Sonomaa on Limit Break Radio about the Dupe Bannings

[Vedder]

ITT: Retards trying to out-retard one another.

[Charismatic]

If you're going to do something you should strive to be the greatest, amirite?
greatest retard, greatest rapist, greatest smash bros brawl player... etc

[aurik]

Hi, let's get back on topic of the LBR broadcast. I'll start!

I rather liked the idea of contests on Square's part for the best upgrades of armor graphics, since it shows some interest in the community but actually benefits them more since they can be lazy and get better graphics. They can do the same with status effect icons since they have a shit-ton of status effect icons that are just fucking terrible.

Wee! Wasn't that fun?

I hate to be a negative nancy (especially to you, Septimus, king of the negative nancies ) but this, in practice, is REALLY hard to pull off. If you were to take fan-art into the game, you run into big problems with art style inconsistency -- half the graphics look like they were made by SE, the other half by a random assortment of people?

Also, it's difficult to "just hire" those people turning out professional-grade material as hobbyist dats. For one, a lot of them probably already have jobs, if they're that good at what they are doing. You also don't know whether they are actually churning out the stuff at an acceptable rate--they might be putting in 100-hour weeks to get something that you'd expect would be 10 hours worth of work. Or maybe they're located in BFE, where you have no infrastructure to hire them.

I wish it were a lot simpler to incorporate fan-driven content in the official game, but the reality is that the significant logistical hurdles will make this kind of thing the exception rather than the rule.

[Silenka]

I hate to be a negative nancy (especially to you, Septimus, king of the negative nancies ) but this, in practice, is REALLY hard to pull off. If you were to take fan-art into the game, you run into big problems with art style inconsistency -- half the graphics look like they were made by SE, the other half by a random assortment of people?

I dunno, FFXIstyle's icons look very uniform to me and I can actually tell what the fuck is on my char. I don't think this would be much of an issue, since they can simply reject anything they think stands out too much, or re-issue a contest until they find the right style graphic, or scrap the contest altogether and do the update themselves. There are plenty of options.

Also, it's difficult to "just hire" those people turning out professional-grade material as hobbyist dats. For one, a lot of them probably already have jobs, if they're that good at what they are doing. You also don't know whether they are actually churning out the stuff at an acceptable rate--they might be putting in 100-hour weeks to get something that you'd expect would be 10 hours worth of work. Or maybe they're located in BFE, where you have no infrastructure to hire them.

SE wouldn't really need to 'hire' them, and no...a lot of people who are that good actually don't have jobs, they just do it for fun. I know many great artists personally who don't have a career in art or graphic design because it's hard as hell to get into that industry, or they see it as a hobby due to the difficulty of getting in. If SE started 'hiring' people to do such work, sure they could add to their staff, but it's clear they don't want to or they would have done it already. Contests or some sort of fan-input forum would have to be the way they go...compensation or no.

[evilpaul]

If SE did the suggested contest they could just pick the winner based on a consistency with the art style they want.

[Ziero]

And what is even worse is that there seems to be no rhyme or reason as to why some status icons get generic ones icons, or why they are even grouped the way they are.

From your example, why does enthunder get the attack icon instead of the shock spikes one? Why does shock spikes get it's own icon instead enthunder?

Even if they recycle, why not recycle less or with some more consistency.

Enthunder is a direct damage boost, as such it gets the "Attack Up" icon. Like SE, LR, Zerk, Warcry, Boost, Sa/Ta etc etc. Shock Spikes is a special defensive boots, like stoneskin, which gets it's own icon. Though not 100% accurate, it does explain most effects. However, that's still not a reason to update all of them to be more unique.

I hate to be a negative nancy (especially to you, Septimus, king of the negative nancies ) but this, in practice, is REALLY hard to pull off. If you were to take fan-art into the game, you run into big problems with art style inconsistency -- half the graphics look like they were made by SE, the other half by a random assortment of people?

Also, it's difficult to "just hire" those people turning out professional-grade material as hobbyist dats. For one, a lot of them probably already have jobs, if they're that good at what they are doing. You also don't know whether they are actually churning out the stuff at an acceptable rate--they might be putting in 100-hour weeks to get something that you'd expect would be 10 hours worth of work. Or maybe they're located in BFE, where you have no infrastructure to hire them.

I wish it were a lot simpler to incorporate fan-driven content in the official game, but the reality is that the significant logistical hurdles will make this kind of thing the exception rather than the rule.

Wait wut?

If they had a "design a .dat" contest, something many people do for sheer fun, right there you fufill the idea that was posted. SE would be the ones solely responsible for picking the winner, which more then likely would be something that meshed well with the current FFXI environment. There would be no "clash of styles" because this one chosen piece would most likely fit real well in the game.

And where did you get the idea these people were supposed to be highered by SE? A one-shot contest, or maybe even an annual deal, wouldn't be any major issue as again, people do this for fun. They don't have to higher anyone to run their art constest, why would they have to higher someone to run their Armor contest. If it was an entirely voluntary contest where SE decides which armor wins and what they'll add, then there really is no issue about "employment". I think the only real issue is whether or not there will be enough decent entires to even have a contest. Because after spending a lot of time over at FFXIdats, I can say that people can make a lot of boring/crap dats.

