2009 MLB season discussion*

[Cephius]

As for the pirates thing, I'd have to really urge the MLB to look at teams like the Pirates and Nats, and just consider consolidating them. While the Pirates have history and the Nats don't, the Nats seem to be making the right moves to maybe, in the future become a contender. But that's no guarantee. Small market teams like the Pirates don't have the money, or the exposure to keep good players on their roster and it looks more and more like they need to just find away to balance some of these divisions. It's all great to want to have a certain amount of teams per division but when you have teams like the Pirates and the Nats, you gotta consider what's better for the franchises, the players and most of all the fans.

First of all, whether you consider the Nats as the former Expos or the former Senators, they certainly do have a history.

Secondly, the MLB can't dictate how teams choose to run their franchises. The Pirates have a dreadful front office that seems intent on shipping off any talent they have and building a low budget, young, high talent team ala the Rays. Bud can't "combine" teams where he sees fit. As for the Nats, they have a decently bright future. And they were actually a decent team for awhile back in 06 (I think it was 06. 05? Somewhere around there).

There are always teams who are run poorly or questionably. The Royals were basically a farm system for the Yankees for years back in the 50s and 60s. They turned it around eventually. Just the way baseball is sometimes.

[*Shinzon*]

First of all, whether you consider the Nats as the former Expos or the former Senators, they certainly do have a history.

Secondly, the MLB can't dictate how teams choose to run their franchises. The Pirates have a dreadful front office that seems intent on shipping off any talent they have and building a low budget, young, high talent team ala the Rays. Bud can't "combine" teams where he sees fit. As for the Nats, they have a decently bright future. And they were actually a decent team for awhile back in 06 (I think it was 06. 05? Somewhere around there).

There are always teams who are run poorly or questionably. The Royals were basically a farm system for the Yankees for years back in the 50s and 60s. They turned it around eventually. Just the way baseball is sometimes.

I understand that, and I didn't mean that the Nat's franchise has no history at all. But the goal of these expansion teams, was designed by the league to increase the amount of teams per division to create better competition within the division. Up to this point teams like the Nats continue to pose no threat at all. The point of moving the Franchise was to change or reconstruct the Franchise which so far they are doing but it'll take some time before you see any real effects of that and thats what I meant by not having a history just yet.

As far as what I expect the league to do, I fully understand that the league cannot dictate the way a franchise is run because it's not their team. But at this point couldn't you consider it feasible for the league to sit teams like these two together and discuss the possibility of consolidating or merging the franchises to improve the quality of baseball that teams play? I was merely suggesting that something has to be done because it's sad to see one franchise run itself into the ground and another struggle to get by even though they are truly trying to build a quality franchise.

[Brill Weave]

In the Pirates defense, if they sweep the lolCubs this weekend, then the Pirates would pass the Cubs in the standings and could possibly be behind first place by ~4-5 games. Imagine what it'd be like without the butchered offense?

No. I'm sorry Aki. There is no defense for the Pirates. We're talking about a team with almost two decades of complete and total futility here. The Cubs have at least been respectable some years since the Pirates started the horrid streak of losing seasons. They trade away all of their good players for marginal washed up prospects who were once thought to be can't miss(Hai2u JR House, John Van Benschoten, Lastings Milledge, and Ian Snell) or for an aging once good veteran(Derek Bell and operation shutdown, look it up lol.)

There is no defending them. Ever. The Pirates ownership is in a perpetual changing mode. Ever few years someone buys the team and proclaims that they will make the team competitive again. Yet they realize they can field a woefully subpar product and still make a fuckload of money so why should they spend their profits?

Fuck the Pittsburgh Pirates. Retract them. Or blow the fucking stadium up so it can made into a parking lot for the Steelers and Penguins. The only Pittsburgh teams that actually care about winning.

[archibaldcrane]

No. I'm sorry Aki. There is no defense for the Pirates. We're talking about a team with almost two decades of complete and total futility here.

Well, think of it this way - from 1983 until 2007, the Brewers had 0 playoff appearances. We get a new owner, spend a little more money, build some good farm talent, draft well, and now we have what we have.

I don't know much about the Pirates owners, but you can go from futile to successful within a few years with the right people in place.

[Ensam]

Yeah I don't understand the Pirate hate. They've made good moves. Burnett is a shitty reliever and Hanrahan is above average, Nyger Morgan is a 29 year old 4th out fielder and Milledge is a 24 year old who is at worst Nyger Morgan with the potential for a lot more.

In the Jason Bay trade they got one of the best 3b specs in LaRoche, Morris is a good arm.

Nady is just an average OFer and Tabata is still just 20 years old in AA.

The only trade I'd complain about is the McClouth trade.

And for all the "they just keep trading away guys on their team" well, how good has this team been? Wouldn't the smart thing be to blow this team up? I really don't understand pirates fan complaining about them blowing the team up. How do you fix a shitty team? Get rid of the players and build a new team.

The Pirates sucked as bad as they have because the previous front offices couldn't draft worth shit (seriously, looking at their first round picks for the past, oh, two decades). Hunnington is solid and has done a good job as the GM there so far.

[Ensam]

Anddd 9-0 against the nationals now on the season
25-3 going back to last year

I love the nats <3

1 game back of first

GO BRAVES plzzzzzz

[Viq]

Sox may be repaying the Orioles for last night. O's had a 5-1 lead going into the 9th. Fastforward through a Youk 2-run bomb, some walks, and a Rocco Baldelli single, and the game is tied 5-5 with the bases loaded. Currently a pitching change as their closer, George Sherrill, is getting the hook.

