2009 MLB season discussion*

[Ensam]

No they won't they have to pay for CC Sabatha, and Texeria no way in hell prices are ever coming down now. How much did they Yanks spend this year? Half a billion? What's next the New York Yankees getting a bailout?

Edit: My bad I forgot about AJ Burnett, for all three they spent 423.5 million dollars plus 1.5 billion for the new Yankee Stadium those prices are never, ever coming down.

They're one of the most profitable franchises year in and year out even with a 200m payroll. Oh, and their payroll is actually down from last year. The prices are high not because they need money but because of the perceived perception of supply and demand of NEW YANKEE STADIUM. Since the demand hasn't showed up, prices will likely drop.

I really don't understand baseball fans. They hate on the Yankees for spending money that's there. They hate on the Marlins for not spending money that's there. So which exactly do you want owners to do, spend money or not spend money?

[fren.]

No they won't they have to pay for CC Sabatha, and Texeria no way in hell prices are ever coming down now. How much did they Yanks spend this year? Half a billion? What's next the New York Yankees getting a bailout?

Edit: My bad I forgot about AJ Burnett, for all three they spent 423.5 million dollars plus 1.5 billion for the new Yankee Stadium those prices are never, ever coming down.

Makes you wonder how they paid for the salaries of Clemens, Giambi, ARod, and Jeter. They'll come down, no one is paying $2,000 for a regular season game against the Orioles/Mariners. They'll dump about $25+ million this offseason.

[Heian]

They're one of the most profitable franchises year in and year out even with a 200m payroll. Oh, and their payroll is actually down from last year. The prices are high not because they need money but because of the perceived perception of supply and demand of NEW YANKEE STADIUM. Since the demand hasn't showed up, prices will likely drop.

I really don't understand baseball fans. They hate on the Yankees for spending money that's there. They hate on the Marlins for not spending money that's there. So which exactly do you want owners to do, spend money or not spend money?

It's not about how much they spend because at points the Red Sox have not been much better. I think the problem a lot of people have with the Yankees is that they buy a bunch of stars that artificially inflate the contract prices for other teams where you have teams like the Marlins who can not even begin to consider looking at a star player like Manny, Texeria, Sabathia, etc because there are teams out there who are going to pay more than 20 million a year for 5~10 years at a whack.

The Yankees have no real farm system, they prefer to buy players instead of building a team. You can see this now, several players are injured and they are going to be fucked because they have no money to buy up free agents, and no one is going to be able to trade for many of these players due to their price or the attitudes they gained while playing for the Yankees. There are many teams who just simply do not want that drama. The Yankees always have this air of elitism that is not very welcome by baseball fans (with the exception of Yankees fans). The way they go about acquiring players is ruining the game and that is the problem people have with it.

[Saga]

Beckett got 5 games suspension. Basically Theo and Francona told him to drop the appeal, as they didn't feel they'd get any lower than five games as he'd pretty much have to miss a start. Would've started Friday but Lester will start instead.

Edit: And actually Heian, I'd argue there's some sense of elitism among Red Sox fans, but only with the fairweather fans. Though those don't really count as much as the diehard fans so I guess you're right.

[Ferien]

They're one of the most profitable franchises year in and year out even with a 200m payroll. Oh, and their payroll is actually down from last year. The prices are high not because they need money but because of the perceived perception of supply and demand of NEW YANKEE STADIUM. Since the demand hasn't showed up, prices will likely drop.

I really don't understand baseball fans. They hate on the Yankees for spending money that's there. They hate on the Marlins for not spending money that's there. So which exactly do you want owners to do, spend money or not spend money?

This. The Yankees spend the money because they can. Both the Yankees and the Red Sox operate at a small loss, compared to teams like the Marlins who take in all the money they can from revenue sharing and just pump it into the corporation instead of putting it back into the team.

These teams have national recognition not only because they've been around for over 100 years apiece, but because they invest right back into the team to keep themselves on top. Look at the Mets, or even the fucking Rays, who have none of the glitz and glamor of the Yanks or Sox, but they spend the money they make and as a result do well and see an increase in revenue year after year, spending that extra money on better players so that they can do even better in the coming years. The Marlins on the other hand get young players, pick up free agents on the cheap, and dump them at the end of the year to turn a profit. I don't see this hot streak they're on continuing for long, but we'll see how it goes, maybe I'll be wrong.

Also, the stadium was mostly funded with grants and low/no-interest loans from the city (different story altogether, esp since the city's going broke and probably going to raise my taxes). Besides that, the Yankees' parent corporation pull in more money from the YES network than they do the actual team, so it's really not that huge a deal.

[Ensam]

It's not about how much they spend because at points the Red Sox have not been much better. I think the problem a lot of people have with the Yankees is that they buy a bunch of stars that artificially inflate the contract prices for other teams where you have teams like the Marlins who can not even begin to consider looking at a star player like Manny, Texeria, Sabathia, etc because there are teams out there who are going to pay more than 20 million a year for 5~10 years at a whack.

The Yankees have no real farm system, they prefer to buy players instead of building a team. You can see this now, several players are injured and they are going to be fucked because they have no money to buy up free agents, and no one is going to be able to trade for many of these players due to their price or the attitudes they gained while playing for the Yankees. There are many teams who just simply do not want that drama. The Yankees always have this air of elitism that is not very welcome by baseball fans (with the exception of Yankees fans). The way they go about acquiring players is ruining the game and that is the problem people have with it.

Fair enough, but, I don't think that's actually a problem, though. With how the baseball financial system is set up, you do not need to buy big time free agents to field a good team. There is a HUGE amount of parity in the game. Plus then considering revenue sharing that then helps small market teams.