[ringthree]

I hate to be a negative nancy (especially to you, Septimus, king of the negative nancies ) but this, in practice, is REALLY hard to pull off. If you were to take fan-art into the game, you run into big problems with art style inconsistency -- half the graphics look like they were made by SE, the other half by a random assortment of people?

Also, it's difficult to "just hire" those people turning out professional-grade material as hobbyist dats. For one, a lot of them probably already have jobs, if they're that good at what they are doing. You also don't know whether they are actually churning out the stuff at an acceptable rate--they might be putting in 100-hour weeks to get something that you'd expect would be 10 hours worth of work. Or maybe they're located in BFE, where you have no infrastructure to hire them.

I wish it were a lot simpler to incorporate fan-driven content in the official game, but the reality is that the significant logistical hurdles will make this kind of thing the exception rather than the rule.

This is exactly why dat mods for the most part look like crap. It's not that they don't look good when they are being created, but they lack the proper shading, coloring and consistency of a professional designer.

[Sonomaa]

I will be managing a design team to update dats starting with AF after we finish the donation drive and rafflecopter

[Correction]

Begin with BRD please. Hobosuit ftl.

[ringthree]

Enthunder is a direct damage boost, as such it gets the "Attack Up" icon. Like SE, LR, Zerk, Warcry, Boost, Sa/Ta etc etc. Shock Spikes is a special defensive boots, like stoneskin, which gets it's own icon. Though not 100% accurate, it does explain most effects. However, that's still not a reason to update all of them to be more unique.

I understand the systematic reasoning behind the way they are assigned. But I think they are determined in a much more arbitrary manner when it comes to if they get unique icons or if they get generic ones. If they think something needs a new icon they just hand them out. The utsusemi icon changing for example.

[ringthree]

I will be managing a design team to update dats starting with AF after we finish the donation drive and rafflecopter

While you are at it can you get me a blow job from Christy Turlington?

[Yugl]

Begin with BRD please. Hobosuit ftl.

You mean Aurum gear right?

[evilpaul]

It's called Austere, not Aurum.

[Theenabler]

These people who were banned were people who did commit one of the most grave crimes as far as MMO's go (duping). Should certain people really receive different treatment as far as punishments go just because of who they are? I don't think so.

I also believe that SE was a lot more harsh in their undertaking of this because of the people who wound up in http://www.bluegartr.com/forum/ffxi-...ix-thread.html . Its not a secret at this point that SE does read FFXI message boards, and when they see the "highest caliber endgame players" posting stuff that wound up there, they probably took that as an insult.
"fuck SE, they wont touch us, they wont ban all their skilled players"
"orly?" *LM-17*

Little late, but my post wasn't to say that anyone didn't deserve what they got, just to state the fact that we lost alot of good minds from ffxi, and the game may or may not ever be the same, no one can really be for sure right now.

[Darwinion]

The fact of the matter is that people are still just now discovering salvage strategies that we pioneered back in 2007. Is it any wonder my faith is so low?

So fucking what? Some people are still learning PacMan patterns for the various mazes 29 years on... the game will live on without you.

[aurik]

And where did you get the idea these people were supposed to be highered by SE?

From listening to the audio stream in the OP. You should give it a listen, it's interesting for the most part.

[Kang]

First time I ever heard of Limit Break Radio. Hard to believe there's now such a big media market for stuff like this.

Guess I now have a Plan B if I can't land a reporting job during the summer in print lol.

[Pikarya]

http://imgshack.info/images/a8y8c4ymi91ivvrz13w7.jpg

If they have someone over at SE working on the retarded "Screenshot of the week" feature on their website every 7 days. I'm pretty damned sure that they can create more community-involved submissions that can benefit the game as a whole.

Whether it be .dat mod entrys or designs of new enemies, etc. Theres no point that they don't work closer with us. The customers, and fans of their product.

[orson]

Very good listen be it a long one. I definitely agree with the conclusion SE needs to reach out more to it's players and actually listen.

[Hanyoko]

Finally managed to listen to the cast. All I can say is. Lets do it

All the community site admins should get together and work on a top page news post to be put on all their sites at the same time with a snazzy title like.... "Community outreach for Square Collaboration program" or some other buzzwords that fit the bill.

Issues mentioned would include information such as "We have created special accounts for official Square employees to log in and interact with the community"

Discussion of steps taken to promote relations/direction want to go etc etc

Discussion of programs/events the site communities have brainstormed to help the game (such as topics from the Radio Cast like the High Res dat contests)


Basically, make it 100% visible to SE (and the community) that we want this. If they go with it; it will be good for the community. If they ignore it; then well.... very bad publicity.

Additionally: Elmer, you might want to consider translating a transcript of the Radio show (or at least a lot of the key points since it is really long)