AV video solved? - Torque Theory Only

[Maxxthepenguin]

This is the main thread about the new theory and things directly relevant to it. Other AV discussion can gtfo

[Neosutra]

The ability being readied just gave the people warning time to think, "Hey, this isn't my ability I need to mirror, so I won't waste my 2 hour and have to reset it in our Square-Enix god-mode." Thererfore only 1 Red Mage and 2 others who apparently weren't paying attention used their respective 2 hours.

This is a pretty wild assumption.

[Lonewind]

This Torque theory stems from a Dragoon mirroring Call Wyvern without a Love Torque equipped not sealing the ability. If you think about it, it makes no sense for Call Wyvern to even be sealable. By eliminating that single ability, you're stopping it from using Mijin Gakure, Astral Flow, and Familiar, which is unreasonable. Also take into account the fact that Absolute Virtue is a Dragoon in the first place, so that is actually its real 2 hour ability. I think the more reasonable explanation of that situation is that the Dragoon with Love Torque equipped did not seal Call Wyvern the first time, but Absolute Virtue just didn't use it. As I said before, the margin of error to prove that an ability is sealed would take several uses of every other 2 hour, otherwise it could just be coincidence.

I personally don't recall any DRG mobs that has ability to use 2hr uses Spirit Surge though, it seems the mobs are stuck at the Call Wyvern 2hr age, which I would assume AV is also. Hence the validity of Call Wyvern seal still stands.

Readies F-5 spam when actual testing starts.

On a side note: That wall-o-text derail was gone fast, thank you.

[Max™]

Restating an important but mistakenly trimmed point directly related to this theory: please note the conditions you perform this test under.

Take note if you broke the regen or not, take note of all actions which were performed during the testing, record it if possible.

We don't need it to get simply discarded because one group threw a bunch of DD's at AV and had people try to match 2hrs while wearing torques without knowing the conditions it happened under.


Saying: "We tried it and it didn't work" doesn't do anyone any good.

[thetruepandagod]

3 ix drg and 3 capes.... looks like we will only be able to try 1 AV this friday

[Neosutra]

Things we will do sat (I assume other people will test first):

1. Prolong JoL till it is only in phuobo mode to cut half of AVs regen.
2. Nuke AV with nuke of the day (in low an high nukes, not sure if it matters).
3. Have a designated blm(with prudence torque), Mnk(with faith), Drg(with love), and Pld(with justice) 2 hour when AV uses one of his 2 hours.

If doing #3 leads AV to still use those above 2 hours, then we will try mirroring the 2 hours on the next pop. If AV still uses 2 hours in both cases, I will assume that either the lock is not 100%, or the theory is invalid.

Feel free to suggest other crap.

[Ultimagi]

I personally don't recall any DRG mobs that has ability to use 2hr uses Spirit Surge though, it seems the mobs are stuck at the Call Wyvern 2hr age, which I would assume AV is also. Hence the validity of Call Wyvern seal still stands.

Readies F-5 spam when actual testing starts.

On a side note: That wall-o-text derail was gone fast, thank you.

What does this have to do with what I said? I never said Absolute Virtue used Spirit Surge, anyone who has ever fought it knows it uses Call Wyvern. My point remains valid that Call Wyvern should not be sealable.

[Ultimagi]

Neo, you might want to bring along a few more jobs, since Absolute Virtue can use 15 different abilities (12 if you kill Wynavs), the margin of error will remain very large if you only try to lock 4.

Edit: I can't count.

[Ultimagi]

Good luck, I hope your linkshell can survive Manafont. If you can figure out an efficient way, that would help everyone out a lot with being able to test stuff.

[Ramses]

http://www.bluegartr.com/forum/ffxi-...xperience.html

Read at least the op in that thread before posting here. Other than that, fealty drastically reduces meteor damage, not light resists. A pld can survive multiple meteors easily with fealty on. I would recommend shadowbinding, however, and getting out of range. In fact. shadowbind everything you can't handle. Shadowbind is the ONLY thing that sticks on AV and will last the entire duration. Bring 5 or 6 rngs and rotate them in and out of alliance while their timers refresh. AV CAN cast his air spells ANYTIME, not just after CS. Have 10 people to help absorb aeroga IV and use what barspells and resist gear you can. (For those that don't know, 10 is the cap on -ga spell reduction which reduces damage to 40% of single target. For example, a spell that does 1k damage to 1 target will do 400 damage to each of 10 targets.) These tips should help survivability while testing theories (hopefully the torque theory please).

