2009 MLB season discussion*

[Ensam]

Hi, follow up on the Pittsburgh Pirates before tossing your comments out there. The Pirates are approaching 17 years of consecutive losing. That 17 years of not even cracking .500 ball. Do some research and take a look at all the of the players who were here then traded away year in and year out. Aramis Ramirez and Jason Bay are two of them just to start. Here in Pittsburgh we have been forcefed lines about how all players will be held accountable for years. Literally, YEARS. We're not talking two or three years dood, we're talking 16 years.

This isn't a new approach for the Pirates. This is a yearly occurance. And I have news for you, if the prospects they end up getting turn out to be decent, they'll be traded within two years of their break out seasons. The Pirates have no interest in winning. As to the whole comment about knowing a guy's face, apparently you failed to read the part about them contributing. Learn what you're talking about then come back and if you feel like defending the Pirates moves then we'll talk. Until then, stay in the dark and make idiotic statements to someone who lives in Pittsburgh and experiences what the Pirates do year in and year out.

Would you cheer for your team as hard if you didn't know a single player on it? Would you cheer your team as hard if you watched them trade away the only players that contribute? Multiply that feeling by sixteen.

And was Neal Hunnington at the helm for those 16 years?

He's a smart guy and he's putting together his team. I don't see how you can blame him for the absolute incompetance of Littlefield and Bonifay

Fact remains the current Pirates team sucked. Hunnington's job is clean up Littlefield's mess. That means building a farm system that Littlefield never did. The ML team sucks, the MILB system is weak. What can you do? Either keep a shitty ML team and wait draft after draft for the MILB system to work itself out or you trade what good you have on the ML team to put stuff into the MILB system.

You're crying and crying about losing: this is the only way for a small market team to get better. So you'd much rather just keep having the losing team over and over again? Why? It makes no sense at all.

and fyi I'm a marlins fan. You crying about trading Bay, you crying about trading Aramis? How about trading HOF talent in Kevin Brown, HOF talent in Garry Sheffield, HOF talent in Miguel Cabrera. Yeah, keep crying about trading some 850 OPS bats.

You're crying about having to root for new players? Yeah, I have no idea what that's like holmes.

Know what the difference is between the Marlins and the Pirates? The marlins had Dombrowski and now Beinfest at the helm. The Pirates only now have a competent GM. So you'll cry and cry and cry now and in a few years when the Pirates are actually relevant you'll forget crying and crying and crying. Be glad you have Hunnington and that he's making his team.

[Brill Weave]

I don't think there's any way Griffey took them. If you compare his shape from when he joined the league to now, he didn't change that much. He was a really really young kid when he came into the league so he hadn't fully grown into his own body. Thome I'm not sure about. This is just one of the many reasons I've stopped caring about baseball. All I can say is at least in hockey we don't see this kind of shit. I think there's been one player suspended for a banned substance. He got 50 games for having amphetamines in his system.

[Vedder]

More shocking than Big Papi being on 'roids is the fact that there is actually serious Pirates discussion going on here.

[Dimmauk]

I'm a Royals fan btw. Throwing that out there because it's only a matter of time before I'm accused of being a Yank.

can't help you this time.

My Little Sister was going out with the Grandson of the Owner of the Royals.

Why hasnt the entire list been posted yet? Just get this shit over with already.

[Brill Weave]

Please dood seriously. If you want to compare the plight of the Florida Marlins to the plight of the Pirates you're a fucking idiot. Once again, learn what you're talking about. Check out some old press clippings about the Pirates right when spring training begins. See how many of these articles read the same exact way. That's fine, you're a Marlins fan, more power to you. Wow you guys have lost a few good players along the way? Give me a break, you're talking about a team that's fifteen years old with two World Series titles spread out in those years. I weep for you.

And for the record, just to set it straight so you don't get it twisted. I am not a fan of the Pirates. I was a fan back in the early nineties. Hell I was even a fan back they claimed in five years the Pirates would be competitive again after the new stadium was built. After 16 losing seasons, I'm done. I will not contribute to the Pirates as they do nothing to reward their fans. Should the Pirates begin winning again, I won't give a fuck. I still won't watch. But until MLB steps in and attempts to fix the problem or retracts the team, it doesn't matter anyways. For me it's more about commenting on the fact that the Pirates management and ownership express incredulity when their comments about turning the page are met with laughter and negativity.

Because we've heard the same thing for sixteen years. Something you can't say you've gone through now can you?

[Stiker]

Try being a Rangers fan.

We have one playoff win...ever.

[pohibaba]

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...aba/pujols.jpg

Pictures like this were able to convict Bonds in the eyes of the public; should Albert be treated any different?

[Cephius]

Ortiz hits a 3 run bomb, and the "you did steroids" crowd gives him a curtain call and a standing ovation. The hypocrisy of Red Sox fans never ceases to amaze.

[Dimmauk]

Ortiz hits a 3 run bomb, and the "you did steroids" crowd gives him a curtain call and a standing ovation. The hypocrisy of Red Sox fans never ceases to amaze.

All fans of any sport are like that. Dont act like Yankee fans are any better.