[Absolutely Virtue]

To compare the Nats and the Pirates is pretty silly. The Nats are in rebuilding mode, recovering from being whored by MLB when the league owned the team. Look up some of the players who used to play for this franchise before the other owners stole them away. Now, I'll grant you the current owners (Ted Lerner, the greedy fucker), have shit the bed when it comes to rebuilding. But hell, at least we're trying to hold on to our good players.

The Pirates seem content to simply sell off everyone. There is good money to be made in keeping payroll low and living off revenue sharing.

I could name two dozen things I hate about the Nats, but I wouldn't even consider trading this franchise for the Pirates and their ownership group and their (lack of) frontrunning fans.

(PS- this is not a cheapshot at Brill, he is OG Pittsburgh)

[Viq]

Top of the 11th, Sox took a 6-5 lead! Go Go Gadget Bullpen Implosions.

[Akiyama]

Grats to the BoSox on that awesome comeback. Payback's a bitch against the O's I guess.

Braves up 8-1 on the Phillies right now. Cole Hamels didn't look good at all.

[Reality]

Gordon Beckham is on fire, 2-3 tonight with an RBI double, and a single
Last night, 3-4, 2 RBI's, 2 runs scored, 1 HR
2 nights ago, 3-3, 2 RBI's, a walk

So far vs. the LOLIndians, he's 8 for 10, 1 HR, 5 RBI's

This kid has stud written all over him, and his lego hair.

[Trichocyst]

Phillies look absolutely awful again tonight.

[Cephius]

Phillies look absolutely awful again tonight.

Seems like they want to keep the Mets around so they can pass them again in September, lol.

Though I think even the Phillies starters can shut out the offense the Mets put out there these days

[Bregor]

If a tree falls in the forest, and the Nats and Pirates trade toosly, underperforming outfielders, does anyone care?

Bracing for Marmol/Gregg blown hold/save, it just feels like one of those games.

And I'm still lol'ing at the Papelbon YOU MAD pic, does anyone have something similar from his riverdancing days? Why must all closers be fucking lunatics...

[Weeks]

In defense of the Pirates, I get what they're doing. They've finally given up on the idea that they can build a respectable ballclub by signing a 1-2 win veteran every offseason to complement their core of 2-3 average players and a bunch of crap. In order for them to ever make a real run, they either need to find an owner willing to throw away tens of millions of dollars every year to try to build a following in a tiny market that has never been a baseball-first town, or they need to get a lot of really good pre-arbitration talent coming up together to try to pull a D-Rays on the league.

They're obviously going for the latter approach. Unfortunately, it seems like they're letting a copy of the 2007 Baseball America almanac that they found in a men's room do their work for them, because instead of picking up that really good talent they keep trading for busted former prospects whose teams have given up on them.

[Akiyama]

With the way the Phillies and Mets are playing, they want both Florida and Atlanta to hang in there, though I think Atlanta will probably fizzle in the first month after the All-Star break.

[Soa]

Its official, we are the Braves bitches this year. There always seems to be one NL East team that kills us (usually the Marlins) and looks like we have a new winner.

[Akiyama]

I dunno. Since 2005, this is the first time the Braves have won back to back games against the Phillies in Atlanta, so I'd say Atlanta's been Phily's bitches for a little while. It's nice to be on the winning side against the Phils this year, though. Who's pitching tomorrow? Happ?

[Cephius]

Atlanta really didn't look terrible when I saw them play the Yanks. They play a clean game, and just happened to catch the Yankees when their offense decided to heat up (which I predicted, by the way!) and also happened to catch Lowe throw a stinker. Braves have some speed, and power in Chipper and McCann. If they can develop some of their pitching prospects late this year or next year, I could see them putting up a fight against the Mets/Phillies.

[Akiyama]

Atlanta has no speed. Sure they've stolen a few bases as of late since McLouth came over (and he's been hurt for about three or four games now), but it hasn't been a season full of speed. Blanco and Prado are just playing really well right now. They aren't world beaters, and when McCann is near the top in steals for the team, you know it's bad. Atlanta having power is also a joke considering McCann has I think.. 8 homers? Chipper may have 9, I'm not sure, and McLouth is the leader there as well with 12, and he's missed a few games.

The thing with the Braves right now is they are playing a cleaner game and their pitching keeps them in it. Vazquez is pitching way better than I thought he would. Jurrjens is pitching well, but he just doesn't get run support. Lowe had three straight starts where he did bad, but finally rebounded. Kawakami's been a pleasant surprise even if he got hurt in his past start. I hope he's alright. Then there's Tommy Hanson who's an impressive 4-0. I'm hoping the league doesn't catch up to his pitching, but I'm sure he'll get shelled sometime.

The Braves really need a sweep in this series and the next to get back above .500, but I'm sure they'll lose to Happ tomorrow, and then proceed to drop 2 of 3 against the Nats to start their road trip, and then lose the Cubs/Rockies series. That's just the way it's gone for them the last few years.

Anyway.. as far as competing, I think they need one more bat, and for McLouth to be healthy before they can legitly compete. If their pitching staff wasn't as good as it is, and it is one of the top staffs in the NL, then I think they could be ~10 games back right now due to their offense being putrid.