Kotaku: Hundreds Of Players Banned In Final Fantasy XI

[Kenji]

This zam shit really is getting annoying. If people truly think SE had no knowledge of this exploit prior to November then they're scarily naive about this company.

When you have proof of your claims, feel free to provide them.

[Kohan]

ive lost all respect for any gaming publication

DON'T SAY THAT I LIKE MY PAYCHECKS

Well, unless you're talking about Kotaku. And other losers. Then it's okay. I don't write for them.

[Correction]

When you have proof of your claims, feel free to provide them.

Kaeko already posted ample evidence SE knew about this for over a year. We're not here to do your reading for you.

[Aymee]

/ZAM!

'OMG IF YOU NEED GOOD GEAR UR AN ELITIST SUCK IT'

That's not remotely what I said. The elitist bit comes from Devek thinking that people are justified in cheating because SE made Salvage hard... and that was the justification offered by people throughout this entire discussion starting in November. Way to pay attention.

It's perfectly possible to be an elitist and work hard for it all. Duh.

If you told me a way I could cheat to get 100 million gil, I wouldn't do it because the risk is not worth it and the fact that I could reasonably earn 100 million gil myself within the next year.

Show me a cheat to finish my Usukane gear? I would be all over it, because I most likely will never be able to do that. The fact is, people who would otherwise never cheat duped salvage gear. That is not a coincidence.

So you have no beef with working hard to get a relic (~100M) the normal legit way, but you consider Salvage duping perfectly fine. Uh... huh. As for your statement that time = money, let me remind you that this is a video game. Don't take yourself too seriously, hm?

[Correction]

Devek thinking that people are justified in cheating because SE made Salvage hard... Way to pay attention.

It's fun being lectured on my attention span from someone who can't tell the difference between blind justification and offering a logical reason for the widespread use of the exploit beyond the stereotypical 'entitled elitism' that so many have repetitively harped about.

[Devek]

That's not remotely what I said. The elitist bit comes from Devek thinking that people are justified in cheating because SE made Salvage hard...

Repeat after me.... salvage isn't hard.

Salvage isn't hard.

I've considered trying to train a monkey to do salvage for me, it is that easy. You blow through it with 6 people. The strategies are outlined clearly on the wiki.

Salvage isn't hard, it is unreasonable. 2 hours of your life every day down the drain for something you may likely never see.. at least with kings you can go afk to do laundry and other stuff.

If SE would actually give us something hard to do for the gear, I wouldn't mind.

[Kerberoz]

Hard, unreasonable, whatever. It doesn't give you the right to decide that you're worthy of getting your gear faster/with less work than others.

[Devek]

It isn't up to me what the majority of people will do in any given situation, but I can usually predict it.

Locks keep honest people honest, so does food.

[Kenji]

Kaeko already posted ample evidence SE knew about this for over a year. We're not here to do your reading for you.

Not from where I am sitting. But if you can't pull up relevant information to support your claim, then I understand why you don't do so. If you can, I will cheerfully admit I was wrong.

[Kaeko]

I can tell you that it was REPORTED about a year ago or before. Now if "SE" (being the higher ups that make real decisions) actually knew about I don't think any of us know. Just because you report something doesn't mean it gets handled.

[Devek]

I can tell you that it was REPORTED about a year ago or before. Now if "SE" (being the higher ups that make real decisions) actually knew about I don't think any of us know. Just because you report something doesn't mean it gets handled.

So much retarded shit gets reported to SE that it probably all gets wasted. I ran into this problem way back in the day when dealing with another exploit in the game, and it took a long time to get it reported and fixed(and I am not even sure if my reports had anything to do with it.)

I imagine their email inbox is full of "MMM IS TOO EXPENSIVE!" and shit that anything that is relevant gets lost in the trash.

[stewie]

Are you going to be quitting Kaeko if you don't get your account back?

