A question about merit parties

[Bishop1]

My merit party is usually WAR polearm SAM polearm DRG Cor that shoots does about 1500-2000 slugshot BRD RDM.

[Spider-Dan]

Fair enough, but that means the DD needs more than 1 offensive roll to work better on the chain, instead of having Corsair's Roll.

The OP specifically asked which does the most damage, not which gains the most xp/hr. If xp/hr is the metric, every configuration without COR (including double RDM) gets smashed.

[Shinryuu]

I think it's something of a scale. Only well decked out DDs can really use a second BRD or COR to their fullest potential. If they're just scraping by off the AH, lacking haste gear, large amounts of attack, accuracy, or good food, then a one-BRD party probably does them better.

The crux of the debate probably comes on whether a COR or a second BRD. And even that might break down to the jobs you bring. Absolutely ideal in my mind would be having a DRK and a WAR for chaos and Fighter's rolls.

I completely agree. Some additions:

- When there are 1H melee in the party, COR+BRD is likely to be a bit better since hunter's roll beats madrigal and the 1H-melee will need the accuracy.
- Without a DRK, in a standard 2H-party, I prefer 2 minuets to a (weakened, no DRK) chaos, + fighter's/samurai roll.
- If the melee aren't good and have little to no haste gear (and aren't using hasso), minuet march chaos hunter's or minuet minuet march madrigal is preferable to double march
- In a really good 2H party with a good RDM and a good supportive COR/WHM or BRD/WHM, fulltime hasso x3 march march chaos fighter's (especially with a WAR and DRK) is amazing, and wipes the floor with wivre easily. Can only be done in the colibri camp, Mamool/Skoffin WS + double attack can kill you. Try to use third eye (w/o seigan) to prevent pecking flurry, it's not hard. I often make this kind of party, but only with LS members and the occasional pickup DD I know has good gear.
- Pulling: if your RDM can handle the little bit of extra damage done to the melee from the mob not having elegy on OR is on their toes to Erase the melee (if the BRD/WHM sticks elegy after pull, which Colibri will likely reflect on the melee with hate), COR is a better puller (= faster).

[Carrilei]

BRD + COR is > 2x BRD, without question.

Those who don't care about COR damage aren't being logical. I'm sure if a relic DD was able to deal 50% more damage, that'd suddenly matter to them.

[LinktheDeme]

90% of CORs don't know how to do it right though nor how to play the odds when to double up and don't have max fold and snake eye merits (which matters a shit ton with cor). When getting randoms its always easier to just get two brds imo.

[Valyana]

How do you figure that Hunter's Roll beats Madrigal? Without RNG, Hunter's Roll averages +30 acc, whereas Blade Madrigal is +31 with no +skill gear or merits, up to +39 with added skill and merits.

[Rocl]

Those who don't care about COR damage aren't being logical. I'm sure if a relic DD was able to deal 50% more damage, that'd suddenly matter to them.

I don't care whether or not somebody's doing 50% more damage or not, as long as I'm getting merits at a reasonable rate.

[Yugl]

Adding DRG/mage to the mix since MP is never an issue for cures meaning DDs can go all out without having to worry about defenses (I've had a MNK come /WAR and never had MP/curing issues). Personally I prefer DRG/mage + COR + BRD + RDM + DD + DD.

Edit: RDM for Dia/Haste.

[Thorny]

a zerked melee getting flurried at 50% hp for HB is a dead melee

[Yugl]

I tend to bring 2H melees/MNKs to melee PTs so the only zerged melees in my PT would be MNKs and WAR. MNKs, if well geared, have no problem with that scenario. So your point is WAR specific.

[LinktheDeme]

How do you figure that Hunter's Roll beats Madrigal? Without RNG, Hunter's Roll averages +30 acc, whereas Blade Madrigal is +31 with no +skill gear or merits, up to +39 with added skill and merits.

There hasn't been any concrete testing on hunter's roll whether its % based or number based since the update years ago as far as I recall just that one person tested it and got those numbers. Someone should go to promy holla/mea/dem, aqua, and sacrarium and test to see if it scales with level then should be % unless they put a hard cap on it?

[Kerberoz]

It also "beats" madrigal by affecting ranged, too.

[Ruiner]

RDM/BRD/BRD/COR/COR/DD is the only way to merit.

[Tulun]

2 or 3 is my preference. To actual DD, I don't care; as long as they are good at their job, most anything can do, and as long as I get 20k+ an hour, I'll be content.

Sincerely, competent players matter more than jobs, once you have the support.

[Spider-Dan]

How do you figure that Hunter's Roll beats Madrigal? Without RNG, Hunter's Roll averages +30 acc, whereas Blade Madrigal is +31 with no +skill gear or merits, up to +39 with added skill and merits.

If you have relic hat, Hunter's (sans RNG) averages ~ACC+34.
If you also use Snake Eye, Hunter's (sans RNG) averages ~ACC+35.9.
Both of these are, I think, a more reasonable assumption than merited Madrigal.

[Kilhart]

There hasn't been any concrete testing on hunter's roll whether its % based or number based since the update years ago as far as I recall just that one person tested it and got those numbers. Someone should go to promy holla/mea/dem, aqua, and sacrarium and test to see if it scales with level then should be % unless they put a hard cap on it?

Go to dunes as 11COR with no armor and no weapon, and throw up a XI RNG roll. Check an IT gob and then tell me that it's possible it's %-based.

[Seshat]

I've personally never done RDM merit ptys only because I go:

SMN BRD DD DD DD DD as SMN is my main. Done SMN BRD COR DD DD DD too and it ended up a bit slower since COR just wanted to use cards. 20k+ per hour with first setup for me, rarely any resting unless someone went afk. SMN/WNM w/ Elemental Siphon is good, but I'm thinking /SCH could do better. If you just want RDM info I have no idea, lol.

[Scuzzelbutt]

COR/WHMx2 BRD/NINx2 WARx2

(Get Ridill WAR's)

[kayn]

Best merit parties I've had were rdm/whm, brd/nin, cor/whutev, war/sam, sam/war, dunmatta. Usually the 6th would be a nin/war for voke bitch. Songs were 2x march or march/mad based on mobs, rolls were fighters/samuari. 2h use meat.

Basically 2x brd or brd+cor make any mele (even gimp) great DD. Great dd just turn into monsters. I'd avoid 1 brd or 1 cor pts if i could personally. What's important is that the mele are about the same because if one is way better than the rest then he ends up tanking and eventually dying. Being able to bounce hate is important.

[Isiolia]

I prefer 2x buffer. Don't like losing the typical backup /WHM of a second BRD when getting a COR, but it can depend on camp/party members. I've seen good results with BRD COR RDM DNC DD DD as well.

While I've seen 4x DD BRD RDM work, I've also seen it completely fail. To a large extent, quality of DDs is going to make or break any of the setups. Double buffer will help towards making weaker DDs effective, and tends to fail less. IMO, just tends to run smoother too if you're using blink tanking, due to double March.
However, in most cases you're still dealing with camps that have only so many mobs to kill. Nyzul Mamool, for one, are very easy to outpace with double buffers, a couple NINs and most anything else. Corsair's Roll is great there, added damage from a COR...only more likely to break chain for lack of mobs.