The Yankees have also had a solid system the past several years. The erasing of prospect status of Phillip (I love me some Phillip), Kennedy, and Joba helped kill their current farm rating status.

The Yankees spend the money because they can. Both the Yankees and the Red Sox operate at a small loss, compared to teams like the Marlins who take in all the money they can from revenue sharing and just pump it into the corporation instead of putting it back into the team.

These teams have national recognition not only because they've been around for over 100 years apiece, but because they invest right back into the team to keep themselves on top. Look at the Mets, or even the fucking Rays, who have none of the glitz and glamor of the Yanks or Sox, but they spend the money they make and as a result do well and see an increase in revenue year after year, spending that extra money on better players so that they can do even better in the coming years. The Marlins on the other hand get young players, pick up free agents on the cheap, and dump them at the end of the year to turn a profit. I don't see this hot streak they're on continuing for long, but we'll see how it goes, maybe I'll be wrong.

I hate to do this again and you guys are probably me tired of doing this haha

But the Marlins are not pocketing money, they are saving it.

Using an example like you did, the Rays. Part of the reason their payroll is up so much is because they saved up money. However, they also expect to operate at a net loss this season.

See Marlins 2005. They realized that with the core they had, 2005 was the last chance they would have to compete. They signed Carlos Delgado and expected to operate at a net loss for that season. After the season, they broke up the core to get a new core. The reason payroll has been so small is because of how the baseball financial system works. They are opperating at a huge net gain, but it's not going into the owners pockets, it's going to long term deals like they recently gave Hanley Ramirez. Any player they've traded since '06 is not because they didn't want to pay them, but because either they didn't fit into the plan or because they just plain weren't worth the cost they'd make in arbitration (See: Mike Jacobs making over 3 mil when he is a very bad player). The only player traded that doesn't fit the mold is Miguel Cabrera, but that doens't have to do with being cheap, that has to do with having Hanley Ramirez and being a small market team. Plain and simple, no small market team can keep two players of Hanley's and Miguel's talent with what they would be making in arbitration, we're talking about 60% of the payroll going to two players. They had to choose one out of Hanley and Cabrera, they chose Hanley, and it was the right move seeing as Hanley is one of if not the most valuable player in the game.

The payroll will likely still be in the 40 mil range until the stadium opens. When the stadium opens, the payroll projects to be more around the 60m range where most small-to-mid market teams are.

I mean, the Tampa Bay owner has basically come out and said that he would not be able to afford his team if there is a salary floor, that anything over a 50m payroll means a net operating loss for him. Everybody loves to point right to the Marlins but small market teams just are not very profitable and if you have to manage your rosters smart if you want to compete, like the Marlins have been doing.

[pohibaba]

Honest question: How many of the current Yankee players were drafted by the Yankees and brought through their farm system and are now in the majors?

[Headspace]

Obscure Houston pitcher has 6 Ks through 3 innings.

My plan is working.

[Ensam]

Honest question: How many of the current Yankee players were drafted by the Yankees and brought through their farm system and are now in the majors?

I remember a couple years ago, I believe '07, it was more than the Red Soxs.

Going down the list, fren can correct me if I miss somebody

Jorge Posada
Derek Jeter
Robinson Cano
Ramiro Pena
Melky Cabrera
Brett Gardner
Joba
Phil Coke
Andy Pettitte
Mo
Wang
Edwar Ramirez (Signed by Angels, but came up through Yankees system)
Anthony Claggett (Drafted by tigers, but came up through their farm system)

Pretty good amount, although the only young (good) starter is Cano, position wise. Most of the stuff is old, bench material, or low-bullpen guys. Real good young arms SP wise though. Wang, Joba, Hughes, Kennedy...good stuff.

[Ferien]

Honest question: How many of the current Yankee players were drafted by the Yankees and brought through their farm system and are now in the majors?

Jorge Posada, Derek Jeter, Mariano Rivera, Andy Pettite, Robinson Cano, Joba Chamberlain, Brett Gardner, Phil Coke, Ramiro Pena, Melky Cabrera. 10.

Edit: beaten (and missed a few of the obvious ones...I actually watched Melky and Cano play for the SI Yankees). Not counting Wang or the guys drafted by other teams.

[Reality]

sup Matt Garza

7-0 good guys

[Ferien]

Hip Hip Jorge!

[Ensam]

I love Brad Hand

6.1 IP, 12 Ks.
9 walks, 6 wild pitches

haha

[pohibaba]

Crazy homerun drama in the Yankees/Indians game. The umps got it wrong even after watching 5 minutes of replays.

[Reality]

#7 for Quentinnnnnnn

Ball was killed

[Ferien]

Crazy homerun drama in the Yankees/Indians game. The umps got it wrong even after watching 5 minutes of replays.

No way. Not only did Garko miss it, but it would have slugged one of the fans in the chest had the other guy not brushed it.

[pohibaba]

No way. Not only did Garko miss it, but it would have slugged one of the fans in the chest had the other guy not brushed it.

The OF was Crowe, wasn't it? Anyway, the fan's glove was over the wall, automatic out.

[Ensam]

3rd strait game we tie the game on a HR in the 8th inning or later

I feel so bad for the Nats sometimes lol

[Ferien]

My bad, it was Crowe. Regardless, was already over the wall before the fan touched it.

[Ensam]

3rd strait game we tie the game on a HR in the 8th inning or later

I feel so bad for the Nats sometimes lol

Nationals take 1 run lead in bottom of the 8th off an error.

Marlins score 4 in the top of the 9th.

Nationals have led every single game in this series going into the 9th inning and get swept lol