[Stiker]

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...aba/pujols.jpg

Pictures like this were able to convict Bonds in the eyes of the public; should Albert be treated any different?

I'm not going to lie, I'm waiting for it.

Ortiz hits a 3 run bomb, and the "you did steroids" crowd gives him a curtain call and a standing ovation. The hypocrisy of Red Sox fans never ceases to amaze.

Like Dimm said, don't be chucking stone in that glass house. It isn't like Yankee fans have sat on their hands when A-Rod hits HR.

[Cephius]

All fans of any sport are like that. Dont act like Yankee fans are any better.

The Yankee fans boo A-rod every chance they get. Don't compare Yankee fans to Red Sox fans in this regard, we always knew that the Red Sox players were just as guilty as the Yankees were in regards to using steroids, but they endlessly - and I do mean ENDLESSLY - bashed the Yankees for their "tainted" championships and for the whole A-rod thing. Well, the shoe is on the other foot now.

[Stiker]

Do you boo Pettitte every chance you get too?

[Cephius]

Oh god, now YOU are sounding like a Red Sox fan.

Pettite used HGH once in 2002 while trying to recover from an injury. He's never been linked to anything before or since, and one dosage of HGH isn't enough to help your performance.

Regardless, the point remains that Red Sox fans (aided by the now obviously-biased Mitchell Report) chose to flex their ignorance and act like their team was clean and it was only the Yankee players who did steroids. Every single game and chance they got, they reminded A-rod and Yankee fans of steroid users. And now that one of their own has been linked to it... well it doesn't matter, everyone did it! Please.

[Stiker]

Dude, calm down. All I'm saying is that the Yankee fans do the same shit too, that's it. Like Dimm said, all sports fans do it. The Yankees fans have not been calling for their players' heads that have been linked to the juice.

Fuck, Rangers fans did it too when Sosa hit his 500th HR. Granted, that was before any testing/Mitchell Report was ever out, but everyone knew he was juiced and still applauded him.

And how is the Mitchell Report biased? I have no idea where that came from.

[pohibaba]

And how is the Mitchell Report biased? I have no idea where that came from.

Senator Mitchell used to work for the Red Sox, hence why there wasn't a single Red Sox player on it. And if you guys want to talk hypocrisy, just look at Dodger fans, they gave us Giants fans shit forever because of Bonds, but now they're cheering Banny like he's the second coming of Jesus. Oh well.

[Stiker]

Senator Mitchell used to work for the Red Sox, hence why there wasn't a single Red Sox player on it.

Well that would indeed make sense.

Honestly, at this point, MLB needs to get it over with. Release the whole fucking list so we can move on.

[Cephius]

Dude, calm down. All I'm saying is that the Yankee fans do the same shit too, that's it. Like Dimm said, all sports fans do it. The Yankees fans have not been calling for their players' heads that have been linked to the juice.

Fuck, Rangers fans did it too when Sosa hit his 500th HR. Granted, that was before any testing/Mitchell Report was ever out, but everyone knew he was juiced and still applauded him.

And how is the Mitchell Report biased? I have no idea where that came from.

Look, I don't blame you for not being familiar with the NY media and NYY fans, but more than a few people wanted A-rod gone BEFORE he was ever linked to steroids. That cult grew 10 fold after he admitted to using it. And the fact is, if he was linked to roids before signing his new contract, he's not playing for the Yankees right now.

As for the Mitchell Report, it was suspicious for a number of reasons. First of all, out of all the players, not one significant former or current Red Sox player was mentioned on it, yet every other team had at least one person on it and the Yankees were by far the most. Second, Senator Mitchell serves on the Red Sox board of directors and was sighted at Fenway during the investigation getting the autographs of Red Sox players. None of these things are illegal, but they sure do suggest corruption especially now. Even Peter Abraham, a respected NY writer, wrote today:

Virtually every organization is tainted. But at least this latest report balances out the comical slant of the Mitchell Report.

So I'm just sayin.

[Stiker]

Look, I don't blame you for not being familiar with the NY media and NYY fans, but more than a few people wanted A-rod gone BEFORE he was ever linked to steroids. That cult grew 10 fold after he admitted to using it. And the fact is, if he was linked to roids before signing his new contract, he's not playing for the Yankees right now.

Oh that I do know. It was a great laugh for Rangers fans to see A-Rod get roasted regularly for being failed clutch in October and things like his Madonna drama among other off field exploits. While I'm sure the cult has grown, I was shocked to see him even get the slightest bit of gratitude upon his return this year.

I completely forgot about the Mitchell Report having no Red Sox (unless you count Clemens maybe). Guess that's what happens when you are away from the NY/BOS thing on a regular basis.

[Trichocyst]

I can only think of like three Phillies players linked to PED (though I'd probably believe there were a few guys on the 93 team and plenty beyond who were doping). Dykstra (shock the world), Todd Pratt, and David Bell. Fat lot of good it did for the latter two. That's why it would break my heart to hear Thome did it. Since there hadn't been much to root for on the Phillies between 1993 and 2007 it would be a real shame to know one of the only bright spots wasn't on the level.

[Viq]

The moral of the story is what everyone has known for a long time: Our steroid guys > your steroid guys.