even a mediocre Seth, I have a hard time believing that he's "broken" unless you mean in an "impossible for Gief to beat unless you suck" way

[Nitsuki]

last i remember Seth had an 8-2 advantage over gief, this was a way old tier list however.

[octopus]

Right about what? I never disagreed with any of that, what I'm making fun of him for is his notion that "If you play it right" those 50/50s are somehow more than that, no, they're still 50/50... as if there was a magic playing style that changed that simple reality of most mixup games.

What I meant was that you can train your opponent to favor one way of the 50/50, so that in clutch situations your opponent would more likely do one way over another, meaning the probability would increase and not be a 50/50 chance anymore.

As for Seth's health, I do agree that Capcom over-nerfed him in that regard. He's in no way "broken", however. While he may have some bad matchups, he can definitely still be competitive.

[Merovingian]

so after 6month i started playing sf4 again and holy shit, this shit has been degraded to ryu/ken and turtles. At least my cammy still more or less the same.

[Darus Grey]

^

darus you've made it clear to everyone that you don't know what the fuck. i'm not the only one who's called bullshit on half the shit you've said over the last 2 pages.

so do us all favor and stop posting like a snobby jackass and this will all blow over bro. and besides, weltall does it better anyway

Sorry dude..."I know you are but what am I"? that's pretty auto-fail. You don't even read what I say, so how you can call BS on anything is lulzworthy.

What I meant was that you can train your opponent to favor one way of the 50/50, so that in clutch situations your opponent would more likely do one way over another, meaning the probability would increase and not be a 50/50 chance anymore.

This is an example of gambler's fallacy, the probability is still 50/50. If you do a mixup that has 2 possible outcomes, they always have an equal chance at guessing right or wrong...that *never* changes.

As someone who played Zangief exclusively and could get perfected by even a mediocre Seth, I have a hard time believing that he's "broken" unless you mean in an "impossible for Gief to beat unless you suck" way

Seth dominates Gief, Balrog, Abel, and Feurte...but he is dominated by a lot more of the cast himself. The fact that has has those dominating matchups is the only reason people consider him good. Though Gief can ToD Seth... you pretty much have to beat gief on time, can't chip him to death in 99seconds and can't risk using arms for zoning lest he instant-reversal headbutt and instant-win.


Edit:

Seriously, I want someone to argue to me why a character who can be ToD'd by the majority of the cast is not broken... stop just throwing random arbitrary anecdotal shit about "I saw Seth whoop this dude one time" and tell me why a character who can make NO mistakes...EVER...is not only not bad, but TOP TIER? and this is the only character with this problem. So what if he can fucking instant-dizzy like 6 characters? he can't instant-KILL them can he?

I don't think you guys understand the sheer frustration of having to play a perfect match...every-time...and to play perfect for 90 seconds and then lose from FULL HEALTH...to a single mistake after you spent the entire time zoning, chipping, working hard to get in(because seth does piss-poor damage as well) and do significant damage.

From my point of view the concept that he's top tier is fucking retarded, and frankly the only thing that keeps that perception around is that no one plays him so his flaws arn't glaringly obvious to most players. In the real world, where I live, even the best players screw up or don't always guess right. Seriously that attitude fucking boggles me.

[octopus]

This is an example of gambler's fallacy, the probability is still 50/50. If you do a mixup that has 2 possible outcomes, they always have an equal chance at guessing right or wrong...that *never* changes.

That's only if you're playing a robot. Humans fall into this gambler's fallacy trap that you put him in and get affected by it.

Seriously, I want someone to argue to me why a character who can be ToD'd by the majority of the cast is not broken...

I don't think most of the cast can ToD Seth. 6 characters != most.

From my point of view the concept that he's top tier is fucking retarded, and frankly the only thing that keeps that perception around is that no one plays him so his flaws arn't glaringly obvious to most players. In the real world, where I live, even the best players screw up or don't always guess right. Seriously that attitude fucking boggles me.

I don't think Seth is top tier, that I can give you. But he is better than average IMO.

[Scunsion]

whos plays viper on live? need to practice dat match up

[octopus]

me! Will be on in an hour or so

[octopus]

Ouch, I think I was a good punching bag ;o I won a couple early but I think scun caught on to the tricks fast, lol

[Scunsion]

ya ggs yo

[Hitoshura]

^I added you and Weltall today, pretty crazy San Jo is only 2 hours away. Could probably get some very smooth matches. Anyone else care to cough up their PSN name for a few rounds?