Now I don't want to get into every detail of AV's behavior, but if you are attempting AV and have specific questions, post them. Oh yeah, and do break the regen. Kill 9-10 sets of jol pets and only nuke AV with the element of the current day.

[Lonewind]

What does this have to do with what I said? I never said Absolute Virtue used Spirit Surge, anyone who has ever fought it knows it uses Call Wyvern. My point remains valid that Call Wyvern should not be sealable.

Thing is the whole Torque theory came about with the sealing of Call Wyvern

I’ve fought AV dozens of times, and the only ability I’ve seen sealed with any consistency is Call Wyvern. However, there was one day where, for the first time, sealing Call Wyvern failed. At that time, we happened to be using a different Dragoon than we usually do, so thinking there was a hidden clue behind this slip-up, I compared the two and noticed a big difference.

One had the Love Torque equipped and the other did not.

Unless I'm missing the points somewhere...

[Ultimagi]

Unless I'm missing the points somewhere...

The point is, how do you know an ability is sealed? You don't until it's not been used more than 20+ times.

[tonystigma]

The point is, how do you know an ability is sealed? You don't until it's not been used more than 20+ times.

I'll get right on recording how often an ability ISN'T used.

[Uubu]

1 thing to also test/understand is it seems unreasonable to have all 15 jobs to fully lock AV, I think you may only need to to do one 2 hour to lock all of that type .. Example AV uses invincible, a Justice torque (and sword?) pld use 2 hour, and now all Justice type 2hours are locked (rdm thf and pld). Now having all 15 available would mean you can lock him up faster but you may not necessarily need all 15 at one time.

** Note this is theory speculation not tested!

[Max™]

That is a very good thing to note.

Excellent point, if he pops Chainspell or PD or Invincible and the corresponding job 2hrs with the torque on, then he follows with another 2hr which is on the corresponding weapon, that should definitely be noted, also worth noting if there is any effect if a job on the weapon 2hrs with the torque on but it isn't a matched 2hr.

AV pops PD.
Pld uses Invincible.

or

AV pops PD.
Pld uses Invincible.
AV uses Invincible.

Both are important to consider.

[Demosthenes11]

The point is, how do you know an ability is sealed? You don't until it's not been used more than 20+ times.

call wyvern is a very frequently used 2hour though. Once wynavs are killed, I've never seen AV go more than 10 min without repopping them (fought probably 10 times). My question:
was call wynav "locked" with call wynav or spirit surge?

[Maxxthepenguin]

MaxTM, did you just say the same thing that was said right before you?

Seriously.

[Max™]

No, I extrapolated a great point, and listed some notable outcomes to look for, AND added that it is worth having jobs on the corresponding Jailer weapons 2hr with torques on to see if that has any effect.

So no, I didn't just say the exact same thing, thanks for asking though.

[Ramses]

call wyvern is a very frequently used 2hour though. Once wynavs are killed, I've never seen AV go more than 10 min without repopping them (fought probably 10 times). My question:
was call wynav "locked" with call wynav or spirit surge?

SE uses call wyvern in the video when everyone 2 hours to match AV.

[TummieGaruda]

1 thing to also test/understand is it seems unreasonable to have all 15 jobs to fully lock AV, I think you may only need to to do one 2 hour to lock all of that type .. Example AV uses invincible, a Justice torque (and sword?) pld use 2 hour, and now all Justice type 2hours are locked (rdm thf and pld). Now having all 15 available would mean you can lock him up faster but you may not necessarily need all 15 at one time.

** Note this is theory speculation not tested!

This is pretty much what I was speculating a few pages back, that you have the ability to lock specific 2HRs that corresponds to that group, OR, you can only lock one of the 2HR's for that group. If it is the later, it will allow players to decide which 2HR's they want to lock out of the group, though some are pretty obvious.