SE's stance on Holding a HNM?

[Syntex]

Someone sounds bitter.

Na, just thought of it when I saw some linkshell take a while to kill KB.

[kamilus]

GM's won't do anything if an LS is holding something that rages.

They'll tell you that the game already has measures against holding that mob for a certain amount of time, they know it can be frustrating that an LS is holding an NM, they're sorry for any inconvenience, and are curious as to whether there is anything else they can assist you with?

For mobs that don't rage, chances are by the time you get them to answer your call, 30 mins to 2 hrs later, the offending LS has already gathered an army to take it down.

Not true. Depends if you are EU/NA or JP. JPs call GM against NA = sGM harrasing NAs.

[Likos]

Not true. Depends if you are EU/NA or JP. JPs call GM against NA = sGM harrasing NAs.

heh.. well I'm in one of the oldest JP linkshells on any server (90% of the ls is JP), and they tell us they get the same responses as us NA's get.

[Valyana]

Pretty sure we had a day with 2 Nidhogg on Ramuh a couple of years ago, before and after maint.

[Starr]

Didn't read thread but depends on the GM, some will ban you, some will just leave.

[Kirschy]

GM Policies were recently listed on the website and POL. While in the past different GMs would respond in different ways, it's a little more uniform than it used to be. Most GMs are considerate if you bring up the wording in the policies, but of course shit happens sometimes and a GM will not agree.

https://secure.playonline.com/ff11us/rule/policy.shtml

About Monster Holding:

Spoiler: show

Monster holding refers to an instance where a player or players hold a monster so that they continue to maintain claim on the monster. This is especially prevalent with monsters that a large amount of players are interested in, such as a notorious monster. In the cases where there are no signs of effort to defeat the monster, and instead the player(s) are simply holding claim over the monster for a long period of time with the aim of keeping control of it; this is considered a grief tactic.

Monster holding can also be defined as a player or group of players attempting to regulate the time that a monster appears by keeping it claimed with the intention to shift its spawn time by delaying its defeat.. Another example of monster holding would be a player or group of players holding a monster until their friends came to help. In these types of situations, the GM staff will perceive this as monster holding if it continues over an excessive amount of time. In an effort to maintain an enjoyable game environment, the GM staff will intervene and take the appropriate action as necessary in these types of situations.

Once a GM confirms whether monster holding is occurring or not, the GM will instruct the player to either engage the monster in combat in an attempt to defeat it or release the claim on the monster in question. Players that do not follow a GM's instructions will become subject to account disciplinary actions.

However, in August 2005 we introduced a counter-measure to excessive monster holding by making specific monsters more powerful after a certain amount of time has passed. GMs will no longer interfere with these particular monsters. Some examples of monsters like this are as follows:

King Arthro / Simurgh / Roc / Serket / Capricious Cassie / Lord of Onzozo / Behemoth / King Behemoth / Adamantoise / Aspidochelone / Fafnir / Nidhogg

At what point do you consider someone to be monster holding?
(This one specificalli mentions holding while members login.)

Spoiler: show

For example, some Notorious Monsters need a few hours and a large number of players to be taken down. Starting the battle at once is best, but sometimes due to several reasons, such as login timing etc, it might take time before all members arrive and actually start fighting the monster. In such case, we do not consider this monster holding.

[Snprphnx]

Didn't read thread but depends on the GM, some will ban you, some will just leave.

exactly.

some GMs will allow it, some won't. Friend of mine was jailed for holding a Knight Crab at KA camp, b/c he was preventing the natural pop of an NM.

[evilpaul]

GMs won't do squat regarding HNMs that rage like Kirschy posted and they won't do anything about KV holding because the spawn conditions are retarded.

CoP Wyrms and ToAU HNMs may be different.

[Jamofu]

Depends on the NM, ive seen people hold a rageable NM til rage and after rage without getting jailed at all. And KV without getting jailed.

But if you hold something like knight crabs preventing people from playing there game you can be jailed faster. There stance is if its rageable, wait for it to rage and you'll have a chance as well.

[sleekmotorwurkz]

Ive always been somewhat curious about their actual policy myself. As far as I recall, when they did the patch to say "we wont bother with holding calls about nms that rage", I remember the rule being Holding mobs to gather troops is ok, holding mobs to push back the time isnt.

I have called a gm on a few shells holding... example doing 0-1% damage on tiamat every 30 min. They didnt do anything of course because people were "waiting for members." However we got gmed by a bst linkshell for holding sandworm for less then 20 min to gather people, and the gm told us to start damage or we would be removed from the zone. I think its pretty much just up to the GM's disgression what they want to do.

[The Blackrose]

GMs won't do squat regarding HNMs that rage like Kirschy posted and they won't do anything about KV holding because the spawn conditions are retarded.

CoP Wyrms and ToAU HNMs may be different.

Actually, it depends on the GM. Unfortunately, we've had a bad streak of GMs on Carbuncle due to another linkshell calling GMs on KV no matter what (doesn't matter if they were first in force, don't have enough people, etc). They have forced to kill within a time limit on more than one occasion.

Which is funny because when the GM gets called on them, they get a fair pass. This game's inconsistency is so glaringly obvious sometimes.

[Kurt Cobain]

Pretty sure we had a day with 2 Nidhogg on Ramuh a couple of years ago, before and after maint.

fraid not

[FallingHigher]

Yeah it does seriously depend on what GM you get.

A while ago last year a friend of mine in another HNMLS was camping KV and had been holding with a RDM for less than an hour. Whilist waiting on members to gather for the kill he received a /tell from a GM telling him to either attempt to kill, or pass over the claim. The only other people that were there camping besides himself and his RDM friend were two others (a DRK and a WHM I believe). In the end my friend was given an ultimatum by the GM, because he ended up wiping when he was unable to wait for the right amount of people he needed and had to attempt to kill with what he had gathered, so it ended up de-popping after.

It was glaringly obvious the person/s who had called the GM were the DRK and WHM (as I said, they were the only other people there) who had lost claim and were probably feeling butthurt about it. Point being what the GM shouldn't have done, is to force my friend's shell to try killing with insufficent forces. Now what the GM should've said to the pair who made the call is that unless they had a party or alliance of their own there at camp and ready to kill, there would be nothing the GM would be able do.

Some GMs just aren't clued up, so consider yourself lucky if you get a non-retarded one.

[Alistaire]

GMs won't do squat regarding HNMs that rage like Kirschy posted and they won't do anything about KV holding because the spawn conditions are retarded.

CoP Wyrms and ToAU HNMs may be different.

I've been GM'd about KV and have also successfully GM'd another group on it. When we were GM'd the GM gave us 30 minutes to start doing damage or gtfo. I told the person talking to the GM to try to extend that because at the 30 minute mark was the start of night-time, and the GM allowed us till morning game time.

So basically anything that doesn't rage is entirely possible for a GM to step in, and they can tell you to make "progress" on it, telling them "we're bio'ing it" doesn't count for much in my experience.

[Tekki]

This was a year or so ago.


He never responded after that.

[Max™]

"You must do damage."

*giggles and casts Holy*

'Thank you for giving me an excuse to use Holy more, now I will tell my LS a GM told me too!'

[evilpaul]

July 2007:
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/477...0393800gn4.jpg
GM Emdub was retarded for other people here I remember too. I'm not sure about what though specifically.

I still miss those guys:
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/306...6500700wh1.jpg
lolskyrmt

And while I was digging through my old screenshots, anyone translate this?
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/937...5254500gm6.jpg
I couldn't find any GM convos about KV or one talking in /say there. I don't think I actually called one myself on somebody about KV. (Probably because I don't care about KV. lol) It was either an LS leader calling one or being talked to by one when somebody else called for holding.

[Althaluls]

And while I was digging through my old screenshots, anyone translate this?

I think they're asking if you want fish.

Yao bu yao, 要不要 = want
yu, 鱼 = fish
le, 了 = particle

Then again, pinyin can be annoying, especially when your Chinese is already limited

[Zelfire]

For the record a few years ago the Ramuh HNM LS Darkhearts got Niddy twice in one day. One was before maintenance killed it just in time before servers came down and then once server came up it was up and they got it again. So it can happen but its rare as fuck for it to happen. No i wasn't told it happened i was there and saw it myself.