[Septimus]

Square went ape-shit and unleashed the ban cannons all over people duping in Salvage. I am not saying that duping in Salvage is good, I don't even like Salvage, think that it is the biggest piece of shit event in the game, and hope that the people who designed it are plagued with nightmares about tentacle monsters having a party with their delicate parts for all eternity. I think that the people who don't get why so many people are upset is that Square goes ape-shit over duping in Salvage, but still does fucking nothing (or next to it) about botting and gil-buying. How about pos-hacking and flee-hacking? You would think that fixing that shit would have been a huge priority as well, but it took them forever to make an automated system to deal with it. To reiterate, it is not that they were too harsh on the dupe bug, just that they have not done jack-shit about every fucking other exploit that they let go on for ever and ever and don't give a fuck about.

In summation, because people are dumb, hate Salvage and never do it, tentacal monster nighmares for the devs who thought it up, irrational response compared to other shit that has been going on for years and they do nothing about.

I can tell you that it was REPORTED about a year ago or before. Now if "SE" (being the higher ups that make real decisions) actually knew about I don't think any of us know. Just because you report something doesn't mean it gets handled.

If something huge like this didn't get sent up the chain of command, then it is an even larger failure on Square's part than if they knew about the situation and ignored it. The point is that you are supposed to stop exploits before they number in the low dozens so you don't have to ban people by the hundreds.

[Ashira]

Are you going to be quitting Kaeko if you don't get your account back?

Kanican

[mallister]

To reiterate, it is not that they were too harsh on the dupe bug, just that they have not done jack-shit about every fucking other exploit that they let go on for ever and ever and don't give a fuck about.

If something huge like this didn't get sent up the chain of command, then it is an even larger failure on Square's part than if they knew about the situation and ignored it. The point is that you are supposed to stop exploits before they number in the low dozens so you don't have to ban people by the hundreds.

this, 100%. thank you bastard-man.

[Kuya]

Square-Enix's failure... this sounds familiar somehow.

[Olo401]

Meh.. G4 can suck my sweaty left nut.

[Kenji]

I can tell you that it was REPORTED about a year ago or before. Now if "SE" (being the higher ups that make real decisions) actually knew about I don't think any of us know. Just because you report something doesn't mean it gets handled.

This. And I should add, that if people really wanted to make sure SE fixed this, all they had to do was detail the secret in every forum they came across. Make a big issue out of it.

Because no players did this, then it means they weren't really serious about wanting it fixed. I do understand why; human greed is powerful. So no player wanted this exploit fixed, and thus everyone who is banned rightly deserved it.

If something huge like this didn't get sent up the chain of command, then it is an even larger failure on Square's part than if they knew about the situation and ignored it. The point is that you are supposed to stop exploits before they number in the low dozens so you don't have to ban people by the hundreds.

Having worked for a large corporation, I can tell you that this is par for the course. One of my jobs, I was in a department that sent data to our customers. We had to get that data from our engineers, who would prepare the documents and send them to us. For years, engineering had been mostly consistantly late, and the data packaged badly, that caused our customers to reject it.

It took THREE years before upper management finally got the message that the problem wasn't in our department, but in engineering. And took several months before new procedures were instituted. However, by the time I left, the problem still hadn't been cleared up.

The bigger an institution or company is, the slower things move. That's just reality. So refusing to accept that, is refusing to accept reality; a dangerous path to start walking on.

I can still blame SE for being slow, but I do understand why.

[Yugl]

This. And I should add, that if people really wanted to make sure SE fixed this, all they had to do was detail the secret in every forum they came across. Make a big issue out of it.

Because no players did this, then it means they weren't really serious about wanting it fixed. I do understand why; human greed is powerful. So no player wanted this exploit fixed, and thus everyone who is banned rightly deserved it.

Posts on BG were made, but they were quickly removed by mods. It's understandable that they didn't post on other forums considering how close or tight people are to BG as opposed to other forums (See BG v Allah arguments).

[ronin sparthos]

People covered it up and that is most likely why the bans were even handed out in such a ruthless fashion. SE got fucked with and with endgame basically daring them to do something, they had little choice but to be heavyhanded.

It goes without saying that had the people using the dupe glitch just let it become mainstream, the punishment might have just been limited to huge temp bans and confiscation